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Post by armchairfan on Jul 19, 2021 9:43:22 GMT 1
How about ‘Neil Oliver and I have no scientific or medical qualifications, therefore I will ignore him and I will take notice of those who are appropriately qualified“? How about "I will take notice of any opinion which matches my own, and view any other opinion with contempt and disdain"? Yes, it is confirmation bias, to which admittedly most of us are subject, but that does not invalidate an opinion per se.
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Post by davycrockett on Jul 19, 2021 9:45:09 GMT 1
This thread highlights the problem to come. We will end up with people with opposing opinions on mask wearing sniping at each other and both sides sneering and tutting are each other. Since Brexit and Trump the world has moved to such a polarised place. I will keep wearing mine where I believe it’s appropriate. Not sure of impact but little effort to me for my hourly supermarket shop if it makes others feel comfortable. However won’t be bothered if others don’t. Spot on, considering its supposedly a choice as to whether people want to wear them, it's amazing how many people are getting criticised for their choice (whatever that is). It's a choice But folk have the right to request it in their establishment be it a train or a busy shop.... Its the ones that refuse to go with the request that cause the problem...
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Post by Pilch on Jul 19, 2021 9:55:22 GMT 1
Masks don't make any difference. When they were first introduced they had zero impact on the curve of infections. It's like throwing a bucket of water at a wired fence and hoping the person standing on the other side does not get wet. Deeply saddened by the amount of people that are still so petrified to release themselves from their muzzle. Many of which are most likely jabbed up already. All the venerable people have had the vaccine (that are able to). Why the hell would people voluntarily wear masks? only reason I can think of is that they have succumb to the scaremongering and are now too petrified of their own breath. I have not warn a mask throughout, I am exempt but I doubt I would have warn one anyway as they make me very uncomfortable. Our own government stated at the start of this s**t show that there is little evidence to suggest they make any difference. Even Mr scaremonger himself (Dr Hillary) has said that masks do very little. I believe we are only being allowed this reward of a taste of normality so that come September when we need another lockdown people are more accommodating. Good old Boris has opened everything up but is still demanding that everyone isolates if they walk into the same room as someone who later has a positive test. It is moronic. It will lead to a further decay of our economy. **** freedom day, free yourself. It was glorious to see what was happening over in France over the weekend in response to the horrendous restrictions they are being forced to endure. I am in no doubt many would not have seen anything about it though as the MSM ignored it. [br it’s more like breathing out 20% of the virus instead of 100% Apart from wearing bio hazard masks it’s a simple cheap manageable sensible precaution that saves lives
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Post by pughywasfree on Jul 19, 2021 9:57:39 GMT 1
Masks don't make any difference. When they were first introduced they had zero impact on the curve of infections. It's like throwing a bucket of water at a wired fence and hoping the person standing on the other side does not get wet. Deeply saddened by the amount of people that are still so petrified to release themselves from their muzzle. Many of which are most likely jabbed up already. All the venerable people have had the vaccine (that are able to). Why the hell would people voluntarily wear masks? only reason I can think of is that they have succumb to the scaremongering and are now too petrified of their own breath. I have not warn a mask throughout, I am exempt but I doubt I would have warn one anyway as they make me very uncomfortable. Our own government stated at the start of this s**t show that there is little evidence to suggest they make any difference. Even Mr scaremonger himself (Dr Hillary) has said that masks do very little. I believe we are only being allowed this reward of a taste of normality so that come September when we need another lockdown people are more accommodating. Good old Boris has opened everything up but is still demanding that everyone isolates if they walk into the same room as someone who later has a positive test. It is moronic. It will lead to a further decay of our economy. **** freedom day, free yourself. It was glorious to see what was happening over in France over the weekend in response to the horrendous restrictions they are being forced to endure. I am in no doubt many would not have seen anything about it though as the MSM ignored it. [br it’s more like breathing out 20% of the virus instead of 100% Apart from wearing bio hazard masks it’s a simple cheap manageable sensible precaution that saves lives Does it save lives? I have not seen anything concrete to suggest they make any difference. This article is a bit lengthy but it explains the confusion around the effectiveness of masks sciencebasedmedicine.org/do-face-masks-decrease-the-risk-of-covid-19-transmission/
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2021 10:20:13 GMT 1
Spot on, considering its supposedly a choice as to whether people want to wear them, it's amazing how many people are getting criticised for their choice (whatever that is). It's a choice But folk have the right to request it in their establishment be it a train or a busy shop.... Its the ones that refuse to go with the request that cause the problem... Absolutely and like I've said, businesses have been thrown under a bus by a gov't who want the population to wear them but won't order them to, so it's now up to the businesses to decide and then police it. My view is anyone who chooses not to wear a mask should accept that they may be asked to put on a mask (and observe other measures) to gain access, they can either choose to comply or if they don't want to then they should walk away and respect it's that businesses choice. Very idealistic I know and unfortunately we know that there will be some who don't do this But on the other hand, if people have chosen not to wear a mask then I'd personally say those people should be free to go around living their life without abuse, however based on the animosity I've seen on here and across social media generally, I suspect that might also be wishful thinking.
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Jul 19, 2021 10:24:15 GMT 1
It's a choice But folk have the right to request it in their establishment be it a train or a busy shop.... Its the ones that refuse to go with the request that cause the problem... Absolutely and like I've said, businesses have been thrown under a bus by a gov't who want the population to wear them but won't order them to, so it's now up to the businesses to decide and then police it. My view is anyone who chooses not to wear a mask should accept that they may be asked to put on a mask (and observe other measures) to gain access, they can either choose to comply or if they don't want to then they should walk away and respect it's that businesses choice. Very idealistic I know and unfortunately we know that there will be some who don't do this But on the other hand, if people have chosen not to wear a mask then I'd personally say those people should be free to go around living their life without abuse, however based on the animosity I've seen on here and across social media generally, I suspect that might also be wishful thinking. Agree with all that.
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Post by pughywasfree on Jul 19, 2021 10:42:35 GMT 1
It's a choice But folk have the right to request it in their establishment be it a train or a busy shop.... Its the ones that refuse to go with the request that cause the problem... Absolutely and like I've said, businesses have been thrown under a bus by a gov't who want the population to wear them but won't order them to, so it's now up to the businesses to decide and then police it. My view is anyone who chooses not to wear a mask should accept that they may be asked to put on a mask (and observe other measures) to gain access, they can either choose to comply or if they don't want to then they should walk away and respect it's that businesses choice. Very idealistic I know and unfortunately we know that there will be some who don't do this But on the other hand, if people have chosen not to wear a mask then I'd personally say those people should be free to go around living their life without abuse, however based on the animosity I've seen on here and across social media generally, I suspect that might also be wishful thinking. Spot on. It day one of people being trusted to keep themselves and others safe without being told what to do. There was always going to be issues. It will calm down soon and I expect people to stop wearing masks over time (until they are made mandatory again at least)
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Post by Pilch on Jul 19, 2021 10:49:37 GMT 1
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Post by ssshrew on Jul 19, 2021 11:09:12 GMT 1
Just back from shopping. Plenty of no masks outside but pleased to say I only saw one person not wearing a mask in the shops but they may have been exempt anyway for all I know. Everyone seemed relaxed about it all.
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Post by northwestman on Jul 19, 2021 11:10:07 GMT 1
How about ‘Neil Oliver and I have no scientific or medical qualifications, therefore I will ignore him and I will take notice of those who are appropriately qualified“? Behavioural Psychologists like Michie and Reicher are no more qualified than Brady and Oliver. Their main function is to instil fear into the general population.
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Post by dachshund on Jul 19, 2021 11:40:04 GMT 1
One of Brady’s several homes is in the same block as me, and encounters thus far confirm that he’s a grade a clown.
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Post by northwestman on Jul 19, 2021 11:55:47 GMT 1
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Post by dachshund on Jul 19, 2021 11:59:26 GMT 1
Well, quite
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Jul 19, 2021 13:13:52 GMT 1
How about ‘Neil Oliver and I have no scientific or medical qualifications, therefore I will ignore him and I will take notice of those who are appropriately qualified“? Behavioural Psychologists like Michie and Reicher are no more qualified than Brady and Oliver. Their main function is to instil fear into the general population. Behavioural Psychology is a pseudo science that was given a boost by David Cameron when he established the ‘nudge’ unit in No. 10. The people behind it became rich when it was subsequently privatised. My opinion is that changing behaviour is very difficult and that the ‘nudge’ people are peripheral at best. The experts whose opinions I value are epidemiologists and virologists.
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Post by venceremos on Jul 19, 2021 13:37:03 GMT 1
Many thanks for that opinion, but I have to ask exactly what scientific or medical evidence you have for proclaiming the comment to be "wild and over-exaggerated"; the history of this sad episode will not be written for some years, probably decades, so please refrain from disguising your opinion as fact, something of which you have doubtlessly accused some of us on here who happen to hold contrary views. I have often wondered whether you have contrary views or cont-rary views He's forgotten that I no longer see his posts! But, as your reply has put this one before my eyes, I'm reminded why I decided to block them in the first place and why I haven't the slightest intention of unblocking them.
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Post by venceremos on Jul 19, 2021 13:38:51 GMT 1
[br it’s more like breathing out 20% of the virus instead of 100% Apart from wearing bio hazard masks it’s a simple cheap manageable sensible precaution that saves lives Does it save lives? I have not seen anything concrete to suggest they make any difference. This article is a bit lengthy but it explains the confusion around the effectiveness of masks sciencebasedmedicine.org/do-face-masks-decrease-the-risk-of-covid-19-transmission/Pughy, you fatally undermined your arguments in this area some time ago when you likened the virus to a bad cold, or some such nonsense.
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Post by MetaShrew on Jul 19, 2021 14:19:08 GMT 1
The mask slipped from Johnson years ago.
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Jul 19, 2021 14:41:00 GMT 1
Just popped into my local Co OP, me without a mask and 1 other customer (with one). They must have know I was coming....
As we are very good these days of manipulating the statistics I make that 50% have ditched it 😉
The cashier was also not wearing, nor was the postman going to collect stuff from the counter. So can I make that 75% not wearing one 😉🙂
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Post by SeanBroseley on Jul 19, 2021 15:01:06 GMT 1
No. Go ahead and don't wear one if you like - but don't come near me. I will be interested in which shops will still require a mask - hopefully enough for me to have the freedom to shop for essentials in an environment that is to my liking. I will be voting with my money.
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Post by martinshrew on Jul 19, 2021 15:06:20 GMT 1
Minimal respect for personal choice on this thread.
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Post by venceremos on Jul 19, 2021 15:07:52 GMT 1
Just popped into my local Co OP, me without a mask and 1 other customer (with one). They must have know I was coming.... As we are very good these days of manipulating the statistics I make that 50% have ditched it 😉 The cashier was also not wearing, nor was the postman going to collect stuff from the counter. So can I make that 75% not wearing one 😉🙂 You seem very pleased with yourself. I'd say each to their own but that's not really how this works.
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Jul 19, 2021 15:14:05 GMT 1
Just popped into my local Co OP, me without a mask and 1 other customer (with one). They must have know I was coming.... As we are very good these days of manipulating the statistics I make that 50% have ditched it 😉 The cashier was also not wearing, nor was the postman going to collect stuff from the counter. So can I make that 75% not wearing one 😉🙂 You seem very pleased with yourself. I'd say each to their own but that's not really how this works. Not pleased with myself, I've just made my choice. And just reporting back here on what I've found today. Was nice to go ctually into a shop and be able to breath, especially in this weather.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2021 15:36:43 GMT 1
On the subject of masks, I've seen the results of a poll (Opinium Research) that asked people what they thought was most effective way of reducing the spread and below are the results. I appreciate its one poll but for me it's depressing and reinforces my belief that a lot of people are wearing a mask thinking they are doing their bit but actually could be doing a lot more.
Wearing a mask - 54% Distancing - 49% Washing hands - 43% Ventilation - 28% Cleaning Surfaces - 20%
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Post by dachshund on Jul 19, 2021 15:41:30 GMT 1
I don’t think many people have an issue when others have reviewed the rules and decided against wearing a mask.
The issue is with the gleeful and the proud, who can’t wait to tell everyone in earshot that they’re exercising personal choice, as if they’ve learned to use a potty. Kind of guys who will start a whole thread on the topic, say it ‘has to be asked’, then confirm that they never go to the shops anyway
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Post by South Stand Salopian on Jul 19, 2021 15:52:00 GMT 1
I don’t think many people have an issue when others have reviewed the rules and decided against wearing a mask. The issue is with the gleeful and the proud, who can’t wait to tell everyone in earshot that they’re exercising personal choice, as if they’ve learned to use a potty. Kind of guys who will start a whole thread on the topic, say it ‘has to be asked’, then confirm that they never go to the shops anyway Exactly, the non mask wearing posters come across as boastful and distasteful if you ask me. ‘Look at me I’m not going going to wear my mask and there’s nothing anybody can do about it’.
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Jul 19, 2021 15:53:50 GMT 1
On the subject of masks, I've seen the results of a poll (Opinium Research) that asked people what they thought was most effective way of reducing the spread and below are the results. I appreciate its one poll but for me it's depressing and reinforces my belief that a lot of people are wearing a mask thinking they are doing their bit but actually could be doing a lot more. Wearing a mask - 54% Distancing - 49% Washing hands - 43% Ventilation - 28% Cleaning Surfaces - 20% Just the 1 question - if wearing a mask is the biggest factor in reducing the spread, how come the figures have been rising at the rate they have these last few weeks when we have pretty much all been wearing them? What is so different to when the figures were going down a few months ago when we were all pretty much wearing them also?
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Post by South Stand Salopian on Jul 19, 2021 15:59:30 GMT 1
On the subject of masks, I've seen the results of a poll (Opinium Research) that asked people what they thought was most effective way of reducing the spread and below are the results. I appreciate its one poll but for me it's depressing and reinforces my belief that a lot of people are wearing a mask thinking they are doing their bit but actually could be doing a lot more. Wearing a mask - 54% Distancing - 49% Washing hands - 43% Ventilation - 28% Cleaning Surfaces - 20% Just the 1 question - if wearing a mask is the biggest factor in reducing the spread, how come the figures have been rising at the rate they have these last few weeks when we have pretty much all been wearing them? We’ve been relaxing the rules that’s why. Hardly anybody was seen wearing them at the latest Euro’s.
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Post by venceremos on Jul 19, 2021 16:36:12 GMT 1
On the subject of masks, I've seen the results of a poll (Opinium Research) that asked people what they thought was most effective way of reducing the spread and below are the results. I appreciate its one poll but for me it's depressing and reinforces my belief that a lot of people are wearing a mask thinking they are doing their bit but actually could be doing a lot more. Wearing a mask - 54% Distancing - 49% Washing hands - 43% Ventilation - 28% Cleaning Surfaces - 20% Just the 1 question - if wearing a mask is the biggest factor in reducing the spread, how come the figures have been rising at the rate they have these last few weeks when we have pretty much all been wearing them? What is so different to when the figures were going down a few months ago when we were all pretty much wearing them also? Partly because we didn't close the border with India and because we're conducting an experiment (as everyone admits, I think) in allowing large crowds for events like Euro 2020, Wimbledon, the Grand Prix etc. When the parameters are changed so radically in allowing large gatherings, it makes no sense to then say a rise in infections proves the wearing of masks is ineffective. I'd add that it appears to be a poll being quoted, so it merely shows what those members of the public believed to be effective. As has been shown countless times since all this began, the vast majority of us aren't qualified to say very much on this topic, and unqualified opinions have no real value to anyone else - which is why I'll continue to take note of what the epidemiologists and virologists say, rather than the self-important likes of Neil Oliver and Laurence Fox.
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Post by pughywasfree on Jul 19, 2021 16:51:12 GMT 1
Pughy, you fatally undermined your arguments in this area some time ago when you likened the virus to a bad cold, or some such nonsense. Please find a comment of mine that I have said that? I can guarantee I have not said such a thing.
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Post by davycrockett on Jul 19, 2021 17:01:44 GMT 1
No. Go ahead and don't wear one if you like - but don't come near me. I will be interested in which shops will still require a mask - hopefully enough for me to have the freedom to shop for essentials in an environment that is to my liking. I will be voting with my money. Went into Home Bargains earlier and was amazed nearly everyone had a mask and ‘adverts’ on Home Bargains in house radio saying take care and be considerate…..a couple of lanyards and a couple of ‘I don’t give a stuff’ types but all very friendly.
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