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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on Feb 18, 2015 16:33:47 GMT 1
There's no need for a station. None at all. For the same money you could buy us all taxis for a decade.
The concourses are too narrow and unheated, with toilets designed without a care in the world for the fact more than one person at a time might be using them.
There's nowhere to sit for the older / younger fan.
I went in the away stand at Burton. Decent wide heated concourse, painted white so it didn't look like a car park, well designed toilets with a single moving queue and warm water, clear lanes for buffet queuing, flip down seats in the concourse, decent prices.
It's not that difficult.
The fanzone at the Etihad isn't the half of it. Large, well presented concourses with decent toilets, bars, bookies etc. Yes it's a bigger stadium but they're also catering for 30000 more people and it works brilliantly.
If the back wall of the west stand had been built ten foot further back, the whole length, it wouldn't have cost us any more and would have changed everything.
If the Shropshire fa offices in the south stand had been two storey we'd have had the bar downstairs and the offices above and the bar open at half time.
The buffet queue in the south stand at half time at the Chelsea game was twenty minutes. You do the math...
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4992
Feb 18, 2015 16:35:35 GMT 1
Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2015 16:35:35 GMT 1
Have we ever done a £10 match admittance for a league game? Other clubs have tried but not sure how succesful
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Feb 18, 2015 16:37:24 GMT 1
Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2015 16:37:24 GMT 1
There's no need for a station. None at all. For the same money you could buy us all taxis for a decade. The concourses are too narrow and unheated, with toilets designed without a care in the world for the fact more than one person at a time might be using them. There's nowhere to sit for the older / younger fan. I went in the away stand at Burton. Decent wide heated concourse, painted white so it didn't look like a car park, well designed toilets with a single moving queue and warm water, clear lanes for buffet queuing, flip down seats in the concourse, decent prices. It's not that difficult. The fanzone at the Etihad isn't the half of it. Large, well presented concourses with decent toilets, bars, bookies etc. Yes it's a bigger stadium but they're also catering for 30000 more people and it works brilliantly. If the back wall of the west stand had been built ten foot further back, the whole length, it wouldn't have cost us any more and would have changed everything. If the Shropshire fa offices in the south stand had been two storey we'd have had the bar downstairs and the offices above and the bar open at half time. The buffet queue in the south stand at half time at the Chelsea game was twenty minutes. You do the math... The trouble with your points above Dave is that sounds too much like commonsense for the club to take on board
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Post by SouthStandShrew on Feb 18, 2015 16:43:15 GMT 1
Could the club still build above the Shropshire FA?
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4992
Feb 18, 2015 16:55:25 GMT 1
Post by Matster on Feb 18, 2015 16:55:25 GMT 1
Could the club still build above the Shropshire FA? After reading Throbs post I was just about to suggest that. It would make such an improvement to that area if they did. They could fill in the standing area with seating to the east of the middle concourse exit in the south stand too. Even another coffee machine in the food outlets and a decent barriered queue would help.
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on Feb 18, 2015 17:08:35 GMT 1
You only need flip up seats on the walls, nothing in the way.
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4992
Feb 18, 2015 22:37:41 GMT 1
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Post by jimmelrosesjaw on Feb 18, 2015 22:37:41 GMT 1
Great thread with some interesting points of view. Having looked at this season's 16 home league attendances and taken off the away contingents (guessed the Bury match as I can't find the figures), our average attendance is approx 4,600.
Last season's average was 5680 (including visiting supporters - I can't find the figures to deduct away supporters) which given we had the likes of Wolves, Sheff Utd, Port Vale, Preston, Walsall, Notts County, Bristol City, Coventry et al boosting the attendances, I dont think we are fairing too bad tbh.
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4992
Feb 18, 2015 23:39:03 GMT 1
Post by townfanincrewe on Feb 18, 2015 23:39:03 GMT 1
Can any of this be brought up at the supporters meetings? maybe the trust/supporters groups could look in to the cost of any of the ideas or fans clubbing together to do the work. A few years ago it was said there was a fan dater base set up. Could that not be used? local builders/ plumbers, etc donations of goods/ time rather than money and get free tickets travel to games in return that way the club can use their money on the team. As said converting the Shropshire FA building can not cost that much!
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Feb 19, 2015 0:25:58 GMT 1
Post by thesensationaljt on Feb 19, 2015 0:25:58 GMT 1
You only need flip up seats on the walls, nothing in the way. Well said, Dave. We have a few elderly supporters on our bus who would like to sit down in the concourse.
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4992
Feb 19, 2015 1:55:09 GMT 1
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Post by TheFoz on Feb 19, 2015 1:55:09 GMT 1
Taken from the clubs official accounts:
Average home fan base for Shrewsbury:
2011/12=5370 (when we got promoted) 2012/13= 5032 (first time in League One for ages and more attractive games for fans e.g Sheff Utd etc)
I think the attendances are expected, only a few hundred missing which is understandable. The games near the end of the season will boost the figure to somewhere near 5370.
However, it would be great to try and attract fans back to games and get them enjoying it.
The aging fan base is a big concern to me and I'd be trying to get as many youngsters in as possible.
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Feb 19, 2015 8:13:27 GMT 1
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2015 8:13:27 GMT 1
That is a good point because every year a good number will be lost who go off to University so will need to be replaced by first time juniors
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Post by jamo on Feb 19, 2015 8:38:18 GMT 1
We should not be charging youngsters under 11 an entrance fee or if we do it should be a token £1. Virtually none of them would attend alone and the majority would spend something thing in the ground. And they are then Town fans for life..
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Feb 19, 2015 9:05:28 GMT 1
Post by Minormorris64 on Feb 19, 2015 9:05:28 GMT 1
Having so far averaged 5018,to reach an average of 5500 for the 2014-15 Season, over the rest of the Season the Club would need to average 6602 per game.
The average for the last Promotion Season was 5768 to attain this the average for the rest f the season would have to be 7482
Source of Figures:Football Attendance Figures since 2000
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4992
Feb 19, 2015 11:06:03 GMT 1
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Post by ipswichshrews on Feb 19, 2015 11:06:03 GMT 1
Wonder how many 'casual' fans or people interested in football if asked on a Saturday say in town or in a pub would be aware of a home game taking place that same day and what would it take to attract them? Despite the media - papet, radio and online, how else would someone know of when a game is on? Could more be done to promote in town or at cinemas or in supermarkets? Under message of looking for an alternative way of spending your Saturday afternoon?
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Feb 19, 2015 11:06:36 GMT 1
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2015 11:06:36 GMT 1
If we are averaging 4600 fans this season per game and the promotion season under GT was 5370, it appears to me that we have lost about 770 fans along the way which is about 15% based upon some of the figures quoted. Based on Minor Morris figures above the last few home games will not make up this deficit. Pretty serious really........
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Feb 19, 2015 11:36:07 GMT 1
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2015 11:36:07 GMT 1
If we are averaging 4600 fans this season per game and the promotion season under GT was 5370, it appears to me that we have lost about 770 fans along the way which is about 15% based upon some of the figures quoted. Based on Minor Morris figures above the last few home games will not make up this deficit. Pretty serious really........ Serious, yes, and judging by this thread, there is not just one reason for it. Historically, relegation usually leads to lower attendances, but it's a mystery that the crowds haven't returned significantly with our improving fortunes on the pitch. If they don't have it already, the club need to get some reliable data on the issue.
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4992
Feb 19, 2015 11:59:14 GMT 1
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Post by TheFoz on Feb 19, 2015 11:59:14 GMT 1
There is no quick fix.
Promotion deals will only get fans in once, no guarantee that they will return after that.
If I go to a restaurant and buy a meal for £1, will I return if it is inedible and I don't enjoy the experience at all?
As others have mentioned, something like Man City's fan park, on a much smaller scale, would be brilliant.
Get those empty seats filled with youngsters, get them in and enjoying it and you've got yourselves fans for the rest of their lives.
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Feb 19, 2015 12:16:58 GMT 1
Post by stuttgartershrew on Feb 19, 2015 12:16:58 GMT 1
We should not be charging youngsters under 11 an entrance fee or if we do it should be a token £1. Virtually none of them would attend alone and the majority would spend something thing in the ground. And they are then Town fans for life.. Agree with that. Just don't understand how the club price entrance for kids. 12 pounds for kids between 12 and 16?! I think the club have that wrong big time. How many 12 to 16 year old kids are knocking about town on a Saturday with their mates with nothing to do and have 12 pounds rattling around in their pocket ready to spend watching a football match? 12 notes!? Its just ridicules. With those prices your not encouraging kids to come and watch the football atll, you're effectively pushing them away. And will you ever reach them? By the time they reach an age where they might have a bit of money to spend they're more likely to spend it on some Premier League shirt. Would be interesting to see the break down of ticket sales at Town games.
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Feb 19, 2015 12:19:15 GMT 1
Post by Minormorris64 on Feb 19, 2015 12:19:15 GMT 1
We should not be charging youngsters under 11 an entrance fee or if we do it should be a token £1. Virtually none of them would attend alone and the majority would spend something thing in the ground. And they are then Town fans for life.. Agree with that. Just don't understand how the club price entrance for kids. 12 pounds for kids between 12 and 16?! I think the club have that wrong big time. How many 12 to 16 year old kids are knocking about town on a Saturday with their mates with nothing to do and have 12 pounds rattling around in their pocket ready to spend watching a football match? 12 notes!? Its just ridicules. With those prices your not encouraging kids to come and watch the football atll, you're effectively pushing them away. And will you ever reach them? By the time they reach an age where they might have a bit of money to spend they're more likely to spend it on some Premier League shirt. Would be interesting to see the break down of ticket sales at Town games. Wouldn't it just, but I think that is fairly unlikely.
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Feb 19, 2015 12:56:30 GMT 1
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2015 12:56:30 GMT 1
All good debate for the Supporters Parliament to raise with Matt Williams
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Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2015 15:06:47 GMT 1
I liked Welshshrew's post.
There are many people like my father who live within the county and unfortunately just ceased to enjoy going to the game.
Struggling to find somewhere to park and then worrying about getting a ticket. having found somewhere to park having to to walk 10/15 minutes to get to the ground. Collecting a ticket from the ticket office requires more faffing and hassle.
Entering and leaving the stadium whether is requires walking along the narrow dark path, or clambering up the hillside/over the fence or out the main gates along a main road with shoddy lighting is actually quite a distressing experience for a lot of people.
The ground is itself unwelcoming, cold and sparse. The que to get to the toilet/food is often long and slow. The quality of the food certainly used to be variable and unreasonably expensive.
Have any of these issues really been addressed in the last 5 years? As has been said here, once people stop going and realise that there is plenty of other things that they can be doing with their Saturday they are less likely to make a speedy return.
It almost feels as if the club rolled out the new stadium/family club mantra and expected that this alone would suffice without giving a thought to how they were going to replace a ground that was centrally located, provided ease of parking and had multiple amenities that people could experience and enjoy before and after the game within close proximity.
I find it sad that the supporter base feels responsible for finding and funding solutions. The club is a business. IF IT WANTS TO INCREASE THE SPEND OF IT'S CUSTOMER BASE IT HAS TO CREATE AN ENVIRONMENT WHERE CUSTOMERS WILL SPEND MORE. The bowling ally/Asda/the cinema do not expect it's customers to design and fund processes that make it easier for them to spend money!
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Feb 19, 2015 15:23:14 GMT 1
Post by theriverside on Feb 19, 2015 15:23:14 GMT 1
We should not be charging youngsters under 11 an entrance fee or if we do it should be a token £1. Virtually none of them would attend alone and the majority would spend something thing in the ground. And they are then Town fans for life.. A good point and something the club should consider for stand alone match tickets as well as the season ticket deals. I'd survived 5 years at the new ground with barely half a dozen visits to the buffet. My 8 year old lad now has his first season ticket though and I'm spending money there virtually every week on him, which usually ends up including a pint or other drink for myself as well...........so it does add up for the club even if it's making matchday more expensive for me! That said, being at the buffet last Saturday meant I was there to see an elderly member of this messageboard dribble most of his pint down his front which was worth the cost of my own round alone
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Feb 19, 2015 16:01:07 GMT 1
Post by spartan on Feb 19, 2015 16:01:07 GMT 1
I'm a lapsed STH who has been to just 6 games this season.
The decision to withdraw dynamic pricing is what keeps me away. Last season I paid £12.39 a game so a price rise of 61% to £20 on the back of a relegation seemed very unreasonable to me, especially as I can add on £15 for travel.
I decided to ration myself to the top teams so I've seen Wycombe, Burton (twice) and Luton in the League. None of those games live long in my memory. League Two football has just lost its appeal after too many years watching it!
If you're considering how to attract fans back, just remember that the best seats are(rightly) already occupied by STHs (unless you want to pay a further premium for a Cat A seat). Most casual fans wouldn't choose to sit behind the goals,close to the corner flags, or in the 'wet'seats. There has to be a more flexible pricing strategy that recognises this basic fact.
The half-season ticket was an excellent offer, but it was marketed pitifully. £13.08 per game was great especially with the Town right in the promotion mix. The headline said see 12 games for the price of 11 - wrong, wrong, wrong! It was the whole second half of the season for the price of 8 match tickets!Yet no-one at the Club moved to correct this monumental blunder even when it was highlighted via B&A.
I'm now out of the habit of going to games, and have found a more active, much cheaper and equally enjoyable way of spending my Saturday afternoons, free from a 100 mile round trip to a home game.
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Feb 19, 2015 16:52:14 GMT 1
Post by atcham jack on Feb 19, 2015 16:52:14 GMT 1
Is their room to make the exit from the ground 4 lane? 2 lanes left, 2 lanes right. It really is a pain queuing to leave the ground.
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Post by jamo on Feb 19, 2015 16:53:39 GMT 1
We should not be charging youngsters under 11 an entrance fee or if we do it should be a token £1. Virtually none of them would attend alone and the majority would spend something thing in the ground. And they are then Town fans for life.. A good point and something the club should consider for stand alone match tickets as well as the season ticket deals. I'd survived 5 years at the new ground with barely half a dozen visits to the buffet. My 8 year old lad now has his first season ticket though and I'm spending money there virtually every week on him, which usually ends up including a pint or other drink for myself as well...........so it does add up for the club even if it's making matchday more expensive for me! That said, being at the buffet last Saturday meant I was there to see an elderly member of this messageboard dribble most of his pint down his front which was worth the cost of my own round alone ELDERLY Member !!! That's outrageous.
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4992
Feb 19, 2015 17:16:14 GMT 1
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Post by calimero on Feb 19, 2015 17:16:14 GMT 1
We should not be charging youngsters under 11 an entrance fee or if we do it should be a token £1. Virtually none of them would attend alone and the majority would spend something thing in the ground. And they are then Town fans for life.. Agree with that. Just don't understand how the club price entrance for kids. 12 pounds for kids between 12 and 16?! I think the club have that wrong big time. How many 12 to 16 year old kids are knocking about town on a Saturday with their mates with nothing to do and have 12 pounds rattling around in their pocket ready to spend watching a football match? 12 notes!? Its just ridicules. With those prices your not encouraging kids to come and watch the football atll, you're effectively pushing them away. And will you ever reach them? By the time they reach an age where they might have a bit of money to spend they're more likely to spend it on some Premier League shirt. Would be interesting to see the break down of ticket sales at Town games. Read a good article a few months back about atmosphere in ground and one of the points made was that the average age of ST holders in the Stretford End (as an example I can remember) is 42. Written by a Sunderland fan he also said that if you go to any number of pubs around Sunderland on a matchday you will find large numbers of young adults - say maybe 18-25 year olds - not only eatching the match but singing and having the crack as if at the match, but watching it on some foriegn channel. The point being there are offers for kids but then suddenly they have to pay full whack and 18-25 year olds have been hit hardest by the recession. So they are nurtered as fans for life then outcast by oppressive prices, their vibrancy and enthusiasm oh so noticeable by it's absence. I would be fully in favour for student discounts to be extended to all under 24/25 year olds. Gradually increasing ticket prices to full price in age group bands and raising over-65 prices (though still concessionary) would be a more progressive pricing structure. Especially as this is considered the first generation since the rise in the early 1960s of the young adults with disposable cash that pensioners are considered on average better off than young adults.
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Feb 19, 2015 17:39:01 GMT 1
Post by thesensationaljt on Feb 19, 2015 17:39:01 GMT 1
I don't want to be too negative, but I've said before, we lost a lot of history when we moved grounds, and history brings a sense of belonging. Losing the coracle was a disgrace. It should be on display in reception, and during the summer, taken to shows and fetes in the county, as well as other Town items of interest to present, former and potential new supporters. It would also allow the club to connect with the local population, perhaps giving out £5/10 off vouchers for a game at the Meddah.
I think I may have accidentally touched on this subject now and again.
Any road up, here's the current League 2 attendances. I'm not going to tell you we're 6th, or you won't bother looking at the link.
www.worldfootball.net/attendance/eng-league-two-2014-2015/1/
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Feb 19, 2015 17:49:37 GMT 1
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2015 17:49:37 GMT 1
I don't want to be too negative, but I've said before, we lost a lot of history when we moved grounds, and history brings a sense of belonging. Losing the coracle was a disgrace. It should be on display in reception, and during the summer, taken to shows and fetes in the county, as well as other Town items of interest to present, former and potential new supporters. It would also allow the club to connect with the local population, perhaps giving out £5/10 off vouchers for a game at the Meddah.
I think I may have accidentally touched on this subject now and again.
Any road up, here's the current League 2 attendances. I'm not going to tell you we're 6th, or you won't bother looking at the link.
www.worldfootball.net/attendance/eng-league-two-2014-2015/1/ I know the point you’re making, but you’re talking about heritage. Our history isn’t lost we still beat Man City 2-0 back in 1979 and we really did spend 10 years at level 2. The thing about heritage though and the intangible memories around it is that many people who haven’t been to the old GM are forming new experiences at the new GM. As we all are. This includes where to drink and how to get to the ground. It is worth pointing out that attendances still remain healthy when compared to the old GM.
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Feb 19, 2015 18:00:11 GMT 1
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2015 18:00:11 GMT 1
Probably a re-hash of many peoples thoughts on here but there is no single reason and therefore no magical cure to win back the fans.
My view is that following the groundmove there was a real sense of momentum at the club, we had narrowly missed out on promotion the season before and we all thought we could kick on. The novelty of the new ground and being a bigger club after many seasons of struggle in the bottom division meant crowds were up. However a poor first season under GP failed to build on that momentum and some fans were already critical of the new ground and the matchday experience, many felt alienated in the supposed pursuit of the 'corporate fan. As each season passed I could sense the novelty of the new ground disapear but there was no noticable drop in crowds, this was down to two reasons in my opinion, one being we had a few promotion challenges and secondly the excellently priced season tickets.
Anyway we finally achieved promotion back to the third tier, something we had spent a lot of time and money on doing, however the club seemed to hit a brick wall. Recruitment was terrible, loan after loan was brought in, the perception was we were trying to do things on the cheap. As people were fed up of a lack of investment on the field they asked further questions about off the field, notably the inconvenience of the ground and the general matchay experience, these issues were always there but for the majority they were happy to accept them when they had success on the pitch, human nature means people will highlight the negatives when things arent going so well and thats what has happened. For some fans they had had enough so started to drift away whilst others thought they would give GT a chance not to make the same mistakes as the season before. As we know that didnt happen so throughout the season fans stopped attending. Then in the summer after relegation and the club came out with the "town fight back" stuff, a lot of people remembered the lack of investment over the last two seasons, not learning from the mistakes and the poor matchday experience at STFC so thought "enough is enough".
So we are where we are today, some of the stay-aways are happy to see STFC doing well and may come out for the odd game but generally are out of the habit of attending regularly and find it too expensive and/or too inconvenient to attend. I hoped that challenging for promotion would win fans back but it hasnt happened and Im not convinced that a promotion will necessarily do that. Hopefully a promotion, a good pricing structure (particularly on season tickets) and some more innovative ideas from MW may win them back
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Feb 19, 2015 18:07:49 GMT 1
Post by thesensationaljt on Feb 19, 2015 18:07:49 GMT 1
I don't want to be too negative, but I've said before, we lost a lot of history when we moved grounds, and history brings a sense of belonging. Losing the coracle was a disgrace. It should be on display in reception, and during the summer, taken to shows and fetes in the county, as well as other Town items of interest to present, former and potential new supporters. It would also allow the club to connect with the local population, perhaps giving out £5/10 off vouchers for a game at the Meddah.
I think I may have accidentally touched on this subject now and again.
Any road up, here's the current League 2 attendances. I'm not going to tell you we're 6th, or you won't bother looking at the link.
www.worldfootball.net/attendance/eng-league-two-2014-2015/1/ I know the point you’re making, but you’re talking about heritage. Ahhhh, gotya Nick. I'll give S****horpe United a ring, then they can put their supporters right.
fanchants.co.uk/football-songs/s****horpe_united-chants/youve-got-no-history-4/
Well I've rung Sc***horpe. They were crestfallen at their Miss Take, they've taken the page off.
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