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Post by zenfootball2 on Jun 15, 2024 19:42:53 GMT 1
I watched a you tube clip were a economist was saying that the UK is committed to a further £20 billion in cuts to public spending, if that is the case I'm not sure how labour can find the improvements they have pledged to do in there manifesto
Vanguard have published there 2024 financial report were they predict the global markets will not perform as well in the next ten years as the previous ten. If both are correct then labour will find itself in a tough position ,which is without trying to undo the mess the conservatives created.
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rob62
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Post by rob62 on Jun 15, 2024 23:13:33 GMT 1
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Post by Valerioch on Jun 16, 2024 7:33:08 GMT 1
Whilst I agree Sir Keir is an uninspiring serial liar, and that the two parties are literally 2 cheeks of the same arse at this election, only 1 party has had the b******s to correctly point out that blindly throwing more and more money at the NHS, is not the answer, and only 1 party is offering innovative and radical solutions to eradicate waiting lists over the next 5 years |
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Jun 16, 2024 9:15:50 GMT 1
I watched a you tube clip were a economist was saying that the UK is committed to a further £20 billion in cuts to public spending, if that is the case I'm not sure how labour can find the improvements they have pledged to do in there manifesto Labour aren't any different to anyone else so I don't think it's worth taking a great deal of notice of what's included in their manifesto. And perhaps more so from someone who won their party leadership race on the basis of someone else's policies only to drop them as soon as he'd won.  As mentioned by Andrew Neil yesterday who is asking the same questions as yourself...👍 Brace yourself! If you're saving for a pension or nursing a nest egg or living in a valuable home, you can be pretty sure Labour is coming for you |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2024 9:22:19 GMT 1
Whilst I agree Sir Keir is an uninspiring serial liar, and that the two parties are literally 2 cheeks of the same arse at this election, only 1 party has had the b******s to correctly point out that blindly throwing more and more money at the NHS, is not the answer, and only 1 party is offering innovative and radical solutions to eradicate waiting lists over the next 5 years
So your lot are offering radical and innovative solutions to a problem they caused through ideological austerity over the last 14 years. You really couldn't make this s**t up, yet some people still fall for it.
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Post by staffordshrew on Jun 16, 2024 10:35:36 GMT 1
Brace yourself! If you're saving for a pension or nursing a nest egg or living in a valuable home, you can be pretty sure Labour is coming for you'In some ways they have no choice. Labour will inherit a tight fiscal straitjacket in which ‘unprotected’ departments like the Home Office and Justice face cuts of £10 billion to £20 billion, depending on how much the budgets of ‘protected’ departments, like Health and Defence, are increased. After railing for years against so-called Tory austerity, a Starmer government can hardly start by cutting public spending further'. In fact those two sneaky Conservatives, Sunak and Hunt, have already raided those with pensions or savings. Suspending cost of living rises on tax thresholds has hit those receiving pensions. Decreasing National Insurance only applies to those working, so pensioners were targeted there too. Savers and investors have had the thresholds for tax on interest and Capital Gains Tax drastically reduced, so will now pay more tax. Because both parties talk of "looking after working people", both parties will rob savers and pensioners. But only one party seems to have any impetus to get this country going again, the other one has spent the last 14 years slowing down this countries economy while they fought amongst themselves. Growing the economy is the only way this country will recover from flatlining.
Apart from a few enabling tweaks, economic growth may not be even be down to Labour policies but more the change of mood from a government always looking in on itself being led by 'The Apprentice' contestants and the landed gentry to a government with some hope.
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Post by Valerioch on Jun 16, 2024 10:53:45 GMT 1
Whilst I agree Sir Keir is an uninspiring serial liar, and that the two parties are literally 2 cheeks of the same arse at this election, only 1 party has had the b******s to correctly point out that blindly throwing more and more money at the NHS, is not the answer, and only 1 party is offering innovative and radical solutions to eradicate waiting lists over the next 5 years
So your lot are offering radical and innovative solutions to a problem they caused through ideological austerity over the last 14 years. You really couldn't make this s**t up, yet some people still fall for it.
Not sure who you refer to as 'my lot', i've never been a member of a political party and will likely be voting for a 3rd different party in the last 4 elections in 3 weeks time But you've proved my point anyway so thanks - waiting lists are through the roof, despite record funding. Blindly chucking even more money at the NHS is not the answer |
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Post by zenfootball2 on Jun 16, 2024 12:00:07 GMT 1
I watched a you tube clip were a economist was saying that the UK is committed to a further £20 billion in cuts to public spending, if that is the case I'm not sure how labour can find the improvements they have pledged to do in there manifesto Labour aren't any different to anyone else so I don't think it's worth taking a great deal of notice of what's included in their manifesto. And perhaps more so from someone who won their party leadership race on the basis of someone else's policies only to drop them as soon as he'd won. As mentioned by Andrew Neil yesterday who is asking the same questions as yourself...👍 Brace yourself! If you're saving for a pension or nursing a nest egg or living in a valuable home, you can be pretty sure Labour is coming for youWhich does not come as a suprise to me. As someone else mentioned , They will be in an economic straightjacket so this area is an obvious one to go for, I worked in the NHS and dread an american style insurance health provider. As controversial as it is, the NHS is becoming unaffordable so something must change, as someone else mentioned we need to grow the economy , some form of state. funded venture capital scheme, as much as I don't like the royal family, the princess trust has helped numerous projects become viable in many cases were conventional funding was not available. |
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Post by davycrockett on Jun 16, 2024 12:04:46 GMT 1
Brace yourself! If you're saving for a pension or nursing a nest egg or living in a valuable home, you can be pretty sure Labour is coming for you'In some ways they have no choice. Labour will inherit a tight fiscal straitjacket in which ‘unprotected’ departments like the Home Office and Justice face cuts of £10 billion to £20 billion, depending on how much the budgets of ‘protected’ departments, like Health and Defence, are increased. After railing for years against so-called Tory austerity, a Starmer government can hardly start by cutting public spending further'. In fact those two sneaky Conservatives, Sunak and Hunt, have already raided those with pensions or savings. Suspending cost of living rises on tax thresholds has hit those receiving pensions. Decreasing National Insurance only applies to those working, so pensioners were targeted there too. Savers and investors have had the thresholds for tax on interest and Capital Gains Tax drastically reduced, so will now pay more tax. Because both parties talk of "looking after working people", both parties will rob savers and pensioners. But only one party seems to have any impetus to get this country going again, the other one has spent the last 14 years slowing down this countries economy while they fought amongst themselves. Growing the economy is the only way this country will recover from flatlining.
Apart from a few enabling tweaks, economic growth may not be even be down to Labour policies but more the change of mood from a government always looking in on itself being led by 'The Apprentice' contestants and the landed gentry to a government with some hope. It’s in the daily Mail so must be accurate the bit that’s common sense is all other parties are cutting taxes yet the public understand to improve any areas you have to pay for it and would accept higher taxes for better services. The State Pension pots going bust so what does Rishi do, cut national insurance! Again and again…..how does that make sense except to buy votes? With many flocking to UKIP (rebranded Reform) god help us! |
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Jun 16, 2024 12:33:22 GMT 1
Which does not come as a suprise to me. As someone else mentioned , They will be in an economic straightjacket so this area is an obvious one to go for, I worked in the NHS and dread an american style insurance health provider. As controversial as it is, the NHS is becoming unaffordable so something must change, as someone else mentioned we need to grow the economy , some form of state. funded venture capital scheme, as much as I don't like the royal family, the princess trust has helped numerous projects become viable in many cases were conventional funding was not available. I agree that the NHS should be looked at but we shouldn't fall into the trap in thinking that its a binary choice between the NHS and an "American style insurance health", there are other funding models throughout the world that can be used as a template (all of which are universal)...👍 |
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Post by zenfootball2 on Jun 16, 2024 14:39:48 GMT 1
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Post by sheltonsalopian on Jun 17, 2024 9:36:06 GMT 1
We're in a bit of a population trap in this country. You have a lot of retired and elderly users, who compared to 20-30 years ago are living a lot longer, and using a lot more resources doing it.
That's the truth no one wants to say - if you want the NHS to function like it did 15-20 years ago you either need to raise taxes considerably or reduce the services covered by the NHS, something no one wants to talk about.
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Post by Minormorris64 on Jun 18, 2024 13:36:11 GMT 1
You could spend the entire GDP on the NHS and it still would not be enough.
2 Main problems, Population Size and the Management of the NHS.
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Post by Valerioch on Jun 18, 2024 18:48:00 GMT 1
We're in a bit of a population trap in this country. You have a lot of retired and elderly users, who compared to 20-30 years ago are living a lot longer, and using a lot more resources doing it. That's the truth no one wants to say - if you want the NHS to function like it did 15-20 years ago you either need to raise taxes considerably or reduce the services covered by the NHS, something no one wants to talk about. Population has also exploded due to 25 years of mass uncontrolled immigration, a policy started by Blair and endorsed by the Tories for the last 14 years |
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Post by mattmw on Jun 19, 2024 9:23:18 GMT 1
We're in a bit of a population trap in this country. You have a lot of retired and elderly users, who compared to 20-30 years ago are living a lot longer, and using a lot more resources doing it. That's the truth no one wants to say - if you want the NHS to function like it did 15-20 years ago you either need to raise taxes considerably or reduce the services covered by the NHS, something no one wants to talk about. Population has also exploded due to 25 years of mass uncontrolled immigration, a policy started by Blair and endorsed by the Tories for the last 14 years Generally the increase in immigration is of working age people, where as the big increase in NHS use is with the older demographic as this article outlines www.nhsconfed.org/articles/immigration-harming-nhs#:~:text=According%20to%20reports%20and%20data,than%20they%20consume%20in%20services'. In Shropshire for example the percentage of foreign workers in the NHS is higher than the average number of foreign born members of the general population. There have been big recruitment drives in southern Asian countries to recruit staff to work in Shropshire Health services So it’s tricky balance for the political parties to meet the genuine and understandable concerns about high levels of immigration without damaging the ability of companies and institutions like the NHS to recruit overseas workers to fill gaps in the jobs market |
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Post by sheltonsalopian on Jun 19, 2024 9:26:46 GMT 1
We're in a bit of a population trap in this country. You have a lot of retired and elderly users, who compared to 20-30 years ago are living a lot longer, and using a lot more resources doing it. That's the truth no one wants to say - if you want the NHS to function like it did 15-20 years ago you either need to raise taxes considerably or reduce the services covered by the NHS, something no one wants to talk about. Population has also exploded due to 25 years of mass uncontrolled immigration, a policy started by Blair and endorsed by the Tories for the last 14 years Not denying there's been loads of immigration and whether it's a problem or not, but the reason Labour/Tories allow it is because it provides an economic boost - so without immigration we'd be in an even bigger hole. We can argue about the rights/wrongs of immigration, but economics isn't one of them. |
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Post by Valerioch on Jun 19, 2024 18:26:58 GMT 1
Population has also exploded due to 25 years of mass uncontrolled immigration, a policy started by Blair and endorsed by the Tories for the last 14 years Not denying there's been loads of immigration and whether it's a problem or not, but the reason Labour/Tories allow it is because it provides an economic boost - so without immigration we'd be in an even bigger hole. We can argue about the rights/wrongs of immigration, but economics isn't one of them. Certainly can argue the economics of it, anything can be argued and debated |
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rob62
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Post by rob62 on Jun 19, 2024 21:06:24 GMT 1
Latest Sky / You Gov MRP Poll suggests that Helen Morgan will comfortably retain North Shropshire for the Lib Dems.
Labour will gain Shrewsbury and Telford
and South Shropshire is very close between the Tories and Lib Dems.
My gut feeling is that with tactical voting the Lib Dems will take South Shropshire from the Tories
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Post by theNOTORIOUSfbs on Jun 20, 2024 2:29:12 GMT 1
Well well well.. The polls are interesting. The revolution has begun 🍹 The silent majority is arising. Just like Europe I predicted this. And in 4 years time. People have had enough. They’re fed up to the back teeth with their country, flag, traditions and values being handed over to intolerant invaders. A British MP trying to get elected using Palestine and their flag colours. Where are we going? This is the UK? Where Hamas and Hezbolla etc are?  |
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Post by ProudSalopian on Jun 20, 2024 9:26:55 GMT 1
An interesting story here, a muslim whose parents emmigrated here complaining about Britain losing control of it's borders. Interestingly I have seen on social media people of different races/backgrounds saying similar, I'm pretty sure they are still in a minority but being concerned about immigration is certainly not just a 'white' concern www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cd11xxn833yo |
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Post by mattmw on Jun 20, 2024 11:10:00 GMT 1
An interesting story here, a muslim whose parents emmigrated here complaining about Britain losing control of it's borders. Interestingly I have seen on social media people of different races/backgrounds saying similar, I'm pretty sure they are still in a minority but being concerned about immigration is certainly not just a 'white' concern www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cd11xxn833yoI said earlier in the thread that how Reform, and what is remaining of the Conservative Parlimentary Party work together post election as a centre right alternative to the (probable) Labour government is going to be really interetsing. Part of that will be developing meaningful immigration policies which can be implemented to reduce numbers, whilst also keeping the economy ticking over and growing, and keeping specific sectors of the economy which rely on immigration going. It will also need to link to wider industrial and educational strategies in the long term to replace key workers from abroad with skilled UK workers. These sort of changes take time and probably 2-3 terms in office to really change - so are long term policies rather than things that can be delivered over night There is also perhaps a different tax model that reflects the need to pay higher costs for services rather than rely on cheaper overseas labour, which isn't necessarily something that sits as comfortably with centre right parties who traditionally prefer a lower tax model. Pointing out the problems and concerns about immigration levels is really easy, finding working solutions to them is more difficult and will be where the credibity of the new centre right parties needs to be established. |
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Post by Worthingshrew on Jun 20, 2024 11:44:28 GMT 1
If the Tory wipeout materialises, the infighting between Reform and what’s left of the Tory party will mean there will be no working together, and why should there be?
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Post by Valerioch on Jun 20, 2024 13:48:05 GMT 1
If the Tory wipeout materialises, the infighting between Reform and what’s left of the Tory party will mean there will be no working together, and why should there be? Surely the Tory party just splits 2 ways? As has always been the threat for decades? Those right of centre in the party join Reform, those left of centre join Labour or Liberal Democrats? Lets be honest, we've seen a record number of defections this parliament already. I don't think the Tories realised quite how disliked / openly despised they were by both sides of the the electorate. Couple that, with a shambolic campaign, means I doubt many folk will be disappointed to see them wiped out. Labour deserve another go, but my optimism is incredibly low in a leader who flip flops his opinion more than a fish, and bows down to the woke ideology at whim. Perhaps we have to endure some more pain before we get real change - lets be honest, the pitch from the 2 main parties this election couldn't even be split by a fag paper |
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rob62
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Post by rob62 on Jun 20, 2024 16:47:19 GMT 1
Not inspired by either the Tories or Labour. Very few new ideas. ..just steady as you go.
The only parties that are coming up with interesting ideas are the Lib Dems and the Greens
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rob62
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Post by rob62 on Jun 20, 2024 17:55:45 GMT 1
www.facebook.com/share/p/9RemvLCKokziTKHg/The latest Sky poll suggests it is neck and neck between the Tories and ZLib Dems in South Shropshire constituency. Bizarrely South Shropshire constituency extends as far north as the new houses south of Otley Road
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Post by zenfootball2 on Jun 21, 2024 8:03:54 GMT 1
Well well well.. The polls are interesting. The revolution has begun 🍹 The silent majority is arising. Just like Europe I predicted this. And in 4 years time. People have had enough. They’re fed up to the back teeth with their country, flag, traditions and values being handed over to intolerant invaders. A British MP trying to get elected using Palestine and their flag colours. Where are we going? This is the UK? Where Hamas and Hezbolla etc are? i dont know this person or how this image reflects her views but in some traditional labour areas independent Muslim candidates are standing so this may be nothing more than a tactical posistion |
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Post by theNOTORIOUSfbs on Jun 26, 2024 21:14:21 GMT 1
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Post by staffordshrew on Jun 30, 2024 8:45:07 GMT 1
This election surely the self serving duffers have to be removed, whichever party they are affiliated to. For example, replacing the ex MP for North Shropshire, can't even remember his name now, with Helen Morgan seems to have been a great move. They now have an MP that works.
Whoever you vote for, make sure you vote. Anyone who comes on here saying " don't blame me, I didn't vote" for the next five years should be rightly ridiculed.
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rob62
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Post by rob62 on Jun 30, 2024 16:31:31 GMT 1
It is crystal clear from opinion polls which have done analysis seat by seat that both North and South Shropshire will be a close fight between the Lib Dems and the Tories.
So you have a choice between 2 parties that after 4 July will be in opposition to the Labour government.
I would ask anyone who is able to vote in those seats to consider the qualities, integrity, and track record of the candidates.
Ask your self who will be a hard working local champion who will fight for his / her constituents, and who is a career politician that jumps seats in the hope of an easier life.
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Post by theNOTORIOUSfbs on Jul 5, 2024 1:43:07 GMT 1
It’s what I predicted
The bleak prospect of the lunatics taking over the asylum.
The icing on the cake being Corbyn winning
I warned everyone
It’s going to be bad. Real bad
What an absolutely fantastic night for the silent majority. Reform 🍺. We’ve smashed it. We’ve come second in most results
Give yourselves all a big pay on the back
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As mentioned by Andrew Neil yesterday who is asking the same questions as yourself...👍
