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Post by northwestman on Oct 15, 2021 8:47:01 GMT 1
Ever since net zero was set as Britain’s great national goal – an Apollo mission for our time – we have heard almost nothing about the price tag. Ministers promised that they’d get around to telling us before the Cop26 summit, but there’s still no word. And there are now just 16 days to go.
Next week we’ll hear a bit more about the new heat pumps, which cost about £10,000 a throw. The current thinking is to offer a grant – perhaps as much as £7,000 – to those tempted (or forced) to take the plunge. But we’re unlikely to hear much about where we’d find the skilled workers needed to fit heat pumps at the rate of 2,000 a day.
Throw in the transformation of roads (for electric cars), farms, factories and everything else and the price tag is likely to come in at over £1 trillion. The Climate Change Committee, which does the net zero sums, thinks it will be more like £50 billion a year from 2030 to make the transition, more than four times the sum raised by the coming National Insurance hike. The difference is that we’ve been told about the tax, whereas ministers are still talking as if net zero will be cost-free.
A net zero agenda could (at a low estimate) cost the average household an extra £1,700 a year, piled on top of unpopular tax rises and an emerging cost-of-living crisis.
Daily Telegraph.
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Post by staffordshrew on Oct 15, 2021 9:13:06 GMT 1
Mark Docherty from WMAS says “not unusual for a patient to be in the back of an ambulance for 7 hours or more. This is not acceptable” He adds ambulances can’t leave the hospital once stuck in a queue. He says one patient was 1.5 miles from RSH and died waiting for an ambulance And not a protester in sight. Let’s here the outrage chaps👍 Didn't take long for that chicken to vome home to roost: Patient died one and a half miles from hospital waiting for an ambulance
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Post by northwestman on Oct 15, 2021 9:13:41 GMT 1
COP 26 sums up the times we live in perfectly:
1) 26,000 delegates will fly/ drive to an environmental conference, burning tonnes of emissions in the process.
2) They are travelling during a pandemic, into a country that demands Covid passes and proof of vaccination for daily life but these people will be exempt (lookout for masked waiters/ attendants serving mask free delegates).
3) They will announce grand plans that have the potential to materially transform the lives of millions of people (and not for the better) without any real democratic engagement or mandate.
4) The pledges that they make will essentially be unilateral. There will be no enforcement or transparent audit. Some countries will comply, others will renege and there will be no framework of penalties.
5) The consequences of their announcements will not be felt by comfortably off delegates, privately wealthy or on generous (often public funded) salaries.
6) We have also seen that the sorts of restrictions that they expect other people to bear - fewer flights, holidays at home - will not effect our globe-trotting delegate class.
Ultimately it is a jamboree for "right thinking" people to make endless pronouncements about how the world needs to change its way, pronouncements that will have a minimal impact on their comfortable lives, which they will exempt themselves form anyway, and which they will not pay for.
Letter to the Daily Telegraph.
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Post by sheltonsalopian on Oct 15, 2021 9:15:51 GMT 1
The above article makes the mistake of thinking if we don't invest anything into net zero that we can keep operating as normal. After seeing the damage a few weeks of rainfall caused Shrewsbury I'd have thought anyone around here would realise spending a lot to solve a problem early on would prevent loads of costs later.
We can't let short term views win on this.
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Post by staffordshrew on Oct 15, 2021 9:19:00 GMT 1
Ever since net zero was set as Britain’s great national goal – an Apollo mission for our time – we have heard almost nothing about the price tag. Ministers promised that they’d get around to telling us before the Cop26 summit, but there’s still no word. And there are now just 16 days to go. Next week we’ll hear a bit more about the new heat pumps, which cost about £10,000 a throw. The current thinking is to offer a grant – perhaps as much as £7,000 – to those tempted (or forced) to take the plunge. But we’re unlikely to hear much about where we’d find the skilled workers needed to fit heat pumps at the rate of 2,000 a day. Throw in the transformation of roads (for electric cars), farms, factories and everything else and the price tag is likely to come in at over £1 trillion. The Climate Change Committee, which does the net zero sums, thinks it will be more like £50 billion a year from 2030 to make the transition, more than four times the sum raised by the coming National Insurance hike. The difference is that we’ve been told about the tax, whereas ministers are still talking as if net zero will be cost-free. A net zero agenda could (at a low estimate) cost the average household an extra £1,700 a year, piled on top of unpopular tax rises and an emerging cost-of-living crisis. Daily Telegraph. We went through all this with Nuclear power: The scientists told us it would mean planty of cheap electricity. Oil was going to run out. What happened? The electricity wasn't cheap and the oil didn't run out. Before we rush headlong into electric cars and solar farms, just check what it would be best to still use oil and gas for, then make their use cleaner. Common sense required when we don't have a government with common sense.....
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Post by staffordshrew on Oct 15, 2021 9:33:56 GMT 1
Mark Docherty from WMAS says “not unusual for a patient to be in the back of an ambulance for 7 hours or more. This is not acceptable” He adds ambulances can’t leave the hospital once stuck in a queue. He says one patient was 1.5 miles from RSH and died waiting for an ambulance And not a protester in sight. Let’s here the outrage chaps👍 Didn't take long for that chicken to vome home to roost: Patient died one and a half miles from hospital waiting for an ambulanceOr try this one, again no protesters delayed the ambulance, that's just how it is. A situation worthy of our anti-protester lobby and any right thinking person writing to their MP about. It's an absolute disgrace!
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Post by northwestman on Oct 15, 2021 9:47:56 GMT 1
We went through all this with Niuclear power: The scientists told us it would mean planty of cheap electricity. Oil was going to run out. What happened? The electricity wasn't cheap and the oil didn't run out. Before we rush headlong into electric cars and solar farms, just check what it would be best to still use oil and gas for, then make their use cleaner. Common sense required when we don't have a government with common sense..... That we have yet to be informed of where all the extra electricity is going to come from to support all the millions of electric cars and domestic boilers is a farce; that it has not been explained how we will get over the need for the sun to shine and the wind to blow just to give us basic electricity needs, absurd. The truth of the matter is, this is purely just a green-dream of grandeur by the Johnsons, a vanity project that will bankrupt this country in its pursuit. That it is being done, with no mandate from the British electorate, is a scandal of epic proportions. And this part of an article in the Telegraph suggests indoctrination and is almost Orwellian: "Numerous countries have not signed a net-zero target, and at times like these you can see why. Is it practical, or affordable? It’s easy to say you want green factories, less pollution and snug insulation by 2050. Such declarations can be made at any primary school assembly. My daughter went along to one last week, dressed in green as a “zero hero” with her class reciting the nation’s new environmental goals". In his book Mein Kampf, written in the 1920s, Hitler said, “Whoever has the youth has the future.” Thunberg looks to be assisting in this project.
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Post by davycrockett on Oct 15, 2021 9:53:57 GMT 1
Ever since net zero was set as Britain’s great national goal – an Apollo mission for our time – we have heard almost nothing about the price tag. Ministers promised that they’d get around to telling us before the Cop26 summit, but there’s still no word. And there are now just 16 days to go. Next week we’ll hear a bit more about the new heat pumps, which cost about £10,000 a throw. The current thinking is to offer a grant – perhaps as much as £7,000 – to those tempted (or forced) to take the plunge. But we’re unlikely to hear much about where we’d find the skilled workers needed to fit heat pumps at the rate of 2,000 a day. Throw in the transformation of roads (for electric cars), farms, factories and everything else and the price tag is likely to come in at over £1 trillion. The Climate Change Committee, which does the net zero sums, thinks it will be more like £50 billion a year from 2030 to make the transition, more than four times the sum raised by the coming National Insurance hike. The difference is that we’ve been told about the tax, whereas ministers are still talking as if net zero will be cost-free. A net zero agenda could (at a low estimate) cost the average household an extra £1,700 a year, piled on top of unpopular tax rises and an emerging cost-of-living crisis. Daily Telegraph. How about insulating houses? Would save some of the extra costs for households and go towards net zero 👍 the Telegraph are being a bit alarmist re fitting heat pumps. They’ve been around for ages and used extensively on commercial buildings and can be fitted by most refrigeration and heating engineers with a simple upgrade corse 👍
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Post by staffordshrew on Oct 15, 2021 13:28:43 GMT 1
Ever since net zero was set as Britain’s great national goal – an Apollo mission for our time – we have heard almost nothing about the price tag. Ministers promised that they’d get around to telling us before the Cop26 summit, but there’s still no word. And there are now just 16 days to go. Next week we’ll hear a bit more about the new heat pumps, which cost about £10,000 a throw. The current thinking is to offer a grant – perhaps as much as £7,000 – to those tempted (or forced) to take the plunge. But we’re unlikely to hear much about where we’d find the skilled workers needed to fit heat pumps at the rate of 2,000 a day. Throw in the transformation of roads (for electric cars), farms, factories and everything else and the price tag is likely to come in at over £1 trillion. The Climate Change Committee, which does the net zero sums, thinks it will be more like £50 billion a year from 2030 to make the transition, more than four times the sum raised by the coming National Insurance hike. The difference is that we’ve been told about the tax, whereas ministers are still talking as if net zero will be cost-free. A net zero agenda could (at a low estimate) cost the average household an extra £1,700 a year, piled on top of unpopular tax rises and an emerging cost-of-living crisis. Daily Telegraph. How about insulating houses? Would save some of the extra costs for households and go towards net zero 👍 the Telegraph are being a bit alarmist re fitting heat pumps. They’ve been around for ages and used extensively on commercial buildings and can be fitted by most refrigeration and heating engineers with a simple upgrade corse 👍 Market Drayton Lido had a heat pump system many years ago to heat the outdoor pool a few degrees for free. Found this account of it around 1980 - "a similar system which was heating the town’s pool at Market Drayton by taking heat from a small river (the Tern). This system used a big old Prestcold compressor which I was familiar with. Their system had been notoriously unreliable, as was much of the UK’s refrigeration plant at that time".
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Post by davycrockett on Oct 15, 2021 13:38:09 GMT 1
How about insulating houses? Would save some of the extra costs for households and go towards net zero 👍 the Telegraph are being a bit alarmist re fitting heat pumps. They’ve been around for ages and used extensively on commercial buildings and can be fitted by most refrigeration and heating engineers with a simple upgrade corse 👍 Market Drayton Lido had a heatpump system many years ago to heat the outdoor pool a few degrees for free. That’s a bit different ( more like groundsource) The heat pumps they’re talking about are what you see on nearly every office building / bank where you see the ‘air conditioning unit’ on the outside, that’s a heat pump giving warm air in the winter and cold in the summer.
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Post by servernaside on Oct 15, 2021 14:02:36 GMT 1
Mark Docherty from WMAS says “not unusual for a patient to be in the back of an ambulance for 7 hours or more. This is not acceptable” He adds ambulances can’t leave the hospital once stuck in a queue. He says one patient was 1.5 miles from RSH and died waiting for an ambulance And not a protester in sight. Let’s here the outrage chaps👍 Whataboutery personified.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2021 15:54:02 GMT 1
Mark Docherty from WMAS says “not unusual for a patient to be in the back of an ambulance for 7 hours or more. This is not acceptable” He adds ambulances can’t leave the hospital once stuck in a queue. He says one patient was 1.5 miles from RSH and died waiting for an ambulance And not a protester in sight. Let’s here the outrage chaps👍 Whataboutery personified. Fair enough. You highlight my whataboutery and highlight your hypocrisy and double standards👍
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Post by servernaside on Oct 15, 2021 17:37:56 GMT 1
Whataboutery personified. Fair enough. You highlight my whataboutery and highlight your hypocrisy and double standards👍 To equate an ambulance being held up in normal traffic queues with someone deliberately refusing to let one pass, requires a huge lapse of both logic and reason. You have however succeeded. Congratulations.
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Post by staffordshrew on Oct 15, 2021 18:17:08 GMT 1
Fair enough. You highlight my whataboutery and highlight your hypocrisy and double standards👍 To equate an ambulance being held up in normal traffic queues with someone deliberately refusing to let one pass, requires a huge lapse of both logic and reason. You have however succeeded. Congratulations. Is the fact that ambulances are out of service waiting to transfer patients into too busy A&Es, causing long delays in responding to emergency calls "normal traffic queues"?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2021 19:24:17 GMT 1
Fair enough. You highlight my whataboutery and highlight your hypocrisy and double standards👍 To equate an ambulance being held up in normal traffic queues with someone deliberately refusing to let one pass, requires a huge lapse of both logic and reason. You have however succeeded. Congratulations. Traffic queues? Who’s talking about traffic queues 😂
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2021 19:25:22 GMT 1
To equate an ambulance being held up in normal traffic queues with someone deliberately refusing to let one pass, requires a huge lapse of both logic and reason. You have however succeeded. Congratulations. Is the fact that ambulances are out of service waiting to transfer patients into too busy A&Es, causing long delays in responding to emergency calls "normal traffic queues"? He knows that. He’s just being silly😊👍
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Post by staffordshrew on Oct 15, 2021 19:31:03 GMT 1
Is the fact that ambulances are out of service waiting to transfer patients into too busy A&Es, causing long delays in responding to emergency calls "normal traffic queues"? He knows that. He’s just being silly😊👍 I usually read his posts and am left thinking he knows nothing. Very magnanimous of you to out it down to his just being silly.
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Post by northwestman on Oct 19, 2021 11:04:25 GMT 1
It was only a matter of time! www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10104881/Moment-furious-mother-RAMS-Insulate-Britain-activists-4x4-pushes-road.htmlNew footage has emerged showing an infuriated mother driving into Insulate Britain protesters with her car after they stopped her taking her 11-year-old son to school. The incident place as more 40 demonstrators ran out onto the road by traffic lights at junction 31 of the M25 near Thurrock, on the north side of the Dartford Crossing which links Essex to Kent. The footage - filmed by another person at to the protest - shows a woman, angry about being delayed taking her son to school, driving her vehicle into the back of two protesters.
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Post by martinshrew on Oct 19, 2021 11:29:38 GMT 1
Providing she's not one of those Mum's that drive their 4x4 600 meters to take their kids to school then good on her.
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Post by armchairfan on Oct 19, 2021 12:03:12 GMT 1
Providing she's not one of those Mum's that drive their 4x4 600 meters to take their kids to school then good on her. Sorry, Martin, but I cannot agree - I for one will not allow my anger and disgust with those protesters to drag me down to their level....what that lady seems to have done is commit an assault. I have a higher respect for the law than either her or those idiots on the road.
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Post by northwestman on Oct 19, 2021 12:42:40 GMT 1
Providing she's not one of those Mum's that drive their 4x4 600 meters to take their kids to school then good on her. I'm only too familiar with those! Congregate at the top of my road every weekday at 3.30, come rain or shine.
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Post by armchairfan on Oct 19, 2021 12:58:53 GMT 1
Providing she's not one of those Mum's that drive their 4x4 600 meters to take their kids to school then good on her. I'm only too familiar with those! Congregate at the top of my road every weekday at 3.30, come rain or shine. Ah yes - the infamous "school run", the causes of which are many and varied, from natural parental care for one's children, distance from home, down to sheer bloody idleness which is then inculcated into the children by default. The parents should really get together and organise better and less intrusive means of getting their children home, if only out of consideration for those living near the schools.
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Post by martinshrew on Oct 19, 2021 16:18:18 GMT 1
I'm only too familiar with those! Congregate at the top of my road every weekday at 3.30, come rain or shine. Ah yes - the infamous "school run", the causes of which are many and varied, from natural parental care for one's children, distance from home, down to sheer bloody idleness which is then inculcated into the children by default. The parents should really get together and organise better and less intrusive means of getting their children home, if only out of consideration for those living near the schools. Anyone driving less than half a mile to a school needs fining. Might help the obesity crisis as well.
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Post by servernaside on Oct 19, 2021 16:55:12 GMT 1
Why do people always label Mum's picking up their children from school as '4x4 drivers' when from personal observation, this is rarely the case.
Even if it were the case, so what? The amount of traffic congestion wouldn't change.
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Post by davycrockett on Oct 19, 2021 17:05:21 GMT 1
Ah yes - the infamous "school run", the causes of which are many and varied, from natural parental care for one's children, distance from home, down to sheer bloody idleness which is then inculcated into the children by default. The parents should really get together and organise better and less intrusive means of getting their children home, if only out of consideration for those living near the schools. Anyone driving less than half a mile to a school needs fining. Might help the obesity crisis as well. Under my plan you wouldn’t be allowed to choose a school for your child that required a car journey UNLESS you had a ‘green’ travel plan or no alternatives close by…… Interestingly Coleham have helped by closing Greyfriers Rd from 8.30 to 9.15 so you can’t stop outside and drop you kids off for safety reasons. As you can’t stop easily on Belle Vue Rd or Longden Coleham the official solution is park on Greyfriers Car Park on the other side of the river (behind telephone exchange) and walk over Greyfriers bridge…..I think most now walk or cycle but not sure how well it’s working for those that will always find a reason to use the car?
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Post by davycrockett on Oct 19, 2021 17:06:36 GMT 1
Why do people always label Mum's picking up their children from school as '4x4 drivers' when from personal observation, this is rarely the case. Even if it were the case, so what? The amount of traffic congestion wouldn't change. Try driving down London Road in the morning and they’re queuing up to get into Prestfeld… almost every car.
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Post by servernaside on Oct 19, 2021 17:16:27 GMT 1
Why do people always label Mum's picking up their children from school as '4x4 drivers' when from personal observation, this is rarely the case. Even if it were the case, so what? The amount of traffic congestion wouldn't change. Try driving down London Road in the morning and they’re queuing up to get into Prestfeld… almost every car. This is not the case at state schools such as Harlescott, Priory and Meole Brace. But why let the complete picture get in the way of a good rant about 4X4s.
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Post by northwestman on Oct 19, 2021 17:17:48 GMT 1
Why do people always label Mum's picking up their children from school as '4x4 drivers' when from personal observation, this is rarely the case. Even if it were the case, so what? The amount of traffic congestion wouldn't change. Try driving down London Road in the morning and they’re queuing up to get into Prestfeld… almost every car. Try driving past schools in the so called 'Golden Triangle' of Wilmslow, Hale, Hale Barns, Alderley Edge, Bowden and Prestbury and you'd certainly find a very high % of 4x4s outside them.
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Post by armchairfan on Oct 19, 2021 18:01:19 GMT 1
Why do people always label Mum's picking up their children from school as '4x4 drivers' when from personal observation, this is rarely the case. Even if it were the case, so what? The amount of traffic congestion wouldn't change. Technically, a fair comment, but it and the expression "Chelsea tractor" have become clichés, so 100% accurate or not, it makes the point so I don't object too much.
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Post by servernaside on Oct 19, 2021 18:01:57 GMT 1
I would have thought that the use of the term, "Golden Triangle' says it all.
Not therefore representative of the overall picture.
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