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Post by shrew4life on Nov 13, 2010 18:47:34 GMT 1
How bad was Neal's mistake? Is it time for him to be dropped and give smith a chance? He makes a mistake every few games and is costing us points. Time for a change imo.
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Post by ferkle94 on Nov 13, 2010 20:07:33 GMT 1
No. Neal is a good keeper, still learning his trade.. leave him be. Dont have much faith in smith
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Post by shrew4life on Nov 13, 2010 20:12:18 GMT 1
We can't afford to have a keeper learning his trade if we want promotion! It's to risky and costly as already proven. He's had his chance as far as I'm concerned and Smith deserves his chance now. How many more goals does he have to give away before you would change him?
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Post by differentcoco on Nov 13, 2010 20:27:34 GMT 1
was a poor mistake imo
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Post by heavenlyshrew on Nov 13, 2010 20:30:06 GMT 1
2 or 3 times in homes games he has spilled the ball and got away with it.I said weeks ago GT needs a decent keeper. I am sorry but Neal is not good enough.
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Post by eclipsechaser on Nov 13, 2010 20:46:00 GMT 1
We desperately need a better keeper with respect to Neal . Learning to get better will cost us points which could cost us promotion . Come On GT , irons in the fire and all that .
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2010 22:48:04 GMT 1
I appreciate he's young and I also feel we've been spoiled with good 'keepers recently (Button, Daniels, Hart etc.) but I think he's the weak link in the defensive armour - I hope he proves me wrong.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2010 23:11:54 GMT 1
I'm still backing Neal,
and if we do need a better keeper than Neal, its not Ben Smith
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Post by hooverfoxhat on Nov 13, 2010 23:24:29 GMT 1
Interestingly the other keeper we had on trial over the summer, Lennie Pidgeley, is now in the starting eleven with Bradford City.
Never been convinced about Neal, very hesitant, poor communicator, poor distribution (I don't think he found his man at Southampton once last week with his kicking), unsure and fails to command his 6yd box, not the best handler of the ball (he's certainly fumbled a few and flapped at a few others) but at times a good shot stopper.
I'm sure there's something there which at times does surface and shows all that there is a talent but far too inconsistent for my liking, the weak link within the starting eleven in my opinion and I'd feel alot happier and confident with a proven, experienced keeper with a track record. I just don't like the idea of pushing for promotion with a keeper learning his trade, I really hope he proves me wrong though.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2010 23:38:41 GMT 1
Are we Arsenal in disguise? That'll do me, as they invariably finish in the top 3.
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Post by shrewd67 on Nov 14, 2010 9:46:41 GMT 1
It's a difficult one. Some games this season he's been excellent but his handling and positioning in others has been pretty woeful and cost us goals. GT should give him until mid-Jan and see how Neal and the team are doing then.
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Post by northwestman on Nov 14, 2010 11:28:37 GMT 1
Just looked at the Stevenage goal a dozen times or so and yes it is indeed a bad error by Neal.
Either he holds the ball or pushes it round the post. Presenting the ball on a plate to the Stevenage striker is not an option.
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Post by Scarecrow on Nov 14, 2010 12:28:30 GMT 1
Just watched the goal and while I can understand kepers making mistakes he makes far too many and this just shows it again today. If you think about it he's cost us 4 points this season so far: once at Wycombe and today at Stevange. Maybe the chance to let Smith have a go?
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Post by mrbunny on Nov 14, 2010 13:03:28 GMT 1
Awful mistake but if he plays next week we need to get behind him not on his back.
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Post by elmundo on Nov 14, 2010 13:34:08 GMT 1
Just a matter of moments after his mistake, Neal made a superb save.
Now, nobody is going to talk about it, because A) The player was offside, but neither Neal nor the attacker knew that and B) some people on here just love slating our players.
Neal threw himself at the feet of the attacker, spread himself and made a very good block.
But people only want to criticise. Typical.
The lad has been overall very good this season, and I rate him better than Smith, so I say stick with Chris and get behind him.
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Post by shrewforever on Nov 14, 2010 13:34:29 GMT 1
Shocking error........
Cant have this nonsense either "that he is learning his trade" he would have been taught how to deal with shots like that at school or certainly youth team level....................
He aint good enough and sadly from what I've seen of Smith so far neither is he...........
New keeper needed IMO......
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Post by shrew4life on Nov 14, 2010 13:44:24 GMT 1
Just a matter of moments after his mistake, Neal made a superb save. Now, nobody is going to talk about it, because A) The player was offside, but neither Neal nor the attacker knew that and B) some people on here just love slating our players. Neal threw himself at the feet of the attacker, spread himself and made a very good block. But people only want to criticise. Typical. The lad has been overall very good this season, and I rate him better than Smith, so I say stick with Chris and get behind him. It's his job to make saves so people will only comment on his mistakes, unless it's an outstanding save, which I doubt it was. After giving away yet another goal, to right he should make a good save. I preferred Neal to Smith earlier on in the season and have given Neal a chance but Smith can do no worse surely. Neal just doesn't fill me with confidence and always looks likely to make a mistake.
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Post by davycrockett on Nov 14, 2010 17:25:07 GMT 1
It was a bad mistake spilling a weak scuffed shot, but he has also played well in other games and gained us points.......
He did however get his place in the team following an injury to Smith who GT had started the season as he's preferred choice and made a great start doing little wrong so its a decision for GT based on other factors like attitude in training and who the defense feel comfortable with so we'll have to wait and see although I think GT will give him another chance
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2010 17:32:24 GMT 1
Just a matter of moments after his mistake, Neal made a superb save. Now, nobody is going to talk about it, because A) The player was offside, but neither Neal nor the attacker knew that and B) some people on here just love slating our players. Neal threw himself at the feet of the attacker, spread himself and made a very good block. But people only want to criticise. Typical. The lad has been overall very good this season, and I rate him better than Smith, so I say stick with Chris and get behind him. The nature of football. A goalie can be brilliant for 89 minutes but makes a mistake and gets remembered for that. A striker can be terrible for 89 minutes, scores a goal and gets remembered for that. Personally Im not convinced by Neal but I said give him a chance to prove himself. He has made a few mistakes but he's also made some brilliant saves at times but unfortuantely they dont get remembered. The problem is the more mistakes he makes the more likely it is he will become a target for our own fans and then we are in a Glyn Garner situation where its clear the confidence has gone and its hard to come back from that. Id stick with him, mainly because of what Ive seen of Smith I dont think he's particuarly better
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Post by frustratedshrew on Nov 14, 2010 17:59:01 GMT 1
Neal is a good keeper at this level and stick behind him don't get on his back carson done the same as neal done earlier in the season against chelsea you don't hear baggies fans wanting carson dropped yes he spilt it but the bounce caught him by surprise ask any keeper even joe hart they hate the ball bouncing just before it gets to them.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2010 20:02:46 GMT 1
But people only want to criticise. Typical. The lad has been overall very good this season, and I rate him better than Smith, so I say stick with Chris and get behind him. Rubbish mate - most on here are fair and will praise when a player deserves praising too - see the response after the Morecambe and Rotherham games for evidence of that when Chris Neal is concerned. However he has been at fault for a number of goals this year - without even looking into any further I can think of the following off the top of my head - Stevenage's goal - Chesterfield's second when he came for a cross and got nowhere near it and Wycombe's second in our away game too. I really hope these mistakes stop are cut-out but it is for me the most important position on the pitch.
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Post by BlueTone on Nov 14, 2010 20:12:31 GMT 1
Just a matter of moments after his mistake, Neal made a superb save. Now, nobody is going to talk about it, because A) The player was offside, but neither Neal nor the attacker knew that and B) some people on here just love slating our players. Neal threw himself at the feet of the attacker, spread himself and made a very good block. But people only want to criticise. Typical. The lad has been overall very good this season, and I rate him better than Smith, so I say stick with Chris and get behind him. 100% agree. Exalted
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Post by champagneprince on Nov 14, 2010 21:01:13 GMT 1
I don't get this "he'll cost us 6 points" logic. In The Premiership where consistency is king it would be fair enough, but in League 2 keepers will make mistakes.
Everything is relative. Neal might cost us 6 points but Vale and Rotherhams keeper will do the same.
Sure, we could buy in a better keeper who might 'gain' us 6 points and if we go up a division we may need to do that (along with half a dozen or more outfield players ! ) but as it stands Neal is as good a keeper as any other keeper at this level and relative to them he isn't costing us points.
What will cost us points is if he dips below his current consistency level. A loss of confidence is a big issue with keepers, more than anyone else on the pitch, even strikers. If he loses confidence his performance will deteriorate and therefore I would say we should get behind him a bit more and give him a bit of encouragement.
Give the defenders some s**t though as they're giving the opposition the opportunities to shoot !
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Post by keithyshrew25 on Nov 14, 2010 21:05:06 GMT 1
We have 3 keepers so doubt we're in teh market for any more, and from what I've seen this season Neal has made some crucial saves in tight games.
You have to play your best team, and Neal is our best keeper so I still see it as his position to lose
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Post by champagneprince on Nov 14, 2010 21:14:13 GMT 1
Goals against
Chesterfield - 19 Vale - 8 Town - 17 Wycombe - 16 Bury - 20 Rotherham - 21 Torquay - 18 Stevenage - 13 Crewe - 23 Maccy - 22 Cheltenham - 25
So other than Vale, our defence is performing as well as anybodys and at home we've only conceded 5, second only behind Vale.
If Neal was costing us points, our home goals conceded would be much worse.
Away from home, we've conceded 12, which is only joint 11th. The away defensive performance is what is costing us points rather than Neals alone.
Simply, away from home, we can't stop the shots raining down on our keeper.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2010 21:27:44 GMT 1
Very simplistic view CP - surely to back up your final statement you'd look at how many shots we've conceded away from home vs. at home rather than the number of goals?
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Post by stockportershrew on Nov 14, 2010 21:56:21 GMT 1
There's two games (Wycombe and yesterday) where he's conceded through fairly basic errors (the Chesterfield one for me was a mix of him and the central defenders getting it wrong). In the games I've seen he's done ok. He's going to make mistakes. The question is whether he learns quickly enough from them and whether GT feels we can afford to wait. Equally, do we develop our own keeper for the first time in a while or rely on loans again?
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Post by champagneprince on Nov 14, 2010 22:06:20 GMT 1
Very simplistic view CP - surely to back up your final statement you'd look at how many shots we've conceded away from home vs. at home rather than the number of goals? Maybe so, but i've not got them to hand ! I would assume (based on logic alone) that because we've conceded more than twice the amount away (12) than we have at home (5) that we are letting through twice as many shots ? Simplistic yes, logical yes. Sometimes simple logic is best as it gives a general picture IMO and in my view that general picture demonstrates that it is not the keeper losing us points. I will stand corrected if the stats show we are letting through just as many shots as we are at home but letting in more because the keeper isn't saving them. In which case we would need to look at why Neal isn't saving them AWAY from home.
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Post by texmexshrew on Nov 14, 2010 22:12:15 GMT 1
Some fair points here. He could well be the weakest link in our defensive 5, however any call for Smith is a like for like swap in my opinion. Both have very deep starting positions and are somewhat static. As mentioned , we have been pretty spoiled in the goalkeeping department of late.
Part of the problem initially is the amount of times our central midfield allow these shots from 20 something yards. Stop that first. He has spilled out too many shots back into the live area though, and he'll have to work harder to learn and apply the necessary skills to stop this.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 14, 2010 22:21:01 GMT 1
CP - just a very quick look on shrewsweb - last few league games home and away and the number of shots the opposition has had
Away: Stevenage 14 (5 on) Crewe 12 (5 on) Chesterfield 17 (5 on) Total: 43 (15 on)
Home: Barnet 11 (3 on) Lincoln 10 (3 on) Torquay 16 (5 on) Total: 37 (11 on)
The stats are available for each game's match report on shrewsweb.
Make of that what you will.
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