Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2010 16:33:32 GMT 1
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Post by Shrewed on Jun 15, 2010 16:40:55 GMT 1
Be careful you'll be accused of treason for protesting against our perfect armed forces.
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Post by Dont believe the HYPE on Jun 15, 2010 16:47:07 GMT 1
Almost as shameful as the IRA blowing up dozens of women and children.
Regrettable incident none the less
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2010 16:53:42 GMT 1
Almost as shameful as the IRA blowing up dozens of women and children. Regrettable incident none the less couldnt agree more, and if the people who died that day where terrorists who did blow up women and children then quite frankly they would have got what they deserved. but the whole point of this thread is that they wherent.
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Post by Dont believe the HYPE on Jun 15, 2010 17:01:33 GMT 1
Do you honestly take these findings seriously? Nearly 40 years after the event an enquiry decides all those killed were innocent. New government in power so must seen to be distancing itself from the old hard line regime, Nothing more than a PR exercise im afraid
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2010 17:12:15 GMT 1
While I have no knowledge of the details of the Bloody Sunday killings and therefore no informed view on whether it is a "British Shame" or not, I do find it ironic, not to mention downright distasteful, that Gerry Adams feels it appropriate to take part in a protest march demanding justice for those innocent people killed....
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2010 17:14:36 GMT 1
Do you honestly take these findings seriously? Nearly 40 years after the event an enquiry decides all those killed were innocent. New government in power so must seen to be distancing itself from the old hard line regime, Nothing more than a PR exercise im afraid yes i do, unless you have some new evidence that hasnt been looked into over the past 12 years concerning this incident? please enlighten us. and which new government are you referring to, the Labour government that commisionned it or the condem one that has just recieved the findings.
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Post by Ned on Jun 15, 2010 17:19:47 GMT 1
What a shame and all the PM has to say is "I am deeply sorry". t*****.
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Post by RBA on Jun 15, 2010 17:21:12 GMT 1
Sorry but thought both Cameron and Harman got it right today The truth must be acknowledged openly and apology made if healing can happen well done Blair for setting it up The inquiry also states that Martin Mcguiness was present at Bloody Sunday with a machine gun ,an apology for that would be good, as well as an appropriate apology for those killed on Bloody Sunday how about an IRA apology to those it killed including a 1000 members of the security forces as well as many civilians It would take guts but its the only way forward
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Post by mrbunny on Jun 15, 2010 17:25:29 GMT 1
What a shame and all the PM has to say is "I am deeply sorry". t*****. What are they meant to say? Not as if any member of the government now or the one that has just gone were anything to do with it.
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Post by Dont believe the HYPE on Jun 15, 2010 17:32:13 GMT 1
Do you honestly take these findings seriously? Nearly 40 years after the event an enquiry decides all those killed were innocent. New government in power so must seen to be distancing itself from the old hard line regime, Nothing more than a PR exercise im afraid yes i do, unless you have some new evidence that hasnt been looked into over the past 12 years concerning this incident? please enlighten us. and which new government are you referring to, the Labour government that commisionned it or the condem one that has just recieved the findings. An enquiry instigated by Blair 12 years ago during a time of tension in Ireland, you must remember Blair always said he wanted his legancey to be that of a stabalised Ireland. So a report into the most contraversional incident of the troubles apised the Republicans and Blair was thinking he was a popular as St Patrick. Now after 11 years and at the cost of tens of millions of pound it is announced months into a new Tory Government, who happened to be in power at the time of Bloody Sunday, that all the people killed were innocent and practically murdered. All too convenient for my liking
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2010 17:34:16 GMT 1
What a shame and all the PM has to say is "I am deeply sorry". t*****. What are they meant to say? Not as if any member of the government now or the one that has just gone were anything to do with it. [img src="http://www.shropshire.btinternet.co.uk/smiley/ www.mysmiley.net/imgs/smile/mad/mad0223.gif"].gif [/img][/quote] agree, what else can they do. in itself, the truth coming out will hopefully help to heal a lot of wounds. and i do agree to an extent about gerry adams and martin mcguiness. gerry adams is however (like it or not) a democratically elected representative of the people. and if martin macguiness had got a bullett in his head on bloody sunday he could have had no complaint, but the real irony is, he didnt, innocent people did, and he went on to help build the peace that northern ireland has now.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2010 17:36:03 GMT 1
[ An enquiry instigated by Blair 12 years ago during a time of tension in Ireland, you must remember Blair always said he wanted his legancey to be that of a stabalised Ireland. So a report into the most contraversional incident of the troubles apised the Republicans and Blair was thinking he was a popular as St Patrick. Now after 11 years and at the cost of tens of millions of pound it is announced months into a new Tory Government, who happened to be in power at the time of Bloody Sunday, that all the people killed were innocent and practically murdered. All too convenient for my liking your not serious are you?
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Post by Dont believe the HYPE on Jun 15, 2010 17:48:54 GMT 1
[ An enquiry instigated by Blair 12 years ago during a time of tension in Ireland, you must remember Blair always said he wanted his legancey to be that of a stabalised Ireland. So a report into the most contraversional incident of the troubles apised the Republicans and Blair was thinking he was a popular as St Patrick. Now after 11 years and at the cost of tens of millions of pound it is announced months into a new Tory Government, who happened to be in power at the time of Bloody Sunday, that all the people killed were innocent and practically murdered. All too convenient for my liking your not serious are you? Im Afraid so, no normal member of the public will ever know what really happened on that day, they can spend another 50 million and 12 years and it would come back a completely different version of events. All the report is a pr exercise, same as De Menizez case.
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Post by WindsorShrew on Jun 15, 2010 17:57:00 GMT 1
What a shame and all the PM has to say is "I am deeply sorry". t*****. Well at least your well qualified to comment on to55ers.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2010 18:01:34 GMT 1
What a shame and all the PM has to say is "I am deeply sorry". t*****. Well at least your well qualified to comment on to55ers. thank you for your expert incite into this topic,well worth waiting for
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Post by WindsorShrew on Jun 15, 2010 18:02:25 GMT 1
While I have no knowledge of the details of the Bloody Sunday killings and therefore no informed view on whether it is a "British Shame" or not, I do find it ironic, not to mention downright distasteful, that Gerry Adams feels it appropriate to take part in a protest march demanding justice for those innocent people killed.... Look at it from a different angle Vic, if Mr Adams and co had not shown support to the Republican cause they would hold no sway in the Republican community. I like neither man but they have in their way assisted peace in the province and if we cant respect that we should at least appreciate it. The findings are the facts we must deal with, I accept them but don't want to. One thing I will state is I believe this one act carried out by an aggressive armed force and the lack of recognition have done more to damage relations and bolster hard line support form Republicanism than any other act.
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Post by venceremos on Jun 15, 2010 18:33:11 GMT 1
your not serious are you? Im Afraid so, no normal member of the public will ever know what really happened on that day, they can spend another 50 million and 12 years and it would come back a completely different version of events. All the report is a pr exercise, same as De Menizez case. I don't accept that at all. A 12 year public enquiry is not a PR exercise. What if the Saville Report had reached the opposite conclusion, would that also have been PR? Who does it suit to have this outcome? The government? No. The army? Hardly. The Unionists? Of course not. The Republicans? Yes. Why would the British judiciary collude in a 12 year public enquiry as a PR exercise on behalf of Irish republicanism? It wouldn't, is the simple answer. It's always easy to be cynical, but for once it's worth giving credit to the independence of the British judiciary for producing a report that makes very difficult reading for any British government and, especially, for the army. I think WindsorShrew is dead right that Bloody Sunday probably did more for the cause of IRA recruitment than any other event during the Troubles. It's pointless being offended by the actions of McGuinness and Adams. They were on one side of the conflict but that has to be put behind us. All sides must keep working to build on the huge progress that's been made in the last decade or so.
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Post by froggy on Jun 15, 2010 18:36:25 GMT 1
What a shame and all the PM has to say is "I am deeply sorry". t*****. What is he supposed to say? I'm not a huge fan of the man but there isn't anything wrong with saying "sorry". One, he doesn't even have to say sorry and two, at least he's aknowledging what's happened. He probably doesn't care, but he has to show he does. Its what politicians do. People have a problem of blocking out positives because they hate a person and you're someone like that.
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Post by nicko on Jun 15, 2010 18:40:09 GMT 1
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Post by dawleyshrew59 on Jun 15, 2010 18:43:39 GMT 1
Are the Irish murdering scum who are now in the Irish government going to apologise for all innocent British citizens they blew up and the soldiers doing a peace keeping job........guess not (from a ex solider who served in Belfast at the height of the troubles]
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Post by Dont believe the HYPE on Jun 15, 2010 18:45:59 GMT 1
It's pointless being offended by the actions of McGuinness and Adams. They were on one side of the conflict but that has to be put behind us. All sides must keep working to build on the huge progress that's been made in the last decade or so. Oh I see, Forget what Adams and McGuinness did, but spend millions and over a decade investigating British soldiers, makes perfect sense now
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2010 18:56:50 GMT 1
Are the Irish murdering scum who are now in the Irish government going to apologise for all innocent British citizens they blew up and the soldiers doing a peace keeping job........guess not (from a ex solider who served in Belfast at the height of the troubles] everyone knows that the IRA murdered innocent men women and children, everyone knows the unionist paramilitarys did the same. and yes they should apologise. the point is though surely, that the british army where there to keep the peace, but on this occassion they have brought shame on themselves by opening fire on an unarmed civil rights march. i dont get why people keep muddling the arguement with talk of the ira. everyone knows they are murderers (or a freedom fighter if your an irish republican).
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Post by jamo on Jun 15, 2010 19:03:06 GMT 1
One of the signs of a healthy and strong democracy is having the ability to be able to accept that it got something wrong and acknowledge that fact, then seek to make amends and offer a proper and profound apology to those affected, and then take steps to ensure that something similar does not happen again- South Africa anyone ?
That is hopefully what has happened here.
This is not an Irish/ English thing at all. Plenty of people of all nationalities were rightly outraged and shamed by the actions of the British Army that day- they got it wrong and very badly so.This outrage was compounded by the rushed, inaccurate and in places downright untrue original inquirey carried out in the months that followed the event.
Were I a relative or friend of those murdered that day i would want accountability and closure. Hopefully they have that now.
As a young man growing up I never thought i would see the peace we now have in Northern Ireland. Thank you Tony Blair and thanks also to Cameron for saying what he said today to confirm our countries ability to say we got things wrong.
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trickymicky
Shropshire County League
Heaven won't have me and hells afraid i'll take over![Mo0:0]
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Post by trickymicky on Jun 15, 2010 19:10:37 GMT 1
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2010 19:32:28 GMT 1
. Thank you Tony Blair and thanks also to Cameron for saying what he said today to confirm our countries ability to say we got things wrong. to be fair, (and you wont hear me say this very often) but yes, i think Cameron got it spot on today, watched it on the i player and think his responce was very good. so fair play to him.
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Post by d00bie on Jun 15, 2010 20:18:41 GMT 1
It's easy to say your sorry after nearly 40 years, would he say that if he were in charge at the time ? I very much doubt it.
It was a war zone, where the paramilitary wandered around armed to the teeth, the soldiers were on edge, mistakes were made that day, one of them was us being there in the first place.
But lets get one thing straight how many died on the British mainland due to the IRA bombings a damn sight more than died on bloody sunday thats for sure.
Best thing the government of the day could have done was cut ties with Ireland altogether stop them traveling over to britain and let them get on with it same with Afghanistan let the stupid religious ****s kill each other all in the name of their gods.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2010 20:26:04 GMT 1
£180 million?
You could get have got yourself a couple of decent forwards and a ball playing midfielder for that price.
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Post by El Presidente on Jun 15, 2010 21:33:26 GMT 1
Northern Ireland...a massively complex area to explore...anyone interested in gaining insight should start here: www.amazon.co.uk/Brits-War-Against-Peter-Taylor/dp/074755806X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1276633487&sr=1-1Whilst I have no sympathy for terrorists, I am open minded enough to understand their motivations. And whilst I have sympathy for soldiers put in extreme situations and ultimately made scapegoats for a situation created by poor political and miltary leadership, I fully concur this was a black day for them. Reconcilliation is the only way forward ... and it may suprise many that when troops were first deployed to NI, they were warmly welcomed by the Catholics ... A shame the honeymoon did not last.
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Post by shrewsace on Jun 15, 2010 21:46:18 GMT 1
You wake up in the morning, you've got to read all the Sunday papers, the kids are running around, you've got to mow the lawn, wash the car and you just think "Sunday, bloody Sunday"
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