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Post by vanner on Jun 23, 2014 16:05:09 GMT 1
"Tom Bradshaw - 42 starts 17 goals, a very decent return for a 21 year old striker."
It's amazing how stats can be used to backup any argument and the above example is a prime one. Of Bradshaw's 17 goals I would imagine at least 6 of them have come from the bench if not more...
Shola Ameobi, a striker regularly ridiculed by fans everywhere has a 53 goals in 160 starts for Newcastle. You'd say that was impressive until you realised he's come off the bench another 170 times... It's basically the same with Tom. Yes he's got potential but people cannot seriously suggest he's not been given enough chances with us. He offers very little apart from his goals and he's not scored enough goals to have a regular starting spot.
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Post by Rusholme Ruffian on Jun 23, 2014 16:07:59 GMT 1
Indeed or I just might go into orbit!! However, looking on the Walsall site, it talks about a 'deal' with Shrewsbury so the contract comment may be just a rumour. Both sides said/implied that there was a fee and I can't see why Walsall would say so if they hadn't paid one. It would have to be a pretty significant admin error to negate football league rules on compensation, in any case. Indeed. Not sure what sort of admin error that would quite be. Not quite sure what the rules are over what the offer needs to be - date, wage etc, but doubt these would have been not been met.
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Post by mrbunny on Jun 23, 2014 16:08:29 GMT 1
Walsall fan coming in peace. Thought I would do some research on our new signing Bradshaw. It seems that there are mixed reactions to his departure although I think we have got ourselves a bargain as I have heard on the grapevine that we got him on a free due to an admin error on his contract. I am sure our more refined style of football will suit Bradshaw rather than the hoof it up front style he is used to. I'd have paid you to take him so no loss if it a free.
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Post by lenny on Jun 23, 2014 16:12:46 GMT 1
Walsall fan coming in peace. Thought I would do some research on our new signing Bradshaw. It seems that there are mixed reactions to his departure although I think we have got ourselves a bargain as I have heard on the grapevine that we got him on a free due to an admin error on his contract. I am sure our more refined style of football will suit Bradshaw rather than the hoof it up front style he is used to. Anyway, in terms of Bradshaw, I've always defended him and felt he gets a raw deal from many on here. He was basically the only senior striker we had all season but after starting the season well with 5 goals early doors, he had a dry spell and then was suddenly dropped and hardly got any game time under Turner. All kinds of rumours came from that sort of time, including one that suggests it was a big part in his decision to leave. Jackson came in and said he needed time away from the club to "think about things" - definitely something going on. He then got injured and boosted his stats with two more goals at the end of the season. Before this season, though, he had gone 22 months without scoring at League 2 and League 1 level. In that time most of his games were cameos from the bench, often 2/3 minutes, but he still probably made around 10/15 starts as well. When he doesn't score, he offers little in terms of all-round play. Isn't a brilliant technician or hold-up man, although he is the only striker we've had for ages who has the nous to win free kicks by going down instead of giving them away by fouling centre backs (or at least giving them some form of contact to exaggerate). Quite reliant on confidence, he looked a completely different player after ending the drought and I think has been a different option this season. He burst on the scene at 17 with a stunning strike (and another less exceptional one) away to Crewe and was instantly hyped and linked to Cardiff (being Welsh) and West Ham in some national papers. Perhaps led to unfairly increased expectations on him, but he certainly hadn't developed that much up until the start of the season just gone than from his first full season in the senior team, when he scored 6/7 in an injury-disrupted season. As said, he didn't suit the hoofball we've played over the last two seasons and isn't great up front on his own, but there is just something intangible about him that suggests to me he has the talent to do well - he's quite an intelligent player whose movement is good, too. Think he'll do well in a team who pass it well, look to play in behind and also who are nearer the top than the bottom, so don't need the target man/scrappy style. He'll always work hard, but I'd be worried if he starts for you as anything other than back up this season.
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Post by thehappysaddler on Jun 23, 2014 16:21:45 GMT 1
I am excited at the thought of Bradshaw coming to us. I think given the right service he could do a job for us. I have been reliably informed that we did get him on a free and I'm not suprised Shrewsbury want to keep a lid on it. Rather embarrassing!!!!! I will be happy if he gets us 10 to 12 goals this season. He is definately worth taking a punt on.
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Post by blazey on Jun 23, 2014 16:31:53 GMT 1
I have been reliably informed that we did get him on a free and I'm not suprised Shrewsbury want to keep a lid on it. Rather embarrassing!!!!! Shrewsbury Town website - "With Tom being 21 years of age and the clubs have reached a financial agreement for the former Welsh U21 striker to join the Saddlers." Walsall website - "THE SADDLERS have captured the signing of tricky front-man, Tom Bradshaw, on a two-year deal after the Club reached an Agreement with Shrewsbury Town." BBC Sport - "Walsall sign Shrewsbury Town's Wales Under-21 striker Tom Bradshaw on a two-year contract for an undisclosed fee." Nah, sod it, I'll just believe some clown who's posting sh*te on a football messageboard instead...
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Post by venceremos on Jun 23, 2014 16:32:45 GMT 1
Sorry lenny, have to disagree with your comment that we played hoofball for two seasons. That's just not true.
Our problem was a lack of pace and penetration but we passed the ball more often than we hoofed it. Bradshaw was often part of those teams lacking pace and penetration and can't escape his share of responsibility for our attack being toothless.
I think he could have done better and might still become the striker we thought he would become. It's a good move for him and no bad thing for us to make the change. He must have known he'd be behind Collins and Vernon for a starting place. Whether he'll do it at Walsall remains to be seen. Might depend on how long they remain a mid-table team or whether they go back to struggling.
Happysaddler - he will be "free" because he was out of contract. But he's 21, we offered him another deal and we're entitled to compensation, hence there's a financial settlement. Nothing embarrassing about it at all.
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Post by Exkeeper on Jun 23, 2014 16:43:04 GMT 1
I am excited at the thought of Bradshaw coming to us. I think given the right service he could do a job for us. I have been reliably informed that we did get him on a free and I'm not suprised Shrewsbury want to keep a lid on it. Rather embarrassing!!!!! I will be happy if he gets us 10 to 12 goals this season. He is definately worth taking a punt on. Fair enough, we all get excited when a new signing is announced. However, what you are getting is a striker who struggled to get picked very often, by a side desperate for goals, who finished next to bottom of League One. A striker who gets easily out-muscled by no-nonsense defenders and often seems to go missing during a game. He is most effective when coming off the bench in the last 15 minutes, and when he does start a game, he is usually withdrawn. Tom must have realised that he was only going to be a bitpart player in our League 2 campaign, so fair play to him for taking a 2 year contract - I don't think he would have got a further extension here. I fully expect him to be a regular warmer of your bench by mid November.
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Post by shrewder on Jun 23, 2014 16:47:22 GMT 1
I am excited at the thought of Bradshaw coming to us. I think given the right service he could do a job for us. I have been reliably informed that we did get him on a free and I'm not suprised Shrewsbury want to keep a lid on it. Rather embarrassing!!!!! I will be happy if he gets us 10 to 12 goals this season. He is definately worth taking a punt on. Enjoy your excitement while lasts. 10 or 12 goals ? Well I am sure most Shrews fans will be looking for that stat with interest.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2014 16:50:28 GMT 1
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Post by lenny on Jun 23, 2014 16:51:21 GMT 1
Sorry lenny, have to disagree with your comment that we played hoofball for two seasons. That's just not true. Our problem was a lack of pace and penetration but we passed the ball more often than we hoofed it. Bradshaw was often part of those teams lacking pace and penetration and can't escape his share of responsibility for our attack being toothless. Maybe I'm mis-remembering. We certainly hoofed it this season - pass around sideways, occasionally try and create something but comes back to Mkandawire/Jones/Winfield who bring it forward and then punt forward. Much of the previous season was the same, but with Jones alongside other centre backs. Edwards, Collins et al. Both times at the start of the season we tried to play at a higher temp and more along the floor, but results meant Turner went for functional, solidity first stuff. Every keeper kick goes long. Every set piece/corner has been lumped into the box. We might have tried passing it along the floor, but we've never had the interchanges or drive to mean that the forwards get the ball into feet/in behind more often than long ball with their backs to goal.
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Post by Exkeeper on Jun 23, 2014 16:51:31 GMT 1
I wonder if they will be paying him more than he was on with us, or maybe they will pay him a low wage and throw in a used caravan.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2014 16:55:02 GMT 1
I reckon we will just about have got our money back, but reckon if things were different then it well could have been 10 times that amount!!
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Post by atcham jack on Jun 23, 2014 17:08:20 GMT 1
caught the news on twitter, delighted for young tom. delighted a league 1 club has taken him on, and i am sure he will be on their score sheet several times. good luck.
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Post by thesensationaljt on Jun 23, 2014 18:09:46 GMT 1
When Bradshaw came off the bench, it was usually a last throw of the dice in a game we were losing, so he had scraps to feed off, plus the desperate hoofball in the dying minutes. To my knowledge, he didn't have a chance to form a partnership with another striker at the club. That's hardly surprising, when loan strikers were changed on a regular basis.
Any road up, good luck young Tom, this is where we find out how good you are. (Or aren't).
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Post by buryshrew on Jun 23, 2014 18:48:06 GMT 1
As the new boy, I wonder if they'll start him on light duties; pegs, lucky heather etc or straight in with the big boys on the Tarmac wagon?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2014 19:05:15 GMT 1
As the new boy, I wonder if they'll start him on light duties; pegs, lucky heather etc or straight in with the big boys on the Tarmac wagon? Comedy Gold from "Up North". Also like the bit about Walsall having signed tricky front-man Tom Bradshaw. When was that then? i thought they signed our Tom Bradshaw.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2014 19:08:47 GMT 1
Good for all parties I'd have thought. There's definitely the makings of a fox in the box type striker, and when playing off the shoulder he can use his pace, but his alround game is weak. Also wondered if hes a bit too nice, lacking that arrogant streak, demanding the ball etc?! Hope we've got a sell on clause in there though cos if he can turn his 5 game scoring streaks into half a season or more they'll be interest from higher up, there always is for goalscorers even after one decent season (look at Griggs at Brentford).
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Jun 23, 2014 19:25:22 GMT 1
Well plenty of rumours about today on a potential contract mistake that cost us money that means although it was technically a fee it was no where near what it would have been without the mistake.... Think decimal place in wrong place. If the rumour is true, and I'm hearing it from plenty of places as far back as the weekend then who ever made that mistake needs a good chat from the top of the club. Interesting that it's coming now from the Walsall end too. If you lost your company 1,000s would you still be in a job? If you were I guess there would a reason for it!
Can we really afford to be chucking money away?
Wonder if the club will say anything on this rumour (unlikely?) or that heads might roll down the line.
As it said rumour.... But I always say when these sorts of things are being discussed it should be clear what the issue that people are talking about off the messageboards is so that everyone knows. I'm saying rumour but it's been a long time since I saw people so a dement that something like the above happened. If it did it's so frustrating after the positive vibes from the club recently.
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Post by blueandamber on Jun 23, 2014 19:25:32 GMT 1
If Walsall play to Tom's strengths, he has a regular run in the team and an intelligent striker along side him, I'm confident he will be a useful asset for them.
He was always given scraps of game time under Turner and never given a real chance in my opinion.
Good luck Tom.
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Post by thesensationaljt on Jun 23, 2014 19:36:00 GMT 1
If you lost your company 1,000s would you still be in a job? Yes, I'm self-employed, so I'd forgive myself.
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Post by pughywasfree on Jun 23, 2014 19:36:59 GMT 1
I doubt we would have gone down without a fight if there was a mistake I would have thought we would have fought being paid a pittance when we should have got a fair wack and it would be dragged out for months. Maybe there was an error but I doubt it would have made much difference. I think the club need to squash this rumour before it gets going.
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Post by Dale on Jun 23, 2014 19:39:48 GMT 1
To be fair to Tom it's been a good turnaround in fortunes for him, this time last year we were amazed he was offered another deal as most of us expected him to be handed a one way ticket to non league football... don't blame him at all for taking the offer to join a higher ranked club on a longer contract (and local as well), I don't expect him to make too much of a impact there though but stranger things have happened...
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2014 19:40:21 GMT 1
Obviously I hope we got some money for him, but even if we didn't, glad to see the back of him and I'm sure we'll replace him with better.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2014 19:55:51 GMT 1
Well plenty of rumours about today on a potential contract mistake that cost us money that means although it was technically a fee it was no where near what it would have been without the mistake.... Think decimal place in wrong place. If the rumour is true, and I'm hearing it from plenty of places as far back as the weekend then who ever made that mistake needs a good chat from the top of the club. Interesting that it's coming now from the Walsall end too. If you lost your company 1,000s would you still be in a job? If you were I guess there would a reason for it! Can we really afford to be chucking money away? Wonder if the club will say anything on this rumour (unlikely?) or that heads might roll down the line. As it said rumour.... But I always say when these sorts of things are being discussed it should be clear what the issue that people are talking about off the messageboards is so that everyone knows. I'm saying rumour but it's been a long time since I saw people so a dement that something like the above happened. If it did it's so frustrating after the positive vibes from the club recently. If there's a mistake the club should deal with it as they see fit, why do fans need to know? What would it change? I'm all for better communication with fans but we really don't need to know everything and I don't see why a member of the club's administration should be publicly flogged. What's done is done, let's move on. And if you don't like rumours don't spread em (rumours that is!)!
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Post by onthepitch on Jun 23, 2014 20:38:37 GMT 1
Well that's the last of the real dross out the door then
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Post by thesensationaljt on Jun 23, 2014 21:25:48 GMT 1
The rules are pretty clear aren't they? If you offer your player a contract, if they are under 24, compensation has to be paid. There is no transfer fee, so I can't see how a Miss Take can have been made. I'm not even sure if MM wanted Tom, but was looking for the compo. Otherwise, why did he offer him 1 year, when all the other offers were 2 years.
Move on, other fish to fry......sorry, wrong thread.
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Post by SouthStandShrew on Jun 23, 2014 21:58:05 GMT 1
For me like Dave Hibbert.
Plenty of effort.... but IMO s**te.
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owdlad
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Post by owdlad on Jun 24, 2014 1:01:18 GMT 1
A 2 year contract on League 1 wages or a year's contract on League 2 wages. Can't blame him. Good luck to him.
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Post by atcham jack on Jun 24, 2014 8:32:33 GMT 1
some of us were not amazed when he was offered a new contract last summer. some of us were not amazed when he responded with a shoal of goals. sadly a long injury prevented him continuing with his prowess and we waited until april. good luck tom with the saddlers, but for your injury we may have been playing saddlers this season.
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