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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2010 11:49:08 GMT 1
Stop being so stubborn and thick Great Britain is a Kingdom and is a country still! Until scotland, Wales and England gain and officially declare independance for themselves then Great Britain it will be and thats a fact. What about Cornwall, Wessex, Mercia, Northumbria, East Anglia where does it end, the truth is Wales and Scotland have no more right than these places to be independant from the United Kingdom. In that case I'm Merican! Faced with all evidence to the contrary, who is being stubborn when you refuse to accept that England etc are countries. My nationality is English not British or Great British or United Kingdomish.
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Post by onthetrain92 on Aug 10, 2010 12:07:38 GMT 1
Apply for a passport and write English as your nationality and it gets returned. England is a country i never said it wasn't, but its a country within a country (same goes for Wales and Scotland) thats is Great Britain which is united with another country which is Northern Ireland. Hence The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Its not called The United Kingdom of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland and until that happens we are Great Britain and thats why we muct write British on our passport.
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on Aug 10, 2010 12:36:47 GMT 1
Nonsense thread.
Cardiff have been in the football league for 30 years longer than us.
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Post by stfcfan87 on Aug 10, 2010 12:43:31 GMT 1
How exactley will that happen ? I would propose this: - Take out one team from the relegation to League One and one team from promotion to The Championship for one season only. - That would mean in League One, one team goes up automatically and one via the play offs (like the BSP). - Just two teams get relegated from The Championship. So as a Shrewsbury and Cardiff fan you'd be happy to see two teams automatically entered into the championship who haven't earned the right or have any links with england purely on the basis that they have a lot of supporters? brilliant. let's just forget the football and have bradford automatically promoted this season as they get far bigger gates than anyone in our league.
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Post by neilsalop on Aug 10, 2010 13:01:43 GMT 1
Apply for a passport and write English as your nationality and it gets returned. England is a country i never said it wasn't, but its a country within a country (same goes for Wales and Scotland) thats is Great Britain which is united with another country which is Northern Ireland. Hence The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Its not called The United Kingdom of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland and until that happens we are Great Britain and thats why we muct write British on our passport. I'm not going to get involved in your argument, but if you ask 100 people in England their nationality a decent %age would say British, as opposed to English. If you were to ask the same question in Scotland or Wales the predominate answer would not be British, but either Scottish or Welsh. The majority of Scots and Welsh consider themselves British only after their own nationality. I consider myself English and if I could have an English passport I would, but unfortunately I'm stuck with the British one for the time being. On a side argument the Scots and Welsh need England a lot more than we need them. Scotland especially gets a decent wedge from the UK taxpayer and the majority of those taxpayers live in England and subsidise the free higher education that Scotland gives to its own students, among other benefits that the Scots and Welsh get that we in England don't get. Please don't make me get on my hobby horse on this.
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Post by onthetrain92 on Aug 10, 2010 13:03:00 GMT 1
This thread is utter *, when Cardiff City and for that matter other clubs that played in England from Wales Aberdare, Merthyr Town, Lovells, Knighton Town, Rhyl, Newtown, Bangor Presteigne Colts etc The list could go on. who cares. The bottom line is at the time they played or joined the English league system. Wales and England both shared the same flag, I don't think Wales flag was even recognised or created until the 1959. There wasn't this hate that there is now which as been created by our own governments and media stirring up s**t and making a bigger divide. People in wales would have been happy to see England beat the rest or the world, this still lives on in the game of cricket.
I can also officially state in 1990 I bought a T shirt from Cardiff with a British Bulldog on holding the world cup up on saying Brits on the p**s Italia 90 written on it. I doubt very much anything like this was available to buy anywhere in Cardiff during this last world cup, yet these t shirts were in every sport shop i went into in 1990 during my trip visit to Cardiff with the scout group i was in.
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Aug 10, 2010 14:02:57 GMT 1
People in wales would have been happy to see England beat the rest or the world, this still lives on in the game of cricket. As in the team that represents the ECB? The English and Wales Cricket Board? Yes, I suspect they do... Surely it’s all down to Longshacks as to why we now have the Welsh teams playing in England int it? It’s all his fault, him and his mate Norman?
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Post by onthetrain92 on Aug 10, 2010 14:05:38 GMT 1
People in wales would have been happy to see England beat the rest or the world, this still lives on in the game of cricket. As in the team that represents the ECB? The English and Wales Cricket Board? Yes, I suspect they do... Exactly my point
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Aug 10, 2010 14:17:16 GMT 1
As in the team that represents the ECB? The English and Wales Cricket Board? Yes, I suspect they do... Exactly my point But that doesn't though does it. The Welsh are clearly going to support a side that represents them as well as England even to this day...as they showed when we played cricket in Cardiff. Maybe I've missed your point...
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Post by blum on Aug 10, 2010 14:19:04 GMT 1
As in the team that represents the ECB? The English and Wales Cricket Board? Yes, I suspect they do... Exactly my point Not the same, different rules completely. In CLUB football you are entitled to have as many jonny foreginers as you want, in international football you arent.. oh, except in cricket!! How many Kiwi's, Aussies, South Africans & Irish play in the England cricket team or have done so in recent history? Lots of them have. Glamorgan win a cricket tournament and they dont get to play in Europe representing either and English or Welsh league. Cardiff / Swansea / Wrexham, Newport etc. can represent the ENGLISH FA in Europe but still have a Welsh anthem played...
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Post by onthetrain92 on Aug 10, 2010 14:44:09 GMT 1
Look its history more than anything here we should be looking at, Wales was merged with Mercia, Wessex etc to make England in 927. 1535 to 1542 Wales was given permission by Henry VIII for the laws in wales acts. 1997 It gets its assembly, maybe that is when we should have booted Cardiff and Swansea out or maybe in 1992 when it got its League of Wales. However they obviously love us to much and want to be in the english league and still see Wales as principality of Great Britain rather than its own country. The truth is they are still here it doesn't bother me so much but i see peoples point of view.
I cross the border regulary as i have lived and have family both sides the border, I have never needed a passport because I was born in Shrewsbury and as its states on my passport i am British. I'm not English or Welsh, I am British becuase my country tells me i am. Until i get told by somebody with governament authority any different we are all British and thats the bottom line. I couldn't give a damn about football, rugby or cricket as they are individual sports. The biggest sporting event of all is the Olympics and i don't see England, Wales, Scotland or even Northern Ireland getting mentioned in that only The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
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Post by blum on Aug 10, 2010 15:19:57 GMT 1
Look its history more than anything here we should be looking at, Wales was merged with Mercia, Wessex etc to make England in 927. 1535 to 1542 Wales was given permission by Henry VIII for the laws in wales acts. 1997 It gets its assembly, maybe that is when we should have booted Cardiff and Swansea out or maybe in 1992 when it got its League of Wales. However they obviously love us to much and want to be in the english league and still see Wales as principality of Great Britain rather than its own country. The truth is they are still here it doesn't bother me so much but i see peoples point of view. I cross the border regulary as i have lived and have family both sides the border, I have never needed a passport because I was born in Shrewsbury and as its states on my passport i am British. I'm not English or Welsh, I am British becuase my country tells me i am. Until i get told by somebody with governament authority any different we are all British and thats the bottom line. I couldn't give a damn about football, rugby or cricket as they are individual sports. The biggest sporting event of all is the Olympics and i don't see England, Wales, Scotland or even Northern Ireland getting mentioned in that only The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Okay I see where you're coming from, but I have just one more thing to add, then I wont say another word... The other day watching the European Athletics following the 200 Meter hurdles final which was won by a welsh bloke with another welsh bloke second. Rhys someone and Dai the other (true).. they were in the studio with Colin Jackson and whilst I take nothing away from a great sporting achievement by two "British" athletes, all three of the said things like, and I quote "it was great do to the for Wales", "the feeling of pride that we have two brilliant young athletese doing it for Wales" etc. etc. was not very British, it was seen by those three as a WELSH victory.. Take Andy Murray, when he plays tennis he does so under the flag of Scotland not Great Britain, in fact it's well documented about his anti English stance. If he plays Davies Cup matches he is classed as British but in any other competition he's Scottish, if Scotland and Wales are not seperate countries how can this be? As I said, I have no more views on the subject, we might be British, but ask anyone from each of the "countries" and they will say, with pride.. I am English, Scottish, Northern Irish or Welsh...The only reason they put British on their passport is bacuse they have no choice.
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Aug 10, 2010 15:24:53 GMT 1
Until i get told by somebody with governament authority any different we are all British and thats the bottom line. That’s a shame to read that. Quite scary to read such a comment in truth. More fool you. No administrative document brought about by some political union will ever tell me who I am. That’s one thing that no one can ever tell you and certainly no government. I’m English thank you very much, not British (and never will be). I'm English...
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Post by samtheshrew on Aug 10, 2010 15:25:07 GMT 1
I know it proves nothing. However, Cardiff fans are so obviously proud to be British
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Post by Myddleshrew on Aug 10, 2010 15:34:57 GMT 1
You lot are so wrong. I really think Cardiff Swansea and Wrexham deserve there place in the premier league.
The Welsh Premier League that is
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Post by blum on Aug 10, 2010 15:45:46 GMT 1
You lot are so wrong. I really think Cardiff Swansea and Wrexham deserve there place in the premier league. The Welsh Premier League that is Totally agree, plus that last picture sums the argument up to a conclusion in my opinion.
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Post by Ned on Aug 10, 2010 15:51:24 GMT 1
You lot are so wrong. I really think Cardiff Swansea and Wrexham deserve there place in the premier league. The Welsh Premier League that is Totally agree, plus that last picture sums the argument up to a conclusion in my opinion. In the same way the media always say, in Sports, that an English person has done something good but if they're Welsh or Scottish (Andy Murray for example) they claim a BRITISH person has done well. You can't have it both ways.
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Post by blum on Aug 10, 2010 15:58:03 GMT 1
Totally agree, plus that last picture sums the argument up to a conclusion in my opinion. In the same way the media always say, in Sports, that an English person has done something good but if they're Welsh or Scottish (Andy Murray for example) they claim a BRITISH person has done well. You can't have it both ways. I dont want it both ways, I am English, born, bred and proud. I have posted on here before about getting a giant sthil saw and cutting Wales and Scotland off my beloved country. Let them create their own wealth without the billions of English tax money going to them to pay for free higher education or prescriptions, If we are one nation then why does that system favour them? I stated earlier that two Welsh sportsmen considered their British victory as a Welsh vcitory, which completely turns your statement on it's head. And I have never ever heard a commentator say to an English winner of anything "well done you have made ENGLAND proud" in fact when it's an englishman doing well whilst representing GB then it's a GB victory, when the Scots or Welsh win then it's good for Wales and Scotland. British by birth, English by the grace of God... Amen
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Post by samtheshrew on Aug 10, 2010 15:58:57 GMT 1
Totally agree, plus that last picture sums the argument up to a conclusion in my opinion. In the same way the media always say, in Sports, that an English person has done something good but if they're Welsh or Scottish (Andy Murray for example) they claim a BRITISH person has done well. You can't have it both ways. I would more than happily always accredit Andy Murray's "achievements" to Scotland. Any Welsh success is Welsh, and any English is English. So, get out of our leagues!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2010 16:09:47 GMT 1
Not the same, different rules completely. In CLUB football you are entitled to have as many jonny foreginers as you want, in international football you arent.. oh, except in cricket!! How many Kiwi'd, Aussies, South Africans & Irish play in the England cricket team or have done so in recent history? Lots of them have. Glamorgan win a cricket tournament and they dont get to play in Europe representing either and English or Welsh league. Cardiff / Swansea / Wrexham, Newport etc. can represent the ENGLISH FA in Europe but still have a Welsh anthem played... Incorrect, I am afraid. As far as international football is concerned there were sundry Polish born players in the German side. Almunia is qualified to play for England by residence. As far as the Irish Republic is concerned, your parents need only to have flown over the country for you to qualify. The name Deco ring any bells-Brazilian born played for Portugal. As far as cricket is concerned, all have qualified through their parents or by residence except Morgan. His is a special case as Ireland are a non test playing country. The same applies to Scottish players, the last to represent England being Gavin Hamilton.
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Post by Ned on Aug 10, 2010 16:12:46 GMT 1
In the same way the media always say, in Sports, that an English person has done something good but if they're Welsh or Scottish (Andy Murray for example) they claim a BRITISH person has done well. You can't have it both ways. I would more than happily always accredit Andy Murray's "achievements" to Scotland. Any Welsh success is Welsh, and any English is English. So, get out of our leagues! Agree with the first bit, but that last sentence is ridiculous. They're not 'your' leagues. They are not ENGLISH leagues, hence the reason it's not called the ENGLISH premier league anymore. Any reasonable person would be happy to see Welsh teams in the NPower leagues. Just as i'd be fine with it if Chester entered the Welsh Premier. Blum, I have heard commentators and reporters referring to British sucess as English sucess. Though, it is more common with English sports fans.
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Post by heavenlyshrew on Aug 10, 2010 16:13:44 GMT 1
Dan who will supporting in the Next world cup?
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Post by samtheshrew on Aug 10, 2010 16:14:09 GMT 1
I would more than happily always accredit Andy Murray's "achievements" to Scotland. Any Welsh success is Welsh, and any English is English. So, get out of our leagues! Agree with the first bit, but that last sentence is ridiculous. They're not 'your' leagues. They are not ENGLISH leagues, hence the reason it's not called the ENGLISH premier league anymore. Any reasonable person would be happy to see Welsh teams in the NPower leagues. Just as i'd be fine with it if Chester entered the Welsh Premier. Blum, I have heard commentators and reporters referring to British sucess as English sucess. Though, it is more common with English sports fans. Um, sorry, which football authority runs the leagues? The ENGLISH football association.
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Post by Ned on Aug 10, 2010 16:16:26 GMT 1
Agree with the first bit, but that last sentence is ridiculous. They're not 'your' leagues. They are not ENGLISH leagues, hence the reason it's not called the ENGLISH premier league anymore. Any reasonable person would be happy to see Welsh teams in the NPower leagues. Just as i'd be fine with it if Chester entered the Welsh Premier. Blum, I have heard commentators and reporters referring to British sucess as English sucess. Though, it is more common with English sports fans. Um, sorry, which football authority runs the leagues? The ENGLISH football association. Who's in the League AGMs? Officials from every league club, including two Welsh.
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Post by samtheshrew on Aug 10, 2010 16:20:35 GMT 1
Um, sorry, which football authority runs the leagues? The ENGLISH football association. Who's in the League AGMs? Officials from every league club, including two Welsh. And they shouldn't be. Did you respond to the topic of discipline? Why should players at Welsh clubs have cases dealt with by a different board??
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Post by heavenlyshrew on Aug 10, 2010 16:21:01 GMT 1
Just one point if chester joined the league of wales do you expect them to drop the name welsh premier league?
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Post by Shrewed on Aug 10, 2010 16:26:19 GMT 1
I dont want it both ways, I am English, born, bred and proud. I have posted on here before about getting a giant sthil saw and cutting Wales and Scotland off my beloved country. Let them create their own wealth without the billions of English tax money going to them to pay for free higher education or prescriptions, If we are one nation then why does that system favour them? I think you'll find the Scots would be happy let you keep your taxes if you let them keep their oil revenue and scotch revenue.
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Post by Ned on Aug 10, 2010 16:29:51 GMT 1
Who's in the League AGMs? Officials from every league club, including two Welsh. And they shouldn't be. Did you respond to the topic of discipline? Why should players at Welsh clubs have cases dealt with by a different board?? I agree on that, and I think you'll find that Cardiff City are trying to be switched to the English FA. Have been for the last year.
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Post by samtheshrew on Aug 10, 2010 16:31:18 GMT 1
And they shouldn't be. Did you respond to the topic of discipline? Why should players at Welsh clubs have cases dealt with by a different board?? I agree on that, and I think you'll find that Cardiff City are trying to be switched to the English FA. Have been for the last year. One problem, Cardiff are Welsh. Goes back to the original point!
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Post by onthetrain92 on Aug 10, 2010 16:36:06 GMT 1
Dan who will supporting in the Next world cup? At the olympics i will be supporting Great Britain although only English players will be representing us unless of a sudden change. As far as my nationality goes 1st British 2nd English 3rd Welsh 4th Northern Irish 5th Scottish I could actually represent for all 5 nations! I'd support at world cups that order to as well.
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