scfcfan
Salop Leisure League
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Post by scfcfan on Jul 9, 2010 11:04:29 GMT 1
Hiya Lads Stockport fan in peace here. A couple of Shrewsbury based County fans have mentioned that you really dont like Paul Simpson It seems he is going to be appointed County manager... Thoughts please (dare i ask?!) Cheers &
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2010 11:08:00 GMT 1
Positives
- His team is usually fairly solid defensively - Tends to use the loan system effectively - Generally a nice fella and quite knowledgable/ articulate (but see comments in negatives too!)
Negatives
- His team is usually boring to watch with a lack of pace and creativity - Has a history of panic buying if short in a particular area - Will criticise players and supporters publically after games
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Post by heavenlyshrew on Jul 9, 2010 11:09:27 GMT 1
O was pro simmo but i do have to admit he got things wrong now and then.Tbh i think he should of been given longer.That is football for you though.
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Post by Ned on Jul 9, 2010 11:11:53 GMT 1
He came in towards the end of a season, and saved us from relegation.
He did a very good job in his first full season at the club, bringing in Grant Holt and getting us to the Play Off final.
In his second full season, last season, we struggled. The turning point for alot of fans was this quote, after we booed a home defeat to the bottom team in the league:
"I think it's diabolical that sane human beings can come in with that sort of mentality".
Certainly made a few people angry, myself included.
He's also been linked with the Libya job recently.
I think he'll do a decent job for you if you get him.
All the best.
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Post by africanshrew on Jul 9, 2010 11:17:56 GMT 1
Agree with the above...
Positives: Came close to getting us promotion, signed Holt, seems a nice bloke, had us scoring for fun very briefly, good in the loan market Negatives: Seems to take it all a bit too personally which leads to him blaming others for his mistakes (fans included), didn't seem to work out which players needed an arm around them and which need a kick up the ar$e, doesn't seem to learn from his mistakes (everything Preston fans told us came true!)
Hope he does well for you though.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2010 11:19:43 GMT 1
He came in towards the end of a season, and saved us from relegation. No he didn't.
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Post by Ned on Jul 9, 2010 11:21:37 GMT 1
He came in towards the end of a season, and saved us from relegation. No he didn't. Yes he did, just lost 4-1 against Barnet. Peters was sacked. McMahon oversaw two 0-0 draws. If Peters had stayed, we'd have been relegated.
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Post by monkee on Jul 9, 2010 11:21:59 GMT 1
He came in towards the end of a season, and saved us from relegation. No he didn't. took the words out of my err fingers. he also didnt blame the fans, he just complained about them booing his team and him.
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Post by monkee on Jul 9, 2010 11:23:46 GMT 1
If Peters had stayed, we'd have been relegated. no we wouldnt, we were actually pretty safe when peters left(he wasnt sacked either as i remember.
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Post by Ned on Jul 9, 2010 11:26:23 GMT 1
If Peters had stayed, we'd have been relegated. no we wouldnt, we were actually pretty safe when peters left(he wasnt sacked either as i remember. Contract 'mutually terminated'. In other words, if he hadn't agreed to it then he'd be sacked. We were falling rapidly.
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Post by heavenlyshrew on Jul 9, 2010 11:27:55 GMT 1
no we wouldnt, we were actually pretty safe when peters left(he wasnt sacked either as i remember. Contract 'mutually terminated'. In other words, if he hadn't agreed to it then he'd be sacked. We were falling rapidly. I am affraid i have to agree with the ginga this time.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2010 11:28:09 GMT 1
Yes he did, just lost 4-1 against Barnet. Peters was sacked. McMahon oversaw two 0-0 draws. If Peters had stayed, we'd have been relegated. Hang on, so did Simpson save us, or would GP have taken us down? Two completely different arguments. We finished the season on 50 points with a significantly better GD than those relegated who finished on 40 and 42 points respectively. Paul Simpson earned 8 points in his 10 games in charge that year. Even if we'd lost every one of those games we'd have finished on 42 points. Wrexham would have been on 43 assuming they'd beaten us with a worse GD. Hence one point from those 10 games we're talking about would have prevented us being relegated. Excuse my ignorance, but even if we had a baby monkey in charge I'd have expected us to have achieved that tally. So did PS save us from relegation? No.
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Post by Ned on Jul 9, 2010 11:31:20 GMT 1
Yes he did, just lost 4-1 against Barnet. Peters was sacked. McMahon oversaw two 0-0 draws. If Peters had stayed, we'd have been relegated. Hang on, so did Simpson save us, or would GP have taken us down? Two completely different arguments. We finished the season on 50 points with a significantly better GD than those relegated who finished on 40 and 42 points respectively. Paul Simpson earned 8 points in his 10 games in charge that year. Even if we'd lost every one of those games we'd have finished on 42 points. Wrexham would have been on 43 assuming they'd beaten us with a worse GD. Hence one point from those 10 games we're talking about would have prevented us being relegated. Excuse my ignorance, but even if we had a baby monkey in charge I'd have expected us to have achieved that tally. Ok, i'll give you that one. The following season, though, we'd have been relegated. Peters ran out of ideas, just as Simpson did towards the end. I was behind Simpson until November last year, at Hereford away. I was also behind Peters until about 2 months before he went. I genuinely think that Simpson was the right man for the job when he came in. Like I say, all the best to him at Stockport.
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Post by monkee on Jul 9, 2010 11:33:28 GMT 1
no we wouldnt, we were actually pretty safe when peters left(he wasnt sacked either as i remember. Contract 'mutually terminated'. In other words, if he hadn't agreed to it then he'd be sacked. We were falling rapidly. in the boardroom were we Ed? he wasnt sacked, end of story. simpson won 1 game against a rapidly dieing wrexham and had 7 draws at the end of that season. no better than peters was doing, we were never in any danger of relegarion despite what the panic miesters on here said at the time.
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Post by stfcfan87 on Jul 9, 2010 11:35:40 GMT 1
Positives - Stabilised the club and helped turn our relegation struggle into a promotion challenge, - Some good signings particuarly grant holt although that was a massive fee and a well known player (don't know if he'd have the ability to buy a player like that at stockport), - Excellent loan signings from bigger clubs, young players started to come through at the end of his time - Genuinely came across as a nice bloke
Negatives - Football was too boring - Awful and humiliating FA cup defeats against small non league opposition in successive seasons - Continually being beaten by sides really struggling at the bottom - 2 fa cup defeats, darlington, grimsby etc - Publically blaming players including by name, after defeats in media interviews - Publically blaming fans for getting on individual players backs after defeats, in media interviews - Publically blaming fans for booing him and the team following really poor performances and defeats in media interviews - Bought in a lot of very experienced highly paid players to get us promoted and didn't happen - majority of them have left now - Reports of player unrest, divisions in the camp in his first full season - between the players he bought in and the ones he didn't - Lots of the previous squad was gotten rid of, some without being given a chance, who have gone on and done exceptionally well in this division - Symes, Herd to name two - Chequebook like manager - would he have done so well had Grant Holt not been here - Failed to get the best out of some players - Weak management at times - even he said after he had sold Holt, that Holt dropping back too deep and not doing what he'd told him - The fact that he left us with so few players, and several of the ones left were his signings that were complete flops - elder, neal for example - our new manager has to rebuild the squad so he's not really left us a legacy - Worryingly the things preston fans said about him came true, which shows he didn't learn from his mistakes.
I guess if he can learn from what's gone wrong in his last two spells, and you're in a decent financial position then he could do well.
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Post by elmundo on Jul 9, 2010 11:35:40 GMT 1
I have massive sympathy with you Stockport fans.
Simpson is a poor manager, and his poor managerial record is masked by his relative success at Carlisle.
With us, he got 8 points from 10 games when he took over. WOW.
Then he spent massive amounts of money, including our record signing, and we limped into the play-offs, where we then didn't bother to show at Wembley.
Then, last season, he dismantled the expensively assembled squad, and replaced it with duffers!
If things are going well, expect it all to be down to him. If things turn sour, it will be all the fan's fault and you will be labelled certain things such as diabolical.
His football is boring to watch, games were becoming a chore last season.
All in all, a poor manager, and with your financial situation, I can't see how he will be a success with you, but time will tell.
Good luck!
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Post by camdenshrew on Jul 9, 2010 11:38:02 GMT 1
I'm sorry to hear this County fan. He thinks he's better than he is and he underachieved massively with the resources he had at his disposal.How can you have Grant Holt up front and Ben Davies in midfield and not get promoted?
The football was boring - espiecially last season. He didn't realise that his squad lacked pace and some of the tactics defied belief. One example, is our away game at Aldershot when we didn't muster an entire effort on goal in 90 minutes.
Very articulate but very thin-skinned. Best of luck but you deserve better.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2010 11:40:52 GMT 1
The game that mattered in that season was the home one against Wrexham who simply gifted us the match because they were so awful. Everything was no better than under Peters.
Having been given enough money to gain us promotion Simpson was unable to achieve this. In the first complete season the away form was dire-3 wins. From the first game we had to wait until the last 2. Agree with the sentiments of pluses and minuses as already stated but again he still should have been given longer to sort it out. It is never a good time to sack a manager but the timing of this has become an encumberance.
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Post by Ned on Jul 9, 2010 11:43:45 GMT 1
Contract 'mutually terminated'. In other words, if he hadn't agreed to it then he'd be sacked. We were falling rapidly. he wasnt sacked, end of story. You know as well as I do, that he would of been if he hadn't agreed to a contract termination.
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Post by elmundo on Jul 9, 2010 11:45:02 GMT 1
he wasnt sacked, end of story. You know as well as I do, that he would of been if he hadn't agreed to a contract termination. Ed, admit that you are wrong on this. Peters and Roland were, and still are good friends. There was no sacking involved.
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Post by kuliloach on Jul 9, 2010 11:47:37 GMT 1
Paul simpson did not save us from relegation. There is no discussion to be had. He took a club who lost in the play off final 2 seasons before to another one but with the biggest budget we'd had in years. How much of an acheivment that was is open to opinion. Season 2, poor signings were made and he was unable to turn things around. Will be interesting to see how he does.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2010 11:50:41 GMT 1
A couple of points:
1) he didn't get 2 grips with our lack of creativity in midfield last season - we were pretty aimless in this area for large parts of the season
2) he brought in the likes of Bright and Elder and offered them long term deals when they should have proved themselves first...Bright was given a deal based on one friendly performance!
3) he alienated the fans - I think he would have still been with us had it not been for this
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Post by Liam on Jul 9, 2010 11:56:01 GMT 1
Others have summed up most of the pluses and minuses very well, although I would add one final (and major) gripe which is his inability to influence a game when it's in the balance.
If the team's behind, struggling and obviously in need of some inspiration or tactical tinkering, far too often absolutely nothing is done. Occasionally, when PS is feeling particularly bold, a like-for-like substitution will be made some time around the 60 minute mark.
Even more infuriating is when the game is still on a knife edge (e.g. it's 0-0 or you've got a fortunate 1-0 lead and the team is under pressure) and the opposition is clearly getting on top and about to score. Instead of trying to influence things positively before the inevitable goal, Simmo always waits until it's happened before doing anything.
If and when he does make a response, it's generally about 5-10 minutes after the goal and will take the form of a like-for-like substitution.
One thing I will say for Simmo is that he seems to have good contacts at big clubs and makes skilful use of the loan system.
The fact Stockport are broke may actually be a blessing in disguise when it comes to Simmo's transfer policy as it'll probably encourage him to rely on loans from bigger clubs (at which he's pretty good) more than signing players from the same level (at which he's pretty dire).
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Post by SY3 on Jul 9, 2010 11:57:54 GMT 1
Any current players with potential need to be worried. Simpson will overlook any decent players you currently have; preferring to bring in inferior replacements. It happened here and was very frustrating as a paying supporter to witness.
Simpson was handed a team and the funds to ensure promotion, but remarkably he dismantled it, resulting in a mid table existence for us.
Also tactically he is extremely limited. One of the main reasons he was labelled 'Homer' on here. He will often bring on 'like for like' changes to little or no effect. I also recall us requiring a draw at home and with the scores level with a few minutes left he replaced a defender with an attacker and we nearly lost the game. My memory is slightly hazy on which game it was but i think a defeat would have put an end to our promotion charge. I don't rate him as a manager and neither do Preston and Rochdale fans; that said i wish him all the very best, and maybe just maybe he can learn from past mistakes and do a good job for you.
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Post by shrew4life on Jul 9, 2010 12:05:48 GMT 1
he wasnt sacked, end of story. You know as well as I do, that he would of been if he hadn't agreed to a contract termination. I seem to remember RW saying something along the lines of he was prepared to stick by GP but it was GP who offered his resignation and after trying to talk him out of it he reluctantly accepted. PS is a dreadful manager. He had no tactical brain. One example of this was an away game at Burton. We went 1 up and they went down to 10 men but they were having all the possession and threatening us. Everyone in the crowd was crying out for a striker to come on for fresh legs and to stop us playing so deep. Nothing happened, then they equalised THEN he brought the sub on with 10 minutes to go which was to late by then. When we won it was because of him. When we lost it was because of the fans and players. He did not save us from relegation. As already pointed out he did quite poor. Then with probably the biggest budget for STFC to date (which was probably one of the biggest in the league) he could only manage 3 wins on the road all season and we only managed scrape into the playoffs. Yes he did sign Grant Holt but even then compared to what he can do he didn't have the greatest of seasons with a lot of his goals coming from the penalty spot. Under him it was the worst football I have ever watched! But I'm sure he will do great for you.
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Post by shrew4life on Jul 9, 2010 12:18:00 GMT 1
Oh and he's a cheque book manager so should be just the person you're looking for.
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Post by SeanBroseley on Jul 9, 2010 12:19:04 GMT 1
Simpson didn't save us from relegation. His win ratio to games at Shrewsbury compares well with most managers we've had, including Graham Turner.
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Post by texmexshrew on Jul 9, 2010 12:55:40 GMT 1
Negatives. Massive turnover of players. Long term contracts to sub par players - you will be lumbered with lots of deadwood. Scouting seems non-exsistent. Inability to change a game by changing tactics or personel. Like for like subs from 60mins on will be the norm. it would appear that the criticisms and warnings from Preston/Dale fans were accurate in that he is devisive/petty. And a chequebook manager. Dire dire football is the normal. Wrap up warm and take a flask, as the football wont warm you in the winter.
I found the fella to be totally uninspiring in his demeanour from day one. I have no idea if that transferred to the players.
Positives.
hes gone. He left us Benjamin VanDen Broek. Convinced the likes of Holt, Murray to come to the Meadow. (and then failed to manage Holt for the total benefit of the team). Hopefully he will come back to 'raid' his legacy for you - Lewis Neal and Nathan Elder you can start with.
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Post by venceremos on Jul 9, 2010 13:33:23 GMT 1
A lot of the usual blame-the-manager-for-everything guff on here. Our coffee wasn't as good last season and some would probably put that down to Simpson as well. But when, for example, Grant Holt missed open goals, as I saw him do on several occasions, I don't think the manager was at fault.
Anyway, I've no interest in getting into a prolonged debate on Simpson - been done to death. Suffice to say, if you knock out the more extreme negative comments, the overall assessment of his time with us won't be far wrong.
Sacked managers (like employees) are soft targets for having the blame pinned on them for absolutely everything and it's never that simple. Nothing's certain, but I've no doubt that Simpson can be a successful manager somewhere else. You've had a tough time of it lately, scfcfan, so I won't mind if he does that with you - as long as it's not at our expense of course.
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Post by blum on Jul 9, 2010 13:49:01 GMT 1
Peter's resigned due to being undermined and someone on the board wanting to get involved on the footballing side (GP's own words)
As for Simmo for Stockport, hmmmm, you never know, he's done well in a couple of jobs and failed in others. I guess if he does go there (and good luck to him) then only time will tell.
He lost the plot a bit towards the end but a decent bloke IMO.
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