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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2013 11:46:25 GMT 1
and on identifying ways of significantly increasing the club revenue. You want STFC to receive increased revenue? Restore the Loggerheads and watch the sales of merchandise go through the roof. 'Sales going through the roof' look around the ground on match day, there are thousands of fans already buying shirts and scarf's and clearly not concerned about the Badge. Increased merchandise sales is a total red herring lad
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Post by stuttgartershrew on May 8, 2013 12:08:59 GMT 1
KL8 I wonder how many Town fans agree with you that the badge is the key issue that Team Roland should be addressing, I would suspect that most Town fans would expect them to be concentrating on getting a team for next season that wont struggle and on identifying ways of significantly increasing the club revenue. Always makes me laugh to see this posted. As if the chairman, a successful businessman, is unable to hold two thoughts at any one time. Plus of course that fails to take into consideration that the chairman has already taken the effort to change the badge once, you know...from the Loggerheads to the clip art. And people surely wouldn't point to that as the reason why we failed to get promoted until last season. Would they?
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Post by SouthStandShrew on May 8, 2013 12:11:14 GMT 1
No way will I accept that Clipart.
So much so I even my Loggerheads shirt to one of the Wonder of the Worlds!
NO SURRENDER!
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2013 12:33:05 GMT 1
You want STFC to receive increased revenue? Restore the Loggerheads and watch the sales of merchandise go through the roof. 'Sales going through the roof' look around the ground on match day, there are thousands of fans already buying shirts and scarf's and clearly not concerned about the Badge. Increased merchandise sales is a total red herring lad Im led to believe that the current blue and amber striped shirt is our most popular shirt ever, yet there is no blue and amber striped option for the next available kit. That is all you need to know about STFC's commercial awareness But back onto the badge, I wouldnt argue that the majority of town fans have no strong feelings towards the badge, disapointing but Im not sure why that this is a strong argument to stick with a clip-art badge. However I have certainly noticed that the number of people who have strong feelings about the badge have grown over the past year or so, whether thats down the the work of the campaign I honestly dont know but definitely is noticable and I hear a lot more negativity towards 'clippy'. In terms of merchandise, no one knows the true scale of the amount of people who are boycotting clippy, Id suggest it wont earn the club hundreds of thousands more but its higher than one or two people. And surely any self respecting buiness would want to increase their revenue and try and understand why some of their customers are refusing to buy their goods? Finally, I love the irony at seeing people complaining about pro loggerheads camp, "its only a badge" is the normal claim. Well if its only a badge in your eyes why are you so bothered about people wanting to change it? Surely it has no impact on you?
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Post by almightybob on May 8, 2013 12:36:44 GMT 1
'Sales going through the roof' look around the ground on match day, there are thousands of fans already buying shirts and scarf's and clearly not concerned about the Badge. Increased merchandise sales is a total red herring lad Im led to believe that the current blue and amber striped shirt is our most popular shirt ever, yet there is no blue and amber striped option for the next available kit. That is all you need to know about STFC's commercial awareness But back onto the badge, I wouldnt argue that the majority of town fans have no strong feelings towards the badge, disapointing but Im not sure why that this is a strong argument to stick with a clip-art badge. However I have certainly noticed that the number of people who have strong feelings about the badge have grown over the past year or so, whether thats down the the work of the campaign I honestly dont know but definitely is noticable and I hear a lot more negativity towards 'clippy'. In terms of merchandise, no one knows the true scale of the amount of people who are boycotting clippy, Id suggest it wont earn the club hundreds of thousands more but its higher than one or two people. And surely any self respecting buiness would want to increase their revenue and try and understand why some of their customers are refusing to buy their goods? Finally, I love the irony at seeing people complaining about pro loggerheads camp, "its only a badge" is the normal claim. Well if its only a badge in your eyes why are you so bothered about people wanting to change it? Surely it has no impact on you? on the first issue about the striped shirt option, do you not think that if the new shirt was similar to the old one, less people would buy a new one? I always thought that was why clubs change shirts so often, so supporters get 1 every year or 2.
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Post by Historian on May 8, 2013 12:38:36 GMT 1
KL8 I wonder how many Town fans agree with you that the badge is the key issue that Team Roland should be addressing, I would suspect that most Town fans would expect them to be concentrating on getting a team for next season that wont struggle and on identifying ways of significantly increasing the club revenue. Always makes me laugh to see this posted. As if the chairman, a successful businessman, is unable to hold two thoughts at any one time. Plus of course that fails to take into consideration that the chairman has already taken the effort to change the badge once, you know...from the Loggerheads to the clip art. And people surely wouldn't point to that as the reason why we failed to get promoted until last season. Would they? :)) You seem to ignore the fact that the last change of badge was part of the move to the new ground. Which I suspect might have been the number one priority at the time. It is a question of priorities and I suspect I know what most fans priority for the next 3 months is.
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2013 12:51:49 GMT 1
Im led to believe that the current blue and amber striped shirt is our most popular shirt ever, yet there is no blue and amber striped option for the next available kit. That is all you need to know about STFC's commercial awareness But back onto the badge, I wouldnt argue that the majority of town fans have no strong feelings towards the badge, disapointing but Im not sure why that this is a strong argument to stick with a clip-art badge. However I have certainly noticed that the number of people who have strong feelings about the badge have grown over the past year or so, whether thats down the the work of the campaign I honestly dont know but definitely is noticable and I hear a lot more negativity towards 'clippy'. In terms of merchandise, no one knows the true scale of the amount of people who are boycotting clippy, Id suggest it wont earn the club hundreds of thousands more but its higher than one or two people. And surely any self respecting buiness would want to increase their revenue and try and understand why some of their customers are refusing to buy their goods? Finally, I love the irony at seeing people complaining about pro loggerheads camp, "its only a badge" is the normal claim. Well if its only a badge in your eyes why are you so bothered about people wanting to change it? Surely it has no impact on you? on the first issue about the striped shirt option, do you not think that if the new shirt was similar to the old one, less people would buy a new one? I always thought that was why clubs change shirts so often, so supporters get 1 every year or 2. I dont see many clubs drastically changing their style every few seasons? As have been seen over the years in various kit mock ups, there are many different things you could do with a blue and amber striped kit In my eyes the kit and badge are two very similar problems, constantly being changed which means we have no identity.
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Post by stuttgartershrew on May 8, 2013 12:55:05 GMT 1
Always makes me laugh to see this posted. As if the chairman, a successful businessman, is unable to hold two thoughts at any one time. Plus of course that fails to take into consideration that the chairman has already taken the effort to change the badge once, you know...from the Loggerheads to the clip art. And people surely wouldn't point to that as the reason why we failed to get promoted until last season. Would they? You seem to ignore the fact that the last change of badge was part of the move to the new ground. Which I suspect might have been the number one priority at the time. It is a question of priorities and I suspect I know what most fans priority for the next 3 months is. Whether that was apart of any move is by the by. Time and effort and money was spent on it rather than on the team (apparently, according to how one or two on here believe the club functions). So with that in mind, the chap above is implying that we didn't do as well as we could have done because the chairman put effort and money into the badge rather than on the team. Did it cost us promotion I wonder??!! Daft to suggest putting effort and money into changing the badge now would have any detrimental impact on the team. It would have the very same impact it did back when we changed it first time around. None. Or are you honestly saying the team would have done better if we hadn't have put time and money into changing the badge? No doubt one or two would be back on here once it is changed back stating that if we had put more time and effort into the team building than changing the badge we wouldn't have missed out on promotion. Nonsense that . To suggest that these two things are mutually exclusive is absurd.
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on May 8, 2013 13:25:46 GMT 1
We said for years that blue and amber stripes would be very popular, they were. We don't make this stuff up.
The fact is every kit competition has provided us with blue and amber, and as close to blue and amber stripes as the designs chosen allowed. It will be the same this time.
The suggestion we should change from blue and amber stripes because otherwise people won't buy the new shirt is completely unfounded. Man United sell the most shirts and theirs are always red. Every single season.
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on May 8, 2013 13:34:54 GMT 1
Increased merchandise sales is a total red herring lad You mean like the hundreds of blue and amber bar scarves sold out of the back fo a car because the club refused to stock them? You mean like the hundreds of Toffs retro shirts which sold over the internet because the club refused to produce / stock them? What kind of marketing strategy is it to antagonise a large slice of your support for no apparent reason? Blue and amber stripes with the Loggerheads on - it's not that hard. Lots of people don't mind either way, plenty do. If they don't mind either way then they don't mind if you do something to help those who do care about it. We are Shrewsbury Town Football Club. We play in Shrewsbury. Shrewsbury has a coat of arms. That is our unique identity. So are blue and amber stripes. It is a marketing person's dream - swathes of loyal customers begging you for something that they can buy and a unique identity which you can spin off commercially. Why would the club even want to fight that? The "protection of the brand" argument has been completely blown apart several times over. Floreat Salopia, 1886, blue and amber stripes, the loggerheads, it's all there to use and give people the chance to buy stuff that allows them to immerse themselves within the identity.
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Post by ShrewsburySTFC on May 8, 2013 13:38:36 GMT 1
This is why we NEED guests on this board - to allow people too cowardly to put their own recognised name against an unpopular viewpoint and make their views heard (and admittedly then laughed at - clearly clueless on how statistics and polls etc. are calculated). True. And for the life of me I still don't understand people coming on here saying it's boring, stop talking about, give it a rest...when they can clearly just avoid the thread. If it's of no interest to them then move along, nothing to see here. Strange folk some. I know I'm being pedantic here, but the thread title actually states the thread will be about Crystal Palace's new badge, before the opening post went on to hi-jack about STFC's badge. I think people can be forgiven for complaining about the badge issue being on a thread that really has nothing to do with STFC.
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Post by devonwhitesprowess on May 8, 2013 13:53:53 GMT 1
All this carping about the badge is getting very boring.
There was never going to be any chance of changing it mid season; or mid way through a kit run.
As far as I know the club have hinted at a review in the near future - at least wait until they have had this chance. If nothing is done then and if no sensible reasons are given then please do feel free to recommence the whining.
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on May 8, 2013 13:57:47 GMT 1
All this carping about the badge is getting very boring. There was never going to be any chance of changing it mid season; or mid way through a kit run. As far as I know the club have hinted at a review in the near future - at least wait until they have had this chance. If nothing is done then and if no sensible reasons are given then please do feel free to recommence the whining. It is not midway through a kit run. It is at the start of a new kit - the optimum time to change, and probbaly the last chance for two years. So we can't have a new badge now because they are busy choosing the kit, then we won't have a new badge because they can't change the kit... We can't ask about it during the season because they are concentrating on the season and we can't ask about it in the summer because they have to concentrate on the summer recruitment... And you say proponents of the badge changing are boring?
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Post by almightybob on May 8, 2013 14:02:13 GMT 1
Increased merchandise sales is a total red herring lad You mean like the hundreds of blue and amber bar scarves sold out of the back fo a car because the club refused to stock them? You mean like the hundreds of Toffs retro shirts which sold over the internet because the club refused to produce / stock them? What kind of marketing strategy is it to antagonise a large slice of your support for no apparent reason? Blue and amber stripes with the Loggerheads on - it's not that hard. Lots of people don't mind either way, plenty do. If they don't mind either way then they don't mind if you do something to help those who do care about it. We are Shrewsbury Town Football Club. We play in Shrewsbury. Shrewsbury has a coat of arms. That is our unique identity. So are blue and amber stripes. It is a marketing person's dream - swathes of loyal customers begging you for something that they can buy and a unique identity which you can spin off commercially. Why would the club even want to fight that? The "protection of the brand" argument has been completely blown apart several times over. Floreat Salopia, 1886, blue and amber stripes, the loggerheads, it's all there to use and give people the chance to buy stuff that allows them to immerse themselves within the identity. On the toffs shirts, i think you're missing the point of them a bit, I have 2 of them and have had them for a number of years. One of the reasons i have them is so that i dont have to keep buying a new shirt every couple of years, it's classic and never goes out of fashion. If the club sold them, they may sell plenty, but would they be reducing future sales because they last well and dont go out of fashion? On the bar scarves, they are quite cheap too, which is another reason people buy them rather than the scarves in the club shop. I go cheaper still and get my mum to knit me one
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Post by Yes To Loggerheads on May 8, 2013 14:09:19 GMT 1
**** me you're a bore !!! Its a ****in badge on a football shirt - get a life !!! Tell me , how many of the regular Town fans signed your little petition ?? Answer - WELL UNDER 50% Face it most fans don't give a flying a **** - I bet the numbers buying the new shirt, as opposed to you little badge Fascists boycotting it, will tell the true story. Its called democracy pal !! Ever heard of democracy ? I think you need to have a lie down, you're getting awfully pent up about something you don't even care about.
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on May 8, 2013 14:16:03 GMT 1
On the toffs shirts, i think you're missing the point of them a bit, I have 2 of them and have had them for a number of years. One of the reasons i have them is so that i dont have to keep buying a new shirt every couple of years, it's classic and never goes out of fashion. If the club sold them, they may sell plenty, but would they be reducing future sales because they last well and dont go out of fashion? On the bar scarves, they are quite cheap too, which is another reason people buy them rather than the scarves in the club shop. I go cheaper still and get my mum to knit me one No, they were popular merchandise which other people had to produce because the club did not respond to the requests of its own customers so someone else filled the gap. The Toffs shirt were bought and worn by hundreds of people because they were the only blue and amber striped option. You went to away games and it felt like more people were wearing the Toffs at one stage than our actual kit. The club would not be cannibalising future sales of home kits by selling the Toffs kit. Toffs themselves were going to sell them regardless, so the club just needed to get in on the act and actually profit from them. Obviously now, you have got that choice with the current home kit. Many, many people buy the new shirt regardless of whether their old shirt is worn out or not. The people who bought the Toffs shirt owuld have been exactly the kind of people who already had the home kit. Basically that line of thinking extrapolated says lets produce something people DON'T want because then at least it won't clash with what they already have. Let's just give our customers lots and lots of what they want eh? And if they " don't mind either way" then it does not matter.
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Post by almightybob on May 8, 2013 14:30:25 GMT 1
On the toffs shirts, i think you're missing the point of them a bit, I have 2 of them and have had them for a number of years. One of the reasons i have them is so that i dont have to keep buying a new shirt every couple of years, it's classic and never goes out of fashion. If the club sold them, they may sell plenty, but would they be reducing future sales because they last well and dont go out of fashion? On the bar scarves, they are quite cheap too, which is another reason people buy them rather than the scarves in the club shop. I go cheaper still and get my mum to knit me one No, they were popular merchandise which other people had to produce because the club did not respond to the requests of its own customers so someone else filled the gap. The Toffs shirt were bought and worn by hundreds of people because they were the only blue and amber striped option. You went to away games and it felt like more people were wearing the Toffs at one stage than our actual kit. The club would not be cannibalising future sales of home kits by selling the Toffs kit. Toffs themselves were going to sell them regardless, so the club just needed to get in on the act and actually profit from them. Obviously now, you have got that choice with the current home kit. Many, many people buy the new shirt regardless of whether their old shirt is worn out or not. The people who bought the Toffs shirt owuld have been exactly the kind of people who already had the home kit. Basically that line of thinking extrapolated says lets produce something people DON'T want because then at least it won't clash with what they already have. Let's just give our customers lots and lots of what they want eh? And if they " don't mind either way" then it does not matter. I can only really speak for my habits and I think I would have bought a few "official" shirts if I didn't have my toffs ones, maybe I'm just tight
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Post by buryshrew on May 8, 2013 14:33:14 GMT 1
Anyone who still doesn't get why a piece of random clipart is not a satisfactory replacement for a professional football team badge with history, relevance and identity is frankly not worth entering into a debate with. Some people know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.
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Post by devonwhitesprowess on May 8, 2013 14:45:14 GMT 1
All this carping about the badge is getting very boring. There was never going to be any chance of changing it mid season; or mid way through a kit run. As far as I know the club have hinted at a review in the near future - at least wait until they have had this chance. If nothing is done then and if no sensible reasons are given then please do feel free to recommence the whining. It is not midway through a kit run. It is at the start of a new kit - the optimum time to change, and probbaly the last chance for two years. So we can't have a new badge now because they are busy choosing the kit, then we won't have a new badge because they can't change the kit... We can't ask about it during the season because they are concentrating on the season and we can't ask about it in the summer because they have to concentrate on the summer recruitment... And you say proponents of the badge changing are boring? “There was” I wrote, not “There is”. I was mainly referring to the complaints that have gone on all season and in particular after the club announced that a review of the badge was planned for the near future. If any change is going to be made it seems most likely to be announced when the new kit is revealed – if nothing is changed then, fine – recommence the complaints. Personally speaking I would prefer a change to the old badge - but what I find tiresome is the constant whinging and hyperbolic posts on the subject by some. I don’t see how that is going to make a change more likely, if anything it has more chance of provoking the club to dig their heels in. Whatever happens, I think there are more important things in life to be worrying about anyway. When you see some of the things going at other clubs, if the worst you’ve got to complain about is your badge you’re not doing too badly.
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Post by almightybob on May 8, 2013 14:53:56 GMT 1
Anyone who still doesn't get why a piece of random clipart is not a satisfactory replacement for a professional football team badge with history, relevance and identity is frankly not worth entering into a debate with. Some people know the cost of everything and the value of nothing. Is that not a bit self defeating? If you want to win people around to your view, you have to engage with them dont you? And surely your post is entering into a debate with people who dont understand, so your post is contradictory
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2013 15:19:31 GMT 1
And you say proponents of the badge changing are boring? Personally speaking I would prefer a change to the old badge - but what I find tiresome is the constant whinging and hyperbolic posts on the subject by some. I don’t see how that is going to make a change more likely, if anything it has more chance of provoking the club to dig their heels in. And what I find tiresome is people like you declaring "I would prefer a change to the old badge" and expecting it to magically reappear out of thin air. If you don't want to read discussion about a club's badge/identity, don't click on a thread which is clearly centred around it. Stick to worrying about Tom Bradshaw's contract length or something.
Sitting and quietly tutting on this messageboard for five years did absolutely no good in removing that shameful corporate logo. It is only recently that the club have agreed to "re-brand" thanks to the constant discussion about a return to the famous Loggerheads emblem. If everyone shared your meek approach, even this wouldn't have been possible.
Aside from "it's only a badge", "other clubs have bigger things to worry about" and " da players are more important innit" can anyone offer a single reason why we shouldn't reinstate the Loggerheads? In the old days there'd have been dozens of false excuses touted by club apologists. We've come a long way folks.
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Post by stuttgartershrew on May 8, 2013 15:21:43 GMT 1
True. And for the life of me I still don't understand people coming on here saying it's boring, stop talking about, give it a rest...when they can clearly just avoid the thread. If it's of no interest to them then move along, nothing to see here. Strange folk some. I know I'm being pedantic here, but the thread title actually states the thread will be about Crystal Palace's new badge, before the opening post went on to hi-jack about STFC's badge. I think people can be forgiven for complaining about the badge issue being on a thread that really has nothing to do with STFC. Mate, if they don't wish to read about it then just skip it. It's not that hard is it. Plenty of stuff discussed on this board that I have no interest in. Do I pop on those threads and mention that it's boring and folk should stop discussing whatever it is they are discussing? No, I just leave them to it...
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Post by Deleted on May 8, 2013 15:26:35 GMT 1
You want STFC to receive increased revenue? Restore the Loggerheads and watch the sales of merchandise go through the roof. 'Sales going through the roof' look around the ground on match day, there are thousands of fans already buying shirts and scarf's and clearly not concerned about the Badge. I think it's fair to say that those wearing clip art merchandise will buy literally anything.
We know there is a considerable number of Town fans (possibly in the hundreds) who will not touch the stuff - myself included.
Changing the badge would cater for all tastes within our support. It is truly a win-win situation.
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Post by Yes To Loggerheads on May 8, 2013 15:30:35 GMT 1
It is not midway through a kit run. It is at the start of a new kit - the optimum time to change, and probbaly the last chance for two years. So we can't have a new badge now because they are busy choosing the kit, then we won't have a new badge because they can't change the kit... We can't ask about it during the season because they are concentrating on the season and we can't ask about it in the summer because they have to concentrate on the summer recruitment... And you say proponents of the badge changing are boring? “There was” I wrote, not “There is”. I was mainly referring to the complaints that have gone on all season and in particular after the club announced that a review of the badge was planned for the near future. If any change is going to be made it seems most likely to be announced when the new kit is revealed – if nothing is changed then, fine – recommence the complaints. Personally speaking I would prefer a change to the old badge - but what I find tiresome is the constant whinging and hyperbolic posts on the subject by some. I don’t see how that is going to make a change more likely, if anything it has more chance of provoking the club to dig their heels in. Whatever happens, I think there are more important things in life to be worrying about anyway. When you see some of the things going at other clubs, if the worst you’ve got to complain about is your badge you’re not doing too badly. Please change your because avatar it's boring me. I don't care about Benny Gall.
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Post by Yes To Loggerheads on May 8, 2013 15:33:31 GMT 1
*avatar because.
I think Benny Gall's hair has disorientated me.
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on May 8, 2013 16:07:40 GMT 1
If any change is going to be made it seems most likely to be announced when the new kit is revealed – if nothing is changed then, fine – recommence the complaints. That's like saying wait until after an election to cast your vote.
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on May 8, 2013 16:09:00 GMT 1
Whatever happens, I think there are more important things in life to be worrying about anyway. When you see some of the things going at other clubs, if the worst you’ve got to complain about is your badge you’re not doing too badly. And that just begs the question why not fix the badge, then STFC would be perfect
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Post by blazey on May 8, 2013 16:33:57 GMT 1
The STFC rebranding exercise was and continues to be an absolute cock up. The club has adopted a siege mentality for over a year hoping it will blow over, but the issue is so powerful with supporters it simply will not go away... hence we are still discussing it a year on from the original petition.
Don't get me wrong, on the pitch we have come on leaps and bounds in recent years, and long may it continue, but on issues of club identity and branding we are stuck in reverse gear! Another cock up with next seasons kit already in the pipeline!
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Post by devonwhitesprowess on May 8, 2013 16:37:55 GMT 1
Sitting and quietly tutting on this messageboard for five years did absolutely no good in removing that shameful corporate logo. It is only recently that the club have agreed to "re-brand" thanks to the constant discussion about a return to the famous Loggerheads emblem. If everyone shared your meek approach, even this wouldn't have been possible.
Aside from "it's only a badge", "other clubs have bigger things to worry about" and " da players are more important innit" can anyone offer a single reason why we shouldn't reinstate the Loggerheads? In the old days there'd have been dozens of false excuses touted by club apologists. We've come a long way folks.
Yeah this is the sort of thing I was on about – “shameful corporate logo” - phraseology that creates the impression some of those obsessed with the badge change are morons who have worked themselves into a lather. The type of thing which has probably delayed any change for at least a couple of seasons. Bigger things to worry about I’d class as going out of business/having a fascist as manager/dodgy owners pinching money, that sort of thing. Not too much of that going on at STFC, so those that like complaining are free to focus their anger on what the badge looks like and what colour the team play in.
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on May 8, 2013 16:45:58 GMT 1
Yeah this is the sort of thing I was on about – “shameful corporate logo” - phraseology that creates the impression some of those obsessed with the badge change are morons who have worked themselves into a lather. The type of thing which has probably delayed any change for at least a couple of seasons. The club's decision to not change the badge is the responsibility of the club alone. The club did not listen to polite requests. The club did not listen to a large petition. The club did not listen to some pretty offensive criticism. Nothing has " delayed" a badge change other than the club's intransigence.
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