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Post by Bob Rickerton on Jul 19, 2021 17:31:48 GMT 1
On the subject of masks, I've seen the results of a poll (Opinium Research) that asked people what they thought was most effective way of reducing the spread and below are the results. I appreciate its one poll but for me it's depressing and reinforces my belief that a lot of people are wearing a mask thinking they are doing their bit but actually could be doing a lot more. Wearing a mask - 54% Distancing - 49% Washing hands - 43% Ventilation - 28% Cleaning Surfaces - 20% Just the 1 question - if wearing a mask is the biggest factor in reducing the spread, how come the figures have been rising at the rate they have these last few weeks when we have pretty much all been wearing them? What is so different to when the figures were going down a few months ago when we were all pretty much wearing them also? If Ollie Norburn played every game in the first month of the season but we lost all our games due to other factors it wouldn't mean Ollie Norburn is s**t and should be transfer listed.
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Post by venceremos on Jul 19, 2021 17:33:03 GMT 1
Pughy, you fatally undermined your arguments in this area some time ago when you likened the virus to a bad cold, or some such nonsense. Please find a comment of mine that I have said that? I can guarantee I have not said such a thing. I was sure you had, because I remember thinking at the time that I wasn't going to be drawn to comment. Somebody definitely did say something like that but I'm not searching for it so, if you're guaranteeing that it wasn't you who did, I'll take that at face value and apologise to you. Someone on here definitely did.
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Jul 19, 2021 17:36:30 GMT 1
Just the 1 question - if wearing a mask is the biggest factor in reducing the spread, how come the figures have been rising at the rate they have these last few weeks when we have pretty much all been wearing them? What is so different to when the figures were going down a few months ago when we were all pretty much wearing them also? If Ollie Norburn played every game in the first month of the season but we lost all our games due to other factors it wouldn't mean Ollie Norburn is s**t and should be transfer listed. Very random comment - sure you are on the right thread 😄
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Post by Bob Rickerton on Jul 19, 2021 17:52:38 GMT 1
If Ollie Norburn played every game in the first month of the season but we lost all our games due to other factors it wouldn't mean Ollie Norburn is s**t and should be transfer listed. Very random comment - sure you are on the right thread 😄 Google "false equivalence" and return to the thread. Cheers.
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Post by pughywasfree on Jul 19, 2021 17:53:07 GMT 1
Please find a comment of mine that I have said that? I can guarantee I have not said such a thing. I was sure you had, because I remember thinking at the time that I wasn't going to be drawn to comment. Somebody definitely did say something like that but I'm not searching for it so, if you're guaranteeing that it wasn't you who did, I'll take that at face value and apologise to you. Someone on here definitely did. The closest I got is that younger people are not at much of a risk of becoming seriously ill and would have symptoms similar to a cold. I would never down play the seriousness of the virus to someone that was in the high risk group. Apology accepted
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Jul 19, 2021 19:32:49 GMT 1
Very random comment - sure you are on the right thread 😄 Google "false equivalence" and return to the thread. Cheers. I know exactly what you were doing thanks, not stupid. You are quite good at putting out "random posts" that appear to have no meaning so used to it from you by now.
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Post by Pilch on Jul 19, 2021 20:35:45 GMT 1
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Post by South Stand Salopian on Jul 19, 2021 20:41:32 GMT 1
Nobody should feel embarrassed to wear facemasks, some people wear Wrexham shirts in public!
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Post by staffordshrew on Jul 19, 2021 21:33:49 GMT 1
[br it’s more like breathing out 20% of the virus instead of 100% Apart from wearing bio hazard masks it’s a simple cheap manageable sensible precaution that saves lives Does it save lives? I have not seen anything concrete to suggest they make any difference. This article is a bit lengthy but it explains the confusion around the effectiveness of masks sciencebasedmedicine.org/do-face-masks-decrease-the-risk-of-covid-19-transmission/Confusion maybe, but is it not common sense to not end face mask wearing on the very same day that the 1Metre plus rule is recinded? Any sort of barrier over the airways must surely provide a little more " distance" from other people?
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Post by staffordshrew on Jul 19, 2021 21:39:06 GMT 1
Nobody should feel embarrassed to wear facemasks, some people wear Wrexham shirts in public! Hopefully no one will be laughed at for wearing a face mask....
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Jul 19, 2021 22:24:03 GMT 1
Nobody should feel embarrassed to wear facemasks, some people wear Wrexham shirts in public! Will give you that one - I would still go with a face mask if the other option was a Wrexham shirt
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Post by venceremos on Jul 19, 2021 22:29:59 GMT 1
Confusion maybe, but is it not common sense to not end face mask wearing on the very same day that the 1Metre plus rule is recinded? Any sort of barrier over the airways must surely provide a little more " distance" from other people? MIT Medical (an academic body with a global reputation) quoted the findings of a study in 16 US states between March-May 2020 which found that "mask mandates led to a marked slowdown in the daily growth rate, estimating that mask mandates may have prevented up to 450,000 cases of COVID-19". That's 450,000 cases prevented in only 16 US states. MIT Medical also referred to two real life cases: "In one early case, a man flew from Wuhan to Toronto with a dry cough and subsequently tested positive for COVID-19. He wore a mask during the flight, and no other passengers tested positive. In a more recent instance, two hair stylists employed in a newly reopened hair salon in Springfield, Missouri, worked on a combined 140 clients while sick with COVID-19. Everyone wore a mask per state order, and no clients tested positive." There have been some conflicting reports but perhaps those have been similar to the Danmask-19 study, in which 3,000 people wore masks for a month and 3,000 didn't (it wasn't mandatory at the time). The study found that there was no statistical difference in terms of becoming infected with Covid between those wearing masks and those not. But I don't think it's ever been seriously argued that cloth masks protect the wearer. Medical grade masks do that because they're for use with infected patients. The masks we wear are for the protection of others and, in that, they seem to have been very successful. That's why I'll continue to wear a mask indoors in public places until the data shows the virus to be properly contained.
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Post by Pilch on Jul 19, 2021 22:39:17 GMT 1
Nobody should feel embarrassed to wear facemasks, some people wear Wrexham shirts in public! Will give you that one - I would still go with a face mask if the other option was a Wrexham shirt I’d wear a Wrexham shirt if it helped prevent covid
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Post by pughywasfree on Jul 19, 2021 22:55:42 GMT 1
Confusion maybe, but is it not common sense to not end face mask wearing on the very same day that the 1Metre plus rule is recinded? Any sort of barrier over the airways must surely provide a little more " distance" from other people? MIT Medical (an academic body with a global reputation) quoted the findings of a study in 16 US states between March-May 2020 which found that "mask mandates led to a marked slowdown in the daily growth rate, estimating that mask mandates may have prevented up to 450,000 cases of COVID-19". That's 450,000 cases prevented in only 16 US states. MIT Medical also referred to two real life cases: "In one early case, a man flew from Wuhan to Toronto with a dry cough and subsequently tested positive for COVID-19. He wore a mask during the flight, and no other passengers tested positive. In a more recent instance, two hair stylists employed in a newly reopened hair salon in Springfield, Missouri, worked on a combined 140 clients while sick with COVID-19. Everyone wore a mask per state order, and no clients tested positive." There have been some conflicting reports but perhaps those have been similar to the Danmask-19 study, in which 3,000 people wore masks for a month and 3,000 didn't (it wasn't mandatory at the time). The study found that there was no statistical difference in terms of becoming infected with Covid between those wearing masks and those not. But I don't think it's ever been seriously argued that cloth masks protect the wearer. Medical grade masks do that because they're for use with infected patients. The masks we wear are for the protection of others and, in that, they seem to have been very successful. That's why I'll continue to wear a mask indoors in public places until the data shows the virus to be properly contained. Just for a bit of context I spent 16 hours with 2 people in a confined space who tested positive for Covid-19 the next day. No masks and no social distancing. I never caught Covid. Maybe its just not that transmissive?
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Post by dachshund on Jul 20, 2021 6:08:22 GMT 1
MIT Medical (an academic body with a global reputation) quoted the findings of a study in 16 US states between March-May 2020 which found that "mask mandates led to a marked slowdown in the daily growth rate, estimating that mask mandates may have prevented up to 450,000 cases of COVID-19". That's 450,000 cases prevented in only 16 US states. MIT Medical also referred to two real life cases: "In one early case, a man flew from Wuhan to Toronto with a dry cough and subsequently tested positive for COVID-19. He wore a mask during the flight, and no other passengers tested positive. In a more recent instance, two hair stylists employed in a newly reopened hair salon in Springfield, Missouri, worked on a combined 140 clients while sick with COVID-19. Everyone wore a mask per state order, and no clients tested positive." There have been some conflicting reports but perhaps those have been similar to the Danmask-19 study, in which 3,000 people wore masks for a month and 3,000 didn't (it wasn't mandatory at the time). The study found that there was no statistical difference in terms of becoming infected with Covid between those wearing masks and those not. But I don't think it's ever been seriously argued that cloth masks protect the wearer. Medical grade masks do that because they're for use with infected patients. The masks we wear are for the protection of others and, in that, they seem to have been very successful. That's why I'll continue to wear a mask indoors in public places until the data shows the virus to be properly contained. Just for a bit of context I spent 16 hours with 2 people in a confined space who tested positive for Covid-19 the next day. No masks and no social distancing. I never caught Covid. Maybe its just not that transmissive? Could be onto something here. This virus that has spread rapidly across the entire world is ‘just not that transmissive’.
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Post by staffordshrew on Jul 20, 2021 7:48:04 GMT 1
Confusion maybe, but is it not common sense to not end face mask wearing on the very same day that the 1Metre plus rule is recinded? Any sort of barrier over the airways must surely provide a little more " distance" from other people? MIT Medical (an academic body with a global reputation) quoted the findings of a study in 16 US states between March-May 2020 which found that "mask mandates led to a marked slowdown in the daily growth rate, estimating that mask mandates may have prevented up to 450,000 cases of COVID-19". That's 450,000 cases prevented in only 16 US states. MIT Medical also referred to two real life cases: "In one early case, a man flew from Wuhan to Toronto with a dry cough and subsequently tested positive for COVID-19. He wore a mask during the flight, and no other passengers tested positive. In a more recent instance, two hair stylists employed in a newly reopened hair salon in Springfield, Missouri, worked on a combined 140 clients while sick with COVID-19. Everyone wore a mask per state order, and no clients tested positive." There have been some conflicting reports but perhaps those have been similar to the Danmask-19 study, in which 3,000 people wore masks for a month and 3,000 didn't (it wasn't mandatory at the time). The study found that there was no statistical difference in terms of becoming infected with Covid between those wearing masks and those not. But I don't think it's ever been seriously argued that cloth masks protect the wearer. Medical grade masks do that because they're for use with infected patients. The masks we wear are for the protection of others and, in that, they seem to have been very successful. That's why I'll continue to wear a mask indoors in public places until the data shows the virus to be properly contained. I'll continue to wear a face mask in public places because it seems like common sense to me and out of respect to those who are wearing one.
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Post by davycrockett on Jul 20, 2021 8:30:47 GMT 1
MIT Medical (an academic body with a global reputation) quoted the findings of a study in 16 US states between March-May 2020 which found that "mask mandates led to a marked slowdown in the daily growth rate, estimating that mask mandates may have prevented up to 450,000 cases of COVID-19". That's 450,000 cases prevented in only 16 US states. MIT Medical also referred to two real life cases: "In one early case, a man flew from Wuhan to Toronto with a dry cough and subsequently tested positive for COVID-19. He wore a mask during the flight, and no other passengers tested positive. In a more recent instance, two hair stylists employed in a newly reopened hair salon in Springfield, Missouri, worked on a combined 140 clients while sick with COVID-19. Everyone wore a mask per state order, and no clients tested positive." There have been some conflicting reports but perhaps those have been similar to the Danmask-19 study, in which 3,000 people wore masks for a month and 3,000 didn't (it wasn't mandatory at the time). The study found that there was no statistical difference in terms of becoming infected with Covid between those wearing masks and those not. But I don't think it's ever been seriously argued that cloth masks protect the wearer. Medical grade masks do that because they're for use with infected patients. The masks we wear are for the protection of others and, in that, they seem to have been very successful. That's why I'll continue to wear a mask indoors in public places until the data shows the virus to be properly contained. Just for a bit of context I spent 16 hours with 2 people in a confined space who tested positive for Covid-19 the next day. No masks and no social distancing. I never caught Covid. Maybe its just not that transmissive? I take it you self isolated when you found out? Well done 👍
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Jul 20, 2021 8:43:32 GMT 1
MIT Medical (an academic body with a global reputation) quoted the findings of a study in 16 US states between March-May 2020 which found that "mask mandates led to a marked slowdown in the daily growth rate, estimating that mask mandates may have prevented up to 450,000 cases of COVID-19". That's 450,000 cases prevented in only 16 US states. MIT Medical also referred to two real life cases: "In one early case, a man flew from Wuhan to Toronto with a dry cough and subsequently tested positive for COVID-19. He wore a mask during the flight, and no other passengers tested positive. In a more recent instance, two hair stylists employed in a newly reopened hair salon in Springfield, Missouri, worked on a combined 140 clients while sick with COVID-19. Everyone wore a mask per state order, and no clients tested positive." There have been some conflicting reports but perhaps those have been similar to the Danmask-19 study, in which 3,000 people wore masks for a month and 3,000 didn't (it wasn't mandatory at the time). The study found that there was no statistical difference in terms of becoming infected with Covid between those wearing masks and those not. But I don't think it's ever been seriously argued that cloth masks protect the wearer. Medical grade masks do that because they're for use with infected patients. The masks we wear are for the protection of others and, in that, they seem to have been very successful. That's why I'll continue to wear a mask indoors in public places until the data shows the virus to be properly contained. I'll continue to wear a face mask in public places because it seems like common sense to me and out of respect to those who are wearing one. Will probably doing so for the rest of your life then. Enjoy. Others like me wont.
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Post by staffordshrew on Jul 20, 2021 9:05:13 GMT 1
I'll continue to wear a face mask in public places because it seems like common sense to me and out of respect to those who are wearing one. Will probably doing so for the rest of your life then. Enjoy. Others like me wont. If it wasn't law, would you ditch wearing a seatbelt in a car?
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Post by Chief Inspector Swan on Jul 20, 2021 9:10:04 GMT 1
Until this thread I hadn’t been aware of the sheer volume of scientific expertise we harboured on this board. I might go back and conduct a cold file review of all the other non-football threads.
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Post by SeanBroseley on Jul 20, 2021 9:15:35 GMT 1
What this thread shows - rather than a lack of respect for individual choice and freedoms - is the expertise that the Conservative Party has shown in managing the politics of the pandemic - as opposed to the pandemic itself.
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Post by SeanBroseley on Jul 20, 2021 9:20:15 GMT 1
Of course, there is a difference between being a scientific expert yourself and seeking a wide range of opinion based on knowledge gathered through a scientific method, because you don't trust your country's government to act in good faith.
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Post by staffordshrew on Jul 20, 2021 9:22:09 GMT 1
What this thread shows - rather than a lack of respect for individual choice and freedoms - is the expertise that the Conservative Party has shown in managing the politics of the pandemic - as opposed to the pandemic itself. Have they shown any expertise in managing the politics of the pandemic or the pandemic?
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Post by thesensationaljt on Jul 20, 2021 9:40:19 GMT 1
Nobody should feel embarrassed to wear facemasks, some people wear Wrexham shirts in public! Hopefully no one will be laughed at for wearing a face mask.... People have always laughed at me whether I'm wearing a facemask or not.
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Post by staffordshrew on Jul 20, 2021 9:44:59 GMT 1
Hopefully no one will be laughed at for wearing a face mask.... People have always laughed at me whether I'm wearing a facemask or not. Cue the old Bob Monkhouse joke: "People laughed at me when I said I wanted to be a comedian, well, they are not laughing now are they!"
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Jul 20, 2021 9:57:32 GMT 1
Will probably doing so for the rest of your life then. Enjoy. Others like me wont. If it wasn't law, would you ditch wearing a seatbelt in a car? If it wasnt law I would do my own risk assessment of the dangers and make my own decision as to what steps to take. Something we should all do in every walk of life. And what we are now being encouraged to do in respect of Covid. ( I accept that in recent years we have not been encouraged to do this so many are out of the habit of it).
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Post by filmcrewshrew1 on Jul 20, 2021 10:02:06 GMT 1
I will like many use common sense on wearing a mask, crowded area indoors YES.... a shop that's almost empty - definitely NOT. I will however still do a u-turn if I go out without one in the pocket as for now best to have just in case.
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Jul 20, 2021 10:57:19 GMT 1
Will probably doing so for the rest of your life then. Enjoy. Others like me wont. If it wasn't law, would you ditch wearing a seatbelt in a car? The anti face mask comments now are very reminiscent of the opposition to compulsory seat belt wearing 50 years ago. The opposition to compulsion was led by Enoch Powell. It almost 20 years from the date that fitting seat belts in cars was mandatory until actually wearing them became law. History repeats itself.
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Post by Valerioch on Jul 20, 2021 11:00:41 GMT 1
If it wasn't law, would you ditch wearing a seatbelt in a car? The anti face mask comments now are very reminiscent of the opposition to compulsory seat belt wearing 50 years ago. The opposition to compulsion was led by Enoch Powell. It almost 20 years from the date that fitting seat belts in cars was mandatory until actually wearing them became law. History repeats itself. Very odd comparison in my opinion, I'm struggling to think of a single negative/downside of a seatbelt, whereas a facemask has many pitfalls and detrimental effects to human society
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Jul 20, 2021 11:02:22 GMT 1
Brady is my MP and is on the intellectual level of Shrewsbury’s own DK. Another hard line libertarian with no medical or scientific qualifications. 15 months ago he was busy denying there was an epidemic. I read that Brady was the first guest on Farage’s new GBN show. Further comment is superfluous.
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