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Post by talkingoftheshrews on Jul 30, 2024 10:24:13 GMT 1
Funny that they knew nohan kenneh didn't have a clue how to play football even before we signed him , but had to sign him all the same due to the mess we were in Aww i thought Kenneh was decent He had some bright moments, but his lack of footballing ability was so stark. If we had played a 3 man midfield and he had two proper ballplayers (Woods & Nolan) alongside him - *maybe* he could've found his feet and shown his talent in other areas. But he was never going to succeed with Winchester and/or Perry alongside him. They aren't good enough technically to make up his shortcomings |
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Jul 30, 2024 10:51:01 GMT 1
Good listen. Can only go on what was said of course but I think the biggest difference this time around will be Hurst. I mean Moore seemed keen at times to emphasize that Taylor could have done this and done that if he'd have wanted to but when Taylor was looking to Moore to give Hernes a go and that the formation was set at 5-3-2 I'm not that convinced. I think being a young and inexperienced manager Taylor might not have felt confident and comfortable in looking to change things whereas I don't think we need worry about that with Hurst.
The criteria when looking to get Hurst in, in hindsight, ought perhaps to have been taken into consideration when we appointed Taylor.
Also, maybe we tried to transition too early from one model to the next. With such a small squad emphasizing quality over quantity perhaps that wasn't the best time to strengthen the squad with " development players" (as they called them). Moore mentioned that they knew the squad would have thinned out the season after, perhaps that would have been a better time to have done so.
Lets hope we have more luck in the loan market this time around.
I think Moore had it right in questioning whether Taylor had what was needed to turn that bad run around despite him talking about his overall record and the standard of football. It was the run that was the concern, Taylor didn't appear to able to turn it around.
From how the interviewed ended I gather the club will once again see hanging around for another season at this level as a success.
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Post by hectord0g137 on Jul 30, 2024 11:10:29 GMT 1
Pretty much as I expected. New management system,teething problems, the natives longing for the past,the old way was better. And the new management know nothing. Move along 6 months the sun is shining and everything is wonderful BUT..... manage the expectations. COYB. Oh and its Amber Micky NOT yellow
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Post by talkingoftheshrews on Jul 30, 2024 11:28:31 GMT 1
One thing I was pleased to hear Moore talk about was the academy, and how it hasn't been performing.
He was right to say that the jump between U18 and a League One first team is too steep, particularly given we're a Cat 3 academy.
It wasn't the focus of Moore's answer, but he briefly said that the U18s were getting released, and not attracting much interest because they'd never played men's (or any, given limited academy fixtures) football.
It's one of the big reasons why we need to address this issue. Yes, most won't make it - but at least we can set them up for decent non league careers, rather than letting them drift into the lower Welsh tiers.
The structure Moore spoke about - loaning players out at various non league tiers from 16/17 years old onwards - is definitely one that can work for us.
And we're well placed geographically to do so - there's non league/Welsh clubs at a range of levels nearby.
I just hope that it's implemented quickly: we've got a few talented youngsters like Loughran about, so let's give them every chance of success.
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Post by Valerioch on Jul 30, 2024 12:16:52 GMT 1
Funny that they knew nohan kenneh didn't have a clue how to play football even before we signed him , but had to sign him all the same due to the mess we were in I suggest you re-listen. Taylor chose Kenneh from a long list of options, because ābeing a footballerā was the least important aspect for him. Loan players cost us next to nothing, Moore confirmed that For what itās worth Moore sees Kenneh exactly as I did, fantastic at winning the ball back, but then clueless with it |
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Post by Valerioch on Jul 30, 2024 12:17:40 GMT 1
Itās a good listen and I recommend it to anybody, but itās worth taking everything with a pinch of salt - as ever in the last 15 months itās only 1 side of the story, but a welcome insight all the same
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2024 13:49:00 GMT 1
To be fair, I've never been that interested in this sort of thing but it was really good by the three guys and Micky Moore.
Micky comes across well, (though I don't think I'd trust him with any secrets) Aiston particularly asks some good questions.
I do believe I am now a convert to the regime and a subscriber to the Podcast.
Don't judge a book by his cardigan.
Any chance of Steve Cotterill being the next guest?
Ya Get What I Mean :-)
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Post by Valerioch on Jul 30, 2024 14:25:49 GMT 1
To be fair, I've never been that interested in this sort of thing but it was really good by the three guys and Micky Moore. Micky comes across well, (though I don't think I'd trust him with any secrets) Aiston particularly asks some good questions. I do believe I am now a convert to the regime and a subscriber to the Podcast. Don't judge a book by his cardigan. Any chance of Steve Cotterill being the next guest? Ya Get What I Mean :-) This would be a blockbuster, Iād love to get his version of events and his version of the truth. Weāve been treated to 12 months of one sided views, so much so itās almost gas lighting. I suspect the truth would be somewhere in the middle |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2024 14:34:42 GMT 1
Very enjoyable over the 2 episodes particularly liked the way that the guys let MM do the talking without too many interruptions.OK he did meander with some of his answers but I imagine that most of us do when we talk at length.
I would imagine that many of us gained a real insight into the role that we had never considered before. It was particularly good when Gavin ,as a manager, was literally drooling at the prospect of having a DOF.
As stated by others we are only getting one side of the story but it's better than nothing.Its clear that his role is a long term project, perhaps we are seeing the early flowering this pre-season?
Very good to hear of the plans for the academy lads,I'm sure Gavin took the opportunity to big up Brackley!
It is sad that there were no doubt lads who came through our academy in recent years who could have carved out a career outside of the PL if we had a path in place but have been lost to the full time game because we just showed them the door at 18
Think we should leave MM to it now, his is not a front line,speaking to the press and fans, role that should be left to PH and CD
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Post by Pilch on Jul 30, 2024 14:35:05 GMT 1
Funny that they knew nohan kenneh didn't have a clue how to play football even before we signed him , but had to sign him all the same due to the mess we were in I suggest you re-listen. Taylor chose Kenneh from a long list of options, because ābeing a footballerā was the least important aspect for him. Loan players cost us next to nothing, Moore confirmed that For what itās worth Moore sees Kenneh exactly as I did, fantastic at winning the ball back, but then clueless with it dont let facts get in the way of a good headline ;-), anyway didnt you think he was classy ?  |
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Post by Pilch on Jul 30, 2024 14:42:42 GMT 1
To be fair, I've never been that interested in this sort of thing but it was really good by the three guys and Micky Moore. Micky comes across well, (though I don't think I'd trust him with any secrets) Aiston particularly asks some good questions. I do believe I am now a convert to the regime and a subscriber to the Podcast. Don't judge a book by his cardigan. Any chance of Steve Cotterill being the next guest? Ya Get What I Mean :-) This would be a blockbuster, Iād love to get his version of events and his version of the truth. Weāve been treated to 12 months of one sided views, so much so itās almost gas lighting. I suspect the truth would be somewhere in the middle from what ive heard , I'd say he's got off lightly and we are already somewhere in the middle |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2024 14:50:58 GMT 1
To be fair, I've never been that interested in this sort of thing but it was really good by the three guys and Micky Moore. Micky comes across well, (though I don't think I'd trust him with any secrets) Aiston particularly asks some good questions. I do believe I am now a convert to the regime and a subscriber to the Podcast. Don't judge a book by his cardigan. Any chance of Steve Cotterill being the next guest? Ya Get What I Mean :-) This would be a blockbuster, Iād love to get his version of events and his versionened of the truth. Weāve been treated to 12 months of one sided views, so much so itās almost gas lighting. I suspect the truth would be somewhere in the middle If that happened I think I would have to wrap whatever device I was listening on in rubber as I would certainly throw it at a wall.š¤Ŗ Interesting to see how it goes at FGR as two of the biggest egos in football are working together š³ |
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Post by Pilch on Jul 30, 2024 14:52:50 GMT 1
This would be a blockbuster, Iād love to get his version of events and his versionened of the truth. Weāve been treated to 12 months of one sided views, so much so itās almost gas lighting. I suspect the truth would be somewhere in the middle If that happened I think I would have to wrap whatever device I was listening on in rubber as I would certainly throw it at a wall.š¤Ŗ Interesting to see how it goes at FGR as two of the biggest egos in football are working together š³ you'd fancy a side on the back of a double relegation would be romping the league no matter who was in charge |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2024 16:14:36 GMT 1
To be fair, I've never been that interested in this sort of thing but it was really good by the three guys and Micky Moore. Micky comes across well, (though I don't think I'd trust him with any secrets) Aiston particularly asks some good questions. I do believe I am now a convert to the regime and a subscriber to the Podcast. Don't judge a book by his cardigan. Any chance of Steve Cotterill being the next guest? Ya Get What I Mean :-) This would be a blockbuster, Iād love to get his version of events and his version of the truth. Weāve been treated to 12 months of one sided views, so much so itās almost gas lighting. I suspect the truth would be somewhere in the middle Spot on, I very much doubt Cotterill would be up for that but I suspect the truth is somewhere in the Middle, I did enjoy the first meeting between Moore and Cotterill in the Lounge at Cheltenham sounded very Alan Partridge. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2024 16:16:10 GMT 1
I did like the line about Flanagan, 'He did play in the games he wasn't suspended for' - Priceless.
Does MM read B&A?
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Post by Valerioch on Jul 30, 2024 16:24:32 GMT 1
I did like the line about Flanagan, 'He did play in the games he wasn't suspended for' - Priceless. Does MM read B&A? I bet he does, the establishment have for years and have attempted / continue to attempt to censor. Coffee anyone? š |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 30, 2024 16:30:48 GMT 1
Hearts and Minds sort of stuff
Micky is the man that can take us forward.
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Post by Pilch on Jul 30, 2024 16:37:41 GMT 1
I did like the line about Flanagan, 'He did play in the games he wasn't suspended for' - Priceless. Does MM read B&A? I bet he does, the establishment have for years and have attempted / continue to attempt to censor. Coffee anyone? š FAKE NEWS its never ever happened, and never will |
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Jul 30, 2024 17:09:48 GMT 1
MM gave a good account of himself but of course we all emphasise our successes and play down the failures.
Overall I liked his strategy for the academy and hope that he continues his record of identifying and developing players to sell on at a profit.
Non of this can be achieved overnight and my hope is for the current management team to get 2 or 3 seasons of stability in which to bring their plans to fruition.
It seems that they have the confidence of the chairman so letās hope he is around to see their success.
With regard to the podcast, itās pretty good but Gav is irritating at times and I think his experiences arenāt as relevant as he thinks.
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Post by Pilch on Jul 30, 2024 17:37:35 GMT 1
MM gave a good account of himself but of course we all emphasise our successes and play down the failures. Overall I liked his strategy for the academy and hope that he continues his record of identifying and developing players to sell on at a profit. Non of this can be achieved overnight and my hope is for the current management team to get 2 or 3 seasons of stability in which to bring their plans to fruition. It seems that they have the confidence of the chairman so letās hope he is around to see their success. With regard to the podcast, itās pretty good but Gav is irritating at times and I think his experiences arenāt as relevant as he thinks. yes, thats super gav, started 17 league games for us |
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Post by dachshund on Jul 30, 2024 18:05:57 GMT 1
I donāt think this podcast will change many minds.
Those who like him will continue to do so. Those who think heās a blusterer and out of his depth will see it as a one-sided version of events on a podcast co-hosted by one of his mates.
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Post by Pilch on Jul 30, 2024 18:58:38 GMT 1
I donāt think this podcast will change many minds. Those who like him will continue to do so. Those who think heās a blusterer and out of his depth will see it as a one-sided version of events on a podcast co-hosted by one of his mates. What an evenly balanced opinion šššš¤£šš¤£ |
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Post by dachshund on Jul 30, 2024 19:01:52 GMT 1
Just a quick checkā¦ do you know that you donāt have to personally make every second post on a thread?
Sometimes if you just leave it alone, other people will engage and share their own posts. Worth a try š
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Post by Pilch on Jul 30, 2024 20:36:12 GMT 1
Just a quick checkā¦ do you know that you donāt have to personally make every second post on a thread? Sometimes if you just leave it alone, other people will engage and share their own posts. Worth a try š There is no need when you keep speaking for them š |
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Post by RBA on Jul 30, 2024 22:09:53 GMT 1
A good listen
MM came over well enough and did what most of us would do, played down some of the poor choices made last season ,and emphasised the genuine bad luck with injuries , but was fairly eloquent about the way he and Hurst work together so it did give a better understanding at least of what he is trying to do
Well done to him for speaking to the pod
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Post by claphamshrew on Jul 31, 2024 0:17:40 GMT 1
Had a listen earlier and given the relationship between Hurst and Moore sounds positive, and given his encouraging comments regarding the academy Iām happy to reserve judgement until the end of this season at the earliest.
That said he did come across a little wise after the event. Itās quite easy to put a positive spin on things with the benefit of hindsight. For example he repeatedly talks about Sraha and Sobowale being development players (with an insinuation that they wouldnāt be expected to be anywhere near the first team) yet I donāt recall this narrative being pushed as strongly during the season. He also fails to mention Idowu who (to date) is arguably the biggest disappointment of all the permanent signings from last summer.
Whilst not a criticism of Moore he also debunked a number of things Iāve read on here such as:
- Confirming the overspend under the previous regime was on players *not* off the field activities
- Confirming loans tend to be very cheap with the parent club paying the majority of the wages (didnāt someone suggest we were paying Killian Phillips circa Ā£5k a week despite him having played one senior game in the cup for palace?)
- Confirming Taylor picked the team and had licence to change the formation
Regarding the first point he said we had at least 7 players on ābig moneyā and itās strongly implied this was the reason for overspend. Itās fair to assume this would be Marosi, Flanagan, Pennington (all signed summer 2021) and Bayliss, Shipley, Dunkley and OāBrien (all signed summer 2022). If their wages were the primary cause for the overspend I still canāt understand how Roland was as unaware as he claimed to be almost a year later. Whilst I suspect they are not completely absolved of wrongdoing, I too would be very interested to hear the thoughts of SC and BC on the matter.
Regarding SC I think itās clear he left as he decided he was unwilling to work with the budget set by RW. I suspect he fell out with RW over it and left on a sour note based on some interviews from early 2023 onwards. Indeed Micky confirmed that when he was appointed he was expecting to work with SC the following season with an exchange of text messages regarding strategy mentioned.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2024 1:22:12 GMT 1
It was interesting given the contrast between now and the previous regime. To be fair Moore seems very positive and doesn't blame anyone or anything and credits SC for at least getting the club into the top half, it was quite a turnaround
The Travis Hernes situation was interesting, clearly someone good enough to be on the bench at the end of the previous season and yet wasn't selected.
Would be interesting to see where Feeney and Perry fit within Moore Criteria, I suspect also Development players.
I kinda knew a bit about wage structures but was still very interesting to hear.
Is Moore's middle name Transparency?
"Roland was so lovely I wanted to cuddle him"
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Post by Pilch on Jul 31, 2024 10:34:47 GMT 1
Had a listen earlier and given the relationship between Hurst and Moore sounds positive, and given his encouraging comments regarding the academy Iām happy to reserve judgement until the end of this season at the earliest. That said he did come across a little wise after the event. Itās quite easy to put a positive spin on things with the benefit of hindsight. For example he repeatedly talks about Sraha and Sobowale being development players (with an insinuation that they wouldnāt be expected to be anywhere near the first team) yet I donāt recall this narrative being pushed as strongly during the season. He also fails to mention Idowu who (to date) is arguably the biggest disappointment of all the permanent signings from last summer. Whilst not a criticism of Moore he also debunked a number of things Iāve read on here such as: - Confirming the overspend under the previous regime was on players *not* off the field activities - Confirming loans tend to be very cheap with the parent club paying the majority of the wages (didnāt someone suggest we were paying Killian Phillips circa Ā£5k a week despite him having played one senior game in the cup for palace?) - Confirming Taylor picked the team and had licence to change the formation Regarding the first point he said we had at least 7 players on ābig moneyā and itās strongly implied this was the reason for overspend. Itās fair to assume this would be Marosi, Flanagan, Pennington (all signed summer 2021) and Bayliss, Shipley, Dunkley and OāBrien (all signed summer 2022). If their wages were the primary cause for the overspend I still canāt understand how Roland was as unaware as he claimed to be almost a year later. Whilst I suspect they are not completely absolved of wrongdoing, I too would be very interested to hear the thoughts of SC and BC on the matter. Regarding SC I think itās clear he left as he decided he was unwilling to work with the budget set by RW. I suspect he fell out with RW over it and left on a sour note based on some interviews from early 2023 onwards. Indeed Micky confirmed that when he was appointed he was expecting to work with SC the following season with an exchange of text messages regarding strategy mentioned. hidden signing on fees and bonus payments , appearance fees etc added to the contract without the chairman's agreement , the chairman had already been made aware of the supposed details and agreed only to discover they were later amended and signed off by our ceo who was too busy cooking his own books to check anything |
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Post by davycrockett on Jul 31, 2024 15:04:00 GMT 1
Had a listen earlier and given the relationship between Hurst and Moore sounds positive, and given his encouraging comments regarding the academy Iām happy to reserve judgement until the end of this season at the earliest. That said he did come across a little wise after the event. Itās quite easy to put a positive spin on things with the benefit of hindsight. For example he repeatedly talks about Sraha and Sobowale being development players (with an insinuation that they wouldnāt be expected to be anywhere near the first team) yet I donāt recall this narrative being pushed as strongly during the season. He also fails to mention Idowu who (to date) is arguably the biggest disappointment of all the permanent signings from last summer. Whilst not a criticism of Moore he also debunked a number of things Iāve read on here such as: - Confirming the overspend under the previous regime was on players *not* off the field activities - Confirming loans tend to be very cheap with the parent club paying the majority of the wages (didnāt someone suggest we were paying Killian Phillips circa Ā£5k a week despite him having played one senior game in the cup for palace?) - Confirming Taylor picked the team and had licence to change the formation Regarding the first point he said we had at least 7 players on ābig moneyā and itās strongly implied this was the reason for overspend. Itās fair to assume this would be Marosi, Flanagan, Pennington (all signed summer 2021) and Bayliss, Shipley, Dunkley and OāBrien (all signed summer 2022). If their wages were the primary cause for the overspend I still canāt understand how Roland was as unaware as he claimed to be almost a year later. Whilst I suspect they are not completely absolved of wrongdoing, I too would be very interested to hear the thoughts of SC and BC on the matter. Regarding SC I think itās clear he left as he decided he was unwilling to work with the budget set by RW. I suspect he fell out with RW over it and left on a sour note based on some interviews from early 2023 onwards. Indeed Micky confirmed that when he was appointed he was expecting to work with SC the following season with an exchange of text messages regarding strategy mentioned. hidden signing on fees and bonus payments , appearance fees etc added to the contract without the chairman's agreement , the chairman had already been made aware of the supposed details and agreed only to discover they were later amended and signed off by our ceo who was too busy cooking his own books to check anything Nope Roland agreed the Ā£70k signing on fee and clean sheet bonus, only appearance fee a suprise but hey your berdon sounds better š |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 31, 2024 16:49:54 GMT 1
Noticed that Brian Caldwell wasn't mentioned at all,
As Davy Crockett says, its Roland would have surely signed everything off, it wasn't SC's Money.
I suspect Shipley is on Cotterill's high wages, perhaps Winchester is too coming from Sunderland - Although he may have been negotiated down.
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