|
Post by Pilch on Nov 24, 2023 18:49:13 GMT 1
Is it not football league rules re the shares ? Otherwise you risk falling foul of ffp There is an alternative , don't pay the wages , takes points deductions and prepare for a trip to bury in the near future Could we worse we could still have a manager bleeding us dry and demanding a bigger budget 😟 Gosh Pilch - I only made a comment about a possibility- no need to be so bloody doom laden !! I only wanted to clear up the shares rule, Bury is a nice trip anyway
|
|
|
Post by DiglisShrew on Nov 24, 2023 18:52:51 GMT 1
Gosh Pilch - I only made a comment about a possibility- no need to be so bloody doom laden !! I only wanted to clear up the shares rule, Bury is a nice trip anyway Sorry , I didn’t realise you’d recently acquired such expansive knowledge on FFP rules 🙄🧐
|
|
|
Post by southshropblue on Nov 24, 2023 18:55:28 GMT 1
some good things appear to have come out of meeting but the chairmans donation raises a lot of questions
|
|
|
Post by Pilch on Nov 24, 2023 18:56:40 GMT 1
I find it quite surprising that - apart from the resident club apologist who is contracted to always tow the party line, that others appear so gullible! Fancy this news being announced - albeit it ‘very reluctantly 🙁’ (yeah right) just after the first meeting with supporters groups in years. Who’d have thought? If the chairman is to be believed then any such scenario is entirely of his own making, through lack of diligence, scrutiny and most of all the almost criminal neglect of making the most of the greatest opportunity this club ever had. excuse me mr militant union rep why dont you get yourself a few banners, an empty oil drum , light a fire in it on otelely road and throw stones at the chairman when he arrives ? it kind of sums you up as a person when you have to make up lies about me whilst at the same time questioning the truth about someone else
|
|
|
Post by Pilch on Nov 24, 2023 18:58:12 GMT 1
I only wanted to clear up the shares rule, Bury is a nice trip anyway Sorry , I didn’t realise you’d recently acquired such expansive knowledge on FFP rules 🙄🧐 im not but I listen to a twice weekly podcast from a football finance expert, that helps ;-)
|
|
|
Post by DiglisShrew on Nov 24, 2023 19:00:50 GMT 1
Sorry , I didn’t realise you’d recently acquired such expansive knowledge on FFP rules 🙄🧐 im not but I listen to a twice weekly podcast from a football finance expert, that helps ;-) Too much time on your hands ?? 🙄😉
|
|
|
Post by Pilch on Nov 24, 2023 19:01:49 GMT 1
im not but I listen to a twice weekly podcast from a football finance expert, that helps ;-) Too much time on your hands ?? 🙄😉 not really but it helps whilst walking the streets ;-)
|
|
|
Post by mattmw on Nov 24, 2023 19:33:23 GMT 1
some good things appear to have come out of meeting but the chairmans donation raises a lot of questions That's my thoughts as well. Would be useful to know whether this was a cash flow issue, or an actual loss. As obviously if its a loss something seriously strange and devestating to the club has happened in 22/23! From the published accounts we know the club had cash in the bank in June 2022 www.shrewsburytown.com/news/2023/march/shrewsbury-town-accounts-july-2021---june-2022/Which stated that "The club continues to have no debt and held £1.6m cash in the bank at 30 June 2022 (June 2021 – £2.3m)" The 22/23 season had no covid restrictions, and on the face of it attendances held up ok, so presumably the cash flow issue was the loss or delay of a significant income stream or an very significant additional outlay on wages or other expenditure that year. Hopefully it was the Premier league cash delay that resulted in a short term cash flow issue, as if not and the club did wrack up a £1.6 million loss last year its its biggest ever loss and way way over anything seen in a normal, none covid season. It puts the club on the brink of being unvilable Clearly a club loosing £1.6 million a year is not sustainable in League one, and I doubt very much the Chairman can put that amount into the club each year so to be honest we are potentially right back where we were in the 90's struggling to avoid relegation to the Conference in terms of our finances. What a sorry state of affairs and how on earth did the board and staff at the club let it get so out of control after running such a tight ship for so long?
|
|
|
Post by dachshund on Nov 24, 2023 19:40:15 GMT 1
Lovely press release that. First section worthy of North Korea
|
|
|
Post by Pilch on Nov 24, 2023 19:52:37 GMT 1
some good things appear to have come out of meeting but the chairmans donation raises a lot of questions That's my thoughts as well. Would be useful to know whether this was a cash flow issue, or an actual loss. As obviously if its a loss something seriously strange and devestating to the club has happened in 22/23! From the published accounts we know the club had cash in the bank in June 2022 www.shrewsburytown.com/news/2023/march/shrewsbury-town-accounts-july-2021---june-2022/Which stated that "The club continues to have no debt and held £1.6m cash in the bank at 30 June 2022 (June 2021 – £2.3m)" The 22/23 season had no covid restrictions, and on the face of it attendances held up ok, so presumably the cash flow issue was the loss or delay of a significant income stream or an very significant additional outlay on wages or other expenditure that year. Hopefully it was the Premier league cash delay that resulted in a short term cash flow issue, as if not and the club did wrack up a £1.6 million loss last year its its biggest ever loss and way way over anything seen in a normal, none covid season. It puts the club on the brink of being unvilable Clearly a club loosing £1.6 million a year is not sustainable in League one, and I doubt very much the Chairman can put that amount into the club each year so to be honest we are potentially right back where we were in the 90's struggling to avoid relegation to the Conference in terms of our finances. What a sorry state of affairs and how on earth did the board and staff at the club let it get so out of control after running such a tight ship for so long? if you check back to this thread before the meeting was had, I stated I would be asking that exact question, mainly as I have long suspected it blueandamber.proboards.com/thread/106484/fan-engagement-panel-launch-confirmed?page=3I can tell you when I asked it the CEO froze like a rabbit in the headlights, he clearly knew the answer but said there and then, I will have to take that away and see if the chairman will answer it, now I dont think I'm only my own in saying I was shocked when I saw he had done so when the draft minutes came out, I personally think this is the most embarrassing admission the chairman has ever had to make about something that happened on his watch, call it misguided trust or whatever your narrative is but I think its good for everyone thats its now out there , football is all ups and downs, but it never helps when fans kick the club when its on one of those downs, I think they need our support more than ever at the moment up the town ;-)
|
|
|
Post by Pilch on Nov 24, 2023 19:53:49 GMT 1
Lovely press release that. First section worthy of North Korea lovely reply that, worthy of Donald trump ;-)
|
|
|
Post by BlueAndAmber50 on Nov 24, 2023 19:57:17 GMT 1
Don’t all owners of football clubs invest their own money into the club the own? I don’t mean to sound stupid I just thought it was a given
|
|
|
Post by mattmw on Nov 24, 2023 20:06:35 GMT 1
That's my thoughts as well. Would be useful to know whether this was a cash flow issue, or an actual loss. As obviously if its a loss something seriously strange and devestating to the club has happened in 22/23! From the published accounts we know the club had cash in the bank in June 2022 www.shrewsburytown.com/news/2023/march/shrewsbury-town-accounts-july-2021---june-2022/Which stated that "The club continues to have no debt and held £1.6m cash in the bank at 30 June 2022 (June 2021 – £2.3m)" The 22/23 season had no covid restrictions, and on the face of it attendances held up ok, so presumably the cash flow issue was the loss or delay of a significant income stream or an very significant additional outlay on wages or other expenditure that year. Hopefully it was the Premier league cash delay that resulted in a short term cash flow issue, as if not and the club did wrack up a £1.6 million loss last year its its biggest ever loss and way way over anything seen in a normal, none covid season. It puts the club on the brink of being unvilable Clearly a club loosing £1.6 million a year is not sustainable in League one, and I doubt very much the Chairman can put that amount into the club each year so to be honest we are potentially right back where we were in the 90's struggling to avoid relegation to the Conference in terms of our finances. What a sorry state of affairs and how on earth did the board and staff at the club let it get so out of control after running such a tight ship for so long? if you check back to this thread before the meeting was had, I stated I would be asking that exact question, mainly as I have long suspected it blueandamber.proboards.com/thread/106484/fan-engagement-panel-launch-confirmed?page=3I can tell you when I asked it the CEO froze like a rabbit in the headlights, he clearly knew the answer but said there and then, I will have to take that away and see if the chairman will answer it, now I dont think I'm only my own in saying I was shocked when I saw he had done so when the draft minutes came out, I personally think this is the most embarrassing admission the chairman has ever had to make about something that happened on his watch, call it misguided trust or whatever your narrative is but I think its good for everyone thats its now out there , football is all ups and downs, but it never helps when fans kick the club when its on one of those downs, I think they need our support more than ever at the moment up the town ;-) Yes I can see its of massive embarrasment of the Chairman to have to admit such a terrible situation has occured on his watch, but congratlations to him admitting how out of control the finances of the club have become in the last 12 months. Hopefully there is a way for him to back out of the club and regain some of the money he has lost, with reputation not too tarnished whilst also giving a new owner the ability to get on with modernising the club and sustaining our league status. What a sad end to his long time in charge
|
|
|
Post by tdk on Nov 24, 2023 20:08:29 GMT 1
Nowhere in the statement does it say the money was a donation.
|
|
|
Post by pughywasfree on Nov 24, 2023 20:12:20 GMT 1
if you check back to this thread before the meeting was had, I stated I would be asking that exact question, mainly as I have long suspected it blueandamber.proboards.com/thread/106484/fan-engagement-panel-launch-confirmed?page=3I can tell you when I asked it the CEO froze like a rabbit in the headlights, he clearly knew the answer but said there and then, I will have to take that away and see if the chairman will answer it, now I dont think I'm only my own in saying I was shocked when I saw he had done so when the draft minutes came out, I personally think this is the most embarrassing admission the chairman has ever had to make about something that happened on his watch, call it misguided trust or whatever your narrative is but I think its good for everyone thats its now out there , football is all ups and downs, but it never helps when fans kick the club when its on one of those downs, I think they need our support more than ever at the moment up the town ;-) Yes I can see its of massive embarrasment of the Chairman to have to admit such a terrible situation has occured on his watch, but congratlations to him admitting how out of control the finances of the club have become in the last 12 months. Hopefully there is a way for him to back out of the club and regain some of the money he has lost, with reputation not too tarnished whilst also giving a new owner the ability to get on with modernising the club and sustaining our league status. What a sad end to his long time in charge What sad end? how is his reputation tarnished? why would he need to back out of the club instead of hand pick who he thinks would safeguard the clubs future? Where did it state the finances were out of control? How is it a massive embarrassment? its either a couple of criminals have got away with theft and fraud or extreme external factors have hit the club hard. It's not like hes gone out and splashed a few mill on new seats in his box. Last question, what would a new chairman do differently that would modernise the club? every week I see the club trying new initiatives (including a new whatsapp group that was announced an hour ago)
|
|
|
Post by jamo on Nov 24, 2023 20:14:36 GMT 1
What a sorry state of affairs and how on earth did the board and staff at the club let it get so out of control after running such a tight ship for so long? This is it, and I think it’s a great source of frustration for a large section of the club’s supporters ( and we will have lost lots of previously loyal match going fans as a consequence). The lack of challenge and scrutiny within the boardroom- which should be the absolute norm in any company is now beginning to expose the deep flaws in the chairman’s stewardship of STFC
|
|
|
Post by venceremos on Nov 24, 2023 20:15:12 GMT 1
Don’t all owners of football clubs invest their own money into the club the own? I don’t mean to sound stupid I just thought it was a given Haha, yes of course they do. Have you met the Glazer family?
|
|
|
Post by venceremos on Nov 24, 2023 20:16:54 GMT 1
Endless speculation but it’s all froth and nonsense until the accounts are published.
|
|
|
Post by Pilch on Nov 24, 2023 20:17:04 GMT 1
if you check back to this thread before the meeting was had, I stated I would be asking that exact question, mainly as I have long suspected it blueandamber.proboards.com/thread/106484/fan-engagement-panel-launch-confirmed?page=3I can tell you when I asked it the CEO froze like a rabbit in the headlights, he clearly knew the answer but said there and then, I will have to take that away and see if the chairman will answer it, now I dont think I'm only my own in saying I was shocked when I saw he had done so when the draft minutes came out, I personally think this is the most embarrassing admission the chairman has ever had to make about something that happened on his watch, call it misguided trust or whatever your narrative is but I think its good for everyone thats its now out there , football is all ups and downs, but it never helps when fans kick the club when its on one of those downs, I think they need our support more than ever at the moment up the town ;-) Yes I can see its of massive embarrasment of the Chairman to have to admit such a terrible situation has occured on his watch, but congratlations to him admitting how out of control the finances of the club have become in the last 12 months. Hopefully there is a way for him to back out of the club and regain some of the money he has lost, with reputation not too tarnished whilst also giving a new owner the ability to get on with modernising the club and sustaining our league status. What a sad end to his long time in charge the only sad thing I can see is your attitude, I guess this is going from the denial to the anger stage ;-)
|
|
|
Post by Pilch on Nov 24, 2023 20:18:28 GMT 1
Endless speculation but it’s all froth and nonsense until the accounts are published. I think they will be a bit like mine to be honest
|
|
|
Post by Feedo Gnasher on Nov 24, 2023 21:12:39 GMT 1
Endless speculation but it’s all froth and nonsense until the accounts are published. The club would be well advised to provide a little more detail than they usually do in their accounts this year. Roll on April.
|
|
|
Post by mattmw on Nov 24, 2023 21:40:30 GMT 1
What a sorry state of affairs and how on earth did the board and staff at the club let it get so out of control after running such a tight ship for so long? This is it, and I think it’s a great source of frustration for a large section of the club’s supporters ( and we will have lost lots of previously loyal match going fans as a consequence). The lack of challenge and scrutiny within the boardroom- which should be the absolute norm in any company is now beginning to expose the deep flaws in the chairman’s stewardship of STFC This is it in a publically limited company a Chairman overseeing that level of loss and no scruitiny of the finacial transactions of the company would be out on their ear by the Shareholders. In our case we're lucky that the Chairman has deep pockets and was able to cover the losses the company made, such lack of leadership from the Chairman and also other board members is a real derelicton of their basic duties.
|
|
|
Post by mattmw on Nov 24, 2023 21:45:08 GMT 1
Yes I can see its of massive embarrasment of the Chairman to have to admit such a terrible situation has occured on his watch, but congratlations to him admitting how out of control the finances of the club have become in the last 12 months. Hopefully there is a way for him to back out of the club and regain some of the money he has lost, with reputation not too tarnished whilst also giving a new owner the ability to get on with modernising the club and sustaining our league status. What a sad end to his long time in charge the only sad thing I can see is your attitude, I guess this is going from the denial to the anger stage ;-) I'm fuming to be honest, after all the "new era" for the club moving to the new ground we're now back at the stage of the Chairman having to bail the club out out and and no cash left in the bank. 1.6 million cash gone in 12 months - thats a loss of £130,000 a month! How did it get so out of hand?
|
|
|
Post by Feedo Gnasher on Nov 24, 2023 21:50:43 GMT 1
the only sad thing I can see is your attitude, I guess this is going from the denial to the anger stage ;-) I'm fuming to be honest, after all the "new era" for the club moving to the new ground we're now back at the stage of the Chairman having to bail the club out out and and no cash left in the bank. 1.6 million cash gone in 12 months - thats a loss of £130,000 a month! How did it get so out of hand? It’d take more than a few five star hotels and dodgy expense claims to burn through that sort of sum.
|
|
|
Post by Pilch on Nov 24, 2023 21:51:52 GMT 1
the only sad thing I can see is your attitude, I guess this is going from the denial to the anger stage ;-) I'm fuming to be honest, after all the "new era" for the club moving to the new ground we're now back at the stage of the Chairman having to bail the club out out and and no cash left in the bank. 1.6 million cash gone in 12 months - thats a loss of £130,000 a month! How did it get so out of hand? maybe our chairman believed in SC like 99.9% of our fans did, did you ? oh yes, you were the guy who was leading the pack in demanding RW a back seat re cotterill, some of our fans were still singing his name last saturday im so glad I NEVER did
|
|
|
Post by pughywasfree on Nov 24, 2023 21:53:56 GMT 1
This is it, and I think it’s a great source of frustration for a large section of the club’s supporters ( and we will have lost lots of previously loyal match going fans as a consequence). The lack of challenge and scrutiny within the boardroom- which should be the absolute norm in any company is now beginning to expose the deep flaws in the chairman’s stewardship of STFC This is it in a publically limited company a Chairman overseeing that level of loss and no scruitiny of the finacial transactions of the company would be out on their ear by the Shareholders. In our case we're lucky that the Chairman has deep pockets and was able to cover the losses the company made, such lack of leadership from the Chairman and also other board members is a real derelicton of their basic duties. I see you ignored my questions. You act like the club losing money is not the norm in football. Below is an article about football league finances, might be worth having a look. focuses mainly on the championship but I imagine it is worse in leagues 1 and 2 if you take into account the size of the clubs. www2.deloitte.com/uk/en/pages/sports-business-group/articles/annual-review-of-football-finance-football-league-clubs.htmlChampionship clubs’ losses Operating losses reported by Championship clubs decreased by 10% to £361m in 2021/22, an average loss of £15m per club. The improved financial performance is attributed to the changing club mix, accounting for a £89m decrease in operating loss. Clubs that participated in the Championship in both 2020/21 and 2021/22 reported an increase of 17% in operating losses (£322m), led by Cardiff City and AFC Bournemouth who reported an increase of £28m and £25m respectively, primarily due to the reduction in parachute payments received by both clubs. The pre-tax loss reported by Championship clubs in 2021/22 was £283m, a decrease of £9m on 2020/21. However, this loss would have been significantly higher without Stoke City and Coventry City, who recognised profit from loan write-offs of £120m and £29m respectively. Writing-off loans from owners highlights a degree of financial commitment from the club owners, however, the reliance on such loans implies an inability to cover the expenses through club generated revenue. Excluding these two clubs, the pre-tax loss that competed in the Championship in each year increased 66% to £406m (2020/21: £245m). As Championship clubs emerge from the pandemic, and a number of club owners continue to invest significantly to subsidise club operations, a continuous spotlight on the financial sustainability of clubs remains a necessity to ensure their long-term future. In recognition of this, the EFL has in place a full-time team responsible for reviewing the position of its clubs in a continuous manner.
|
|
|
Post by pughywasfree on Nov 24, 2023 21:59:13 GMT 1
|
|
|
Post by pughywasfree on Nov 24, 2023 22:00:50 GMT 1
|
|
|
Post by pughywasfree on Nov 24, 2023 22:02:13 GMT 1
|
|
|
Post by pughywasfree on Nov 24, 2023 22:03:21 GMT 1
|
|