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Post by servernaside on Mar 18, 2021 18:44:00 GMT 1
The Mail have a history of supporting far right wingers eg. Oswald Moseley. And Stanley Matthews too. I agree, Matthews was a notorious right-winger. Sometimes so far to the right that he got touchline chalk on his boots.
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Post by Mortgagehound on Mar 18, 2021 21:27:09 GMT 1
Taxi for Mrs Sturgeon...
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Post by Dancin on Mar 18, 2021 21:31:34 GMT 1
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Post by welshshrew on Mar 18, 2021 21:36:30 GMT 1
Do we have any idea which way the 5 Opposition MSPs and 4 SNP MSPs voted yet?
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Post by zenfootball2 on Mar 18, 2021 21:52:51 GMT 1
the committee has concluded that sturgeon mislead the investigation and yet her spokesperson says she has told the truth, if she has been found to have misled the comitte then surley she has also mislead the scottish parliment? what was the point of this invsestigation and the committe if she is going to ignore the finding because she does not like it!!! www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/nicola-sturgeon-inquiry-salmond-holyrood-b1819304.html"A Holyrood committee has concluded that Nicola Sturgeon misled an investigation into the handling of sexual misconduct claims against her predecessor, according to reports. MSPs on the Scottish Government Handling of Harassment Complaints Committee voted 5-4 that the first minister gave an “inaccurate” account of a meeting with her predecessor during the live investigation, a source told the PA news agency. This would amount to misleading the Scottish parliament. The decision is likely to increase pressure on Ms Sturgeon to stand down before May’s election, although it is unclear whether the act was deemed a resignation-worthy offence." "A Scottish parliament spokeswoman said the committee, which heard lengthy evidence from Ms Sturgeon two weeks ago, was still considering its report. It is expected to be published in the coming days. James Matthews, Sky News’s Scotland bureau chief, said the committee said she had given “an inaccurate account of what happened and she has misled the committee on this matter”. "According to Mr Davis, the messages disclosed by a whistleblower “demand serious investigation”, with one alleging the investigating officer in the case complained of interference by Ms Sturgeon’s chief of staff. The message is alleged to have been sent by Judith Mackinnon, the officer, to the government’s communications director on 6 February 2018, almost two months before Ms Sturgeon claims to have first known about the investigation of her predecessor." "A spokesperson for Ms Sturgeon said: “The first minister told the truth to the committee in eight hours of evidence, and stands by that evidence. “It is clear from past public statements that opposition members of this committee had prejudged the first minister at the outset of the inquiry and before hearing a word of her evidence, so this partisan and selective briefing – before the committee has actually published its final report – is hardly surprising. “The question of the first minister’s adherence to the ministerial code is being considered independently by James Hamilton, and we expect to receive and publish his report soon.” As well as the committee’s inquiry, James Hamilton, a former director of public prosecutions in Ireland, has been investigating whether there was a breach of the ministerial code."
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Post by zenfootball2 on Mar 18, 2021 22:03:40 GMT 1
www.heraldscotland.com/news/19171584.nicola-sturgeon-misled-parliament-alex-salmond-affair-inquiry-finds/"NICOLA Sturgeon misled parliament over the Alex Salmond affair, MSPs have concluded. The Holyrood inquiry into the affair found the First Minister gave "an inaccurate account" of her actions and so misled the cross-party investigation. However it stopped short of saying she did so "knowingly", the threshold for resignation under the Scottish Ministerial Code. It is understood the inquiry split down party lines 5-4 on the issue earlier today, and decided Ms Sturgeon broke the code on the balance of probabilities, with only SNP MSPs clearing their leader." Scottish Tory leader Douglas Ross said: "We cannot set a precedent that a First Minister of Scotland can mislead the Scottish Parliament and get away with it. "We have to trust that the First Minister will be truthful. We no longer can. "We have called out the First Minister based on the overwhelming evidence that she misled Parliament. "We will continue to hold her to the same standards as previous First Ministers of Scotland and demand that she resigns." Scottish Labour leader Anas Sarwar added: “I am not going to prejudge the outcome of the committee report and we await its findings, but if it does conclude that the First Minister has misled Parliament and potentially breached the ministerial code then that is incredibly serious. “This is about the integrity of our Scottish Parliament and upholding standards in public life. “The code which the First Minister has promised to follow by the letter is clear - any minister who is found in breach of the ministerial code has a duty to resign.”
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Post by zenfootball2 on Mar 18, 2021 22:07:41 GMT 1
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Post by zenfootball2 on Mar 18, 2021 22:11:38 GMT 1
she is just ignoring the findings of the committee , the green party will save her with the vote of no confidence. however if the inquiry by James Hamilton, a former director of public prosecutions in Ireland, has been investigating whether there was a breach of the ministerial code. does find she breached the ministerial code then she would be finished.
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Post by zenfootball2 on Mar 18, 2021 22:13:24 GMT 1
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2021 0:17:14 GMT 1
she is just ignoring the findings of the committee , the green party will save her with the vote of no confidence. however if the inquiry by James Hamilton, a former director of public prosecutions in Ireland, has been investigating whether there was a breach of the ministerial code. does find she breached the ministerial code then she would be finished. The UK Government, without fail, ignore critical reports by parliamentary committees. What's new?
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Post by zenfootball2 on Mar 19, 2021 11:04:30 GMT 1
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Post by zenfootball2 on Mar 19, 2021 11:06:10 GMT 1
she is just ignoring the findings of the committee , the green party will save her with the vote of no confidence. however if the inquiry by James Hamilton, a former director of public prosecutions in Ireland, has been investigating whether there was a breach of the ministerial code. does find she breached the ministerial code then she would be finished. The UK Government, without fail, ignore critical reports by parliamentary committees. What's new? have any them accused mp's of misleading the committe and parliment ?
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Post by armchairfan on Mar 19, 2021 11:38:48 GMT 1
she is just ignoring the findings of the committee , the green party will save her with the vote of no confidence. however if the inquiry by James Hamilton, a former director of public prosecutions in Ireland, has been investigating whether there was a breach of the ministerial code. does find she breached the ministerial code then she would be finished. Crucially, the Committee did not find (so it appears) that she KNOWINGLY misled Parliament, and on that basis, she can survive. However, the upcoming Hamilton report may consider the distinction to be immaterial, depending upon its legal terms of reference; if his report concludes that she DID mislead, the matter of whether she did so knowingly or not is rendered moot, and her position would be even more severely weakened.
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Post by zenfootball2 on Mar 19, 2021 13:00:00 GMT 1
she is just ignoring the findings of the committee , the green party will save her with the vote of no confidence. however if the inquiry by James Hamilton, a former director of public prosecutions in Ireland, has been investigating whether there was a breach of the ministerial code. does find she breached the ministerial code then she would be finished. Crucially, the Committee did not find (so it appears) that she KNOWINGLY misled Parliament, and on that basis, she can survive. However, the upcoming Hamilton report may consider the distinction to be immaterial, depending upon its legal terms of reference; if his report concludes that she DID mislead, the matter of whether she did so knowingly or not is rendered moot, and her position would be even more severely weakened. i agreee with you but there is a thin line between misleading the committee and knowingly misleading the parliment .
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2021 13:01:38 GMT 1
I keep flicking on to this thread in the hope that little Miss Cranky has gone back to pantomime.... and taking little Billy Bunter Blackford with her....
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2021 13:05:00 GMT 1
The UK Government, without fail, ignore critical reports by parliamentary committees. What's new? have any them accused mp's of misleading the committe and parliment ? Probably. Given time I will find something about any PM never mind Johnson, who has a habit of misleading all and sundry (proven). In the meantime:- goodlawproject.org/update/johnson-misled-parliament/
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Post by zenfootball2 on Mar 19, 2021 13:06:20 GMT 1
have any them accused mp's of misleading the committe and parliment ? Probably. Given time I will find something about any PM never mind Johnson who has a habit of misleading all and sundry (proven). In the meantime:- goodlawproject.org/update/johnson-misled-parliament/if they have then they should resign as well.
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Post by armchairfan on Mar 19, 2021 13:16:39 GMT 1
Crucially, the Committee did not find (so it appears) that she KNOWINGLY misled Parliament, and on that basis, she can survive. However, the upcoming Hamilton report may consider the distinction to be immaterial, depending upon its legal terms of reference; if his report concludes that she DID mislead, the matter of whether she did so knowingly or not is rendered moot, and her position would be even more severely weakened. i agreee with you but there is a thin line between misleading the committee and knowingly misleading the parliment . I completely agree, but that line is a LEGAL one, and if, within the terms of reference of the Hamilton report, it has been crossed, her position is untenable. We can only await the report.
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Post by zenfootball2 on Mar 19, 2021 13:22:06 GMT 1
it is intresting but hardly suprising that 62% of SNP voters dont belive she should resign even if she is found that have mislead parliment www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9379833/Sturgeon-makes-clear-ignore-committee-finding-misled-Holyrood.html"An Opinium survey published before the news emerged last night found that 51 per cent of Scots believe Ms Sturgeon should resign if she is deemed to have broken the ministerial code, compared to 35 per cent who say she should stay in place. But the research, carried out on March 11, exposed a deep political divide, with 62 per cent of SNP voters thinking she should keep her job."
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2021 13:54:44 GMT 1
it is intresting but hardly suprising that 62% of SNP voters dont belive she should resign even if she is found that have mislead parliment www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9379833/Sturgeon-makes-clear-ignore-committee-finding-misled-Holyrood.html"An Opinium survey published before the news emerged last night found that 51 per cent of Scots believe Ms Sturgeon should resign if she is deemed to have broken the ministerial code, compared to 35 per cent who say she should stay in place. But the research, carried out on March 11, exposed a deep political divide, with 62 per cent of SNP voters thinking she should keep her job." Of course they want her to stay, she's leading them to the promised land
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Post by armchairfan on Mar 19, 2021 14:59:31 GMT 1
it is intresting but hardly suprising that 62% of SNP voters dont belive she should resign even if she is found that have mislead parliment www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9379833/Sturgeon-makes-clear-ignore-committee-finding-misled-Holyrood.html"An Opinium survey published before the news emerged last night found that 51 per cent of Scots believe Ms Sturgeon should resign if she is deemed to have broken the ministerial code, compared to 35 per cent who say she should stay in place. But the research, carried out on March 11, exposed a deep political divide, with 62 per cent of SNP voters thinking she should keep her job." Of course they want her to stay, she's leading them to the promised land That may be so, but if I understand the internal SNP argument, it is that a segment of the party (Salmond supporters?) believes that she isn't leading them quickly enough.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2021 15:57:24 GMT 1
Of course they want her to stay, she's leading them to the promised land That may be so, but if I understand the internal SNP argument, it is that a segment of the party (Salmond supporters?) believes that she isn't leading them quickly enough. If that's the case, why are the Tory MSPs so adamant she should resign. It would be in their best interests to keep her. Interestingly todays above average death figures for 2020 show that the devolved governments all fared better than England. I wonder why that was.
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Post by armchairfan on Mar 19, 2021 16:04:13 GMT 1
That may be so, but if I understand the internal SNP argument, it is that a segment of the party (Salmond supporters?) believes that she isn't leading them quickly enough. If that's the case, why are the Tory MSPs so adamant she should resign. It would be in their best interests to keep her. Interestingly todays above average death figures for 2020 show that the devolved governments all fared better than England. I wonder why that was. In terms of political tactics, I would agree with that, but I wonder whether it it has gone beyond that stage to one of the general health of politics in Scotland.... I genuinely don't know, and we can but wait for the Hamilton report.
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Mar 19, 2021 16:54:19 GMT 1
That may be so, but if I understand the internal SNP argument, it is that a segment of the party (Salmond supporters?) believes that she isn't leading them quickly enough. If that's the case, why are the Tory MSPs so adamant she should resign. It would be in their best interests to keep her. Interestingly todays above average death figures for 2020 show that the devolved governments all fared better than England. I wonder why that was. Population density?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2021 17:59:54 GMT 1
If that's the case, why are the Tory MSPs so adamant she should resign. It would be in their best interests to keep her. Interestingly todays above average death figures for 2020 show that the devolved governments all fared better than England. I wonder why that was. Population density? More importantly urban density which is roughly similar.
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Post by servernaside on Mar 19, 2021 18:12:43 GMT 1
More importantly urban density which is roughly similar. Really? Apart from Glasgow, Edinburgh and Cardiff, Scotland and Wales have far fewer residents of major cities and conurbations than England.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2021 18:28:19 GMT 1
More importantly urban density which is roughly similar. Really? Apart from Glasgow, Edinburgh and Cardiff, Scotland and Wales have far fewer residents of major cities and conurbations than England. Of course that is true but nevertheless urban density is similar no matter what the total population is and covers more than conurbations. Therein lies a majority of covid cases.
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Post by zenfootball2 on Mar 19, 2021 19:29:49 GMT 1
even if this poll is right and that is debatable, the greens will form an alliance with the SNP so no change in scotland news.sky.com/story/sturgeon-on-course-to-remain-first-minister-but-snp-will-fall-short-of-holyrood-majority-poll-for-sky-news-suggests-12249350The SNP have a 22-point lead in a new Scottish poll for Sky News, which would see Nicola Sturgeon remain first minister after the May elections but could deprive her party of an overall majority at Holyrood. The exclusive Opinium poll of Scottish voters, taken this week, also reveals 51% of Scots would support independence - against 49% who say they would remain part of the United Kingdom. Opinium found that when voters were asked about the upcoming Holyrood elections, the SNP would get 46% of the constituency vote, Conservatives 24%, Labour 20%, Lib Dems 6% and the Greens 4%. There is significant division among Scots about whether there should be a referendum in the coming five years: 46% think there should be a referendum before 2026 but a bigger proportion, 47%, think there shouldn't be if the SNP win an overall majority in May. The poll found Ms Sturgeon is still highly popular in Scotland, with a 27-point approval rating, compared with Boris Johnson who gets a rating of -35 and Keir Starmer on -11. Douglas Ross, the Tory leader in Scotland, is also in negative territory on -15, while Anas Sarwar, who was elected Labour leader this month, has a net approval score of 0."
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Mar 19, 2021 20:37:09 GMT 1
More importantly urban density which is roughly similar. Urban density? As in the population density in urban areas? What stats are you looking at when you state that? This information is from 2011 however, I suspect it still holds true when looking to net migration to the UK and where most of those who come to live and work in the UK settle... List of urban areas in the United KingdomGlasgow is listed 5th but no way are those numbers roughly similar to that of London (and they are a good way off those of the West Midlands and Greater Manchester). London of course being the most densely populated and with a population greater than Scotland and Wales combined.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 19, 2021 22:15:01 GMT 1
More importantly urban density which is roughly similar. Urban density? As in the population density in urban areas? What stats are you looking at when you state that? This information is from 2011 however, I suspect it still holds true when looking to net migration to the UK and where most of those who come to live and work in the UK settle... List of urban areas in the United KingdomGlasgow is listed 5th but no way are those numbers roughly similar to that of London (and they are a good way off those of the West Midlands and Greater Manchester). London of course being the most densely populated and with a population greater than Scotland and Wales combined. Numbers of densely populated areas and their size of population has nothing to do with it. A quick guide is published every day on the BBC News website of the effect that covid has in areas of Scotland that are densely populated in relation to sparsely populated areas and it is a quite stark reminder how lucky people who live in rural areas are. Over the course of the pandemic you could see how strikingly urban areas of England have been more affected. It stands to reason that their is a greater risk in those areas and that has nothing to do with how many areas or their individual total populations. Hence urban population density has everything to do with it not total popoulation density.
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