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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2010 9:24:47 GMT 1
your average fisherman doesnt send in a pack of otters to chase and terrorise the fish for an hour or so before the fish can swim no longer and is hence pulled limb from limb till dead by said otters.
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Post by Victoria on Jun 9, 2010 9:34:07 GMT 1
If I had an army of trained otters I wouldn't need to fish for entertainment.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2010 6:16:21 GMT 1
If I had an army of trained otters I wouldn't need to fish for entertainment. what about an army of trained hounds?
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Post by WindsorShrew on Jun 10, 2010 6:42:28 GMT 1
So to clarify Pab are you pro or anti fox hunting.....
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2010 21:58:37 GMT 1
I'm confused Baystonblue. You say the population needs controlling, but not by dogs and people on horses. I assure you the dogs do a much more efficient job of killing the fox than a person with a rifle ever could. The dogs go straight for the neck, killing it instantly, whereas a perfect head-shot would be needed by a gun. Which isn't easy! I think you will find that one of the main reasons people hate fox hunting by the hunt, is based on terrible pictures of hounds ripping a fox limb by limb while still alive. A quick kill, i don't think so. I've seen a fox shot by gun, and believe me, it does not need a clean head shot. My main point is, however, that i would rather we live side by side with the fox, than kill him.
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Post by monkee on Jun 10, 2010 23:03:28 GMT 1
your average fisherman doesnt send in a pack of otters to chase and terrorise the fish for an hour or so before the fish can swim no longer and is hence pulled limb from limb till dead by said otters. as a childhood of tarka the otter and ring of bright water fan who still harbours a desire for a pack of otter, and a a keen angler , i believe that i am uniquely qualified to answer this question. If i had a pack of otters, i wouldnt take them fishing. it would be chaos getting them in and out of the car, you wouldnt want to let them into the water because fish tend to leg it(well , fin it is more accurate), so you would have to tie them up at a tree on leashes and i dont think they would like it either. the place where i fish at the moment has a no dog rule and i think i would also have to find out if there was a no domesticated otters rule.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2010 8:35:36 GMT 1
your average fisherman doesnt send in a pack of otters to chase and terrorise the fish for an hour or so before the fish can swim no longer and is hence pulled limb from limb till dead by said otters. as a childhood of tarka the otter and ring of bright water fan who still harbours a desire for a pack of otter, and a a keen angler , i believe that i am uniquely qualified to answer this question. If i had a pack of otters, i wouldnt take them fishing. it would be chaos getting them in and out of the car, you wouldnt want to let them into the water because fish tend to leg it(well , fin it is more accurate), so you would have to tie them up at a tree on leashes and i dont think they would like it either. the place where i fish at the moment has a no dog rule and i think i would also have to find out if there was a no domesticated otters rule.
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Post by El Presidente on Jun 17, 2010 16:27:48 GMT 1
A fox was photographed by a police officer at the property just after the attack on twins. He spotted the fox through a patio door at the home and a photo using his mobile telephone. It is not certain whether the officer's photograph is of the fox which mauled the twins. Following the attack, London Mayor Boris Johnson called on all councils to "focus on their duties" regarding pest control. news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/10342570.stmSo the Fox is a pest then...
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Post by Deleted on Jun 17, 2010 16:49:44 GMT 1
A fox was photographed by a police officer at the property just after the attack on twins. He spotted the fox through a patio door at the home and a photo using his mobile telephone. It is not certain whether the officer's photograph is of the fox which mauled the twins. Following the attack, London Mayor Boris Johnson called on all councils to "focus on their duties" regarding pest control. news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/10342570.stmSo the Fox is a pest then... i for one have never argued that a fox is a pest or not. however, what is clear is that if its decided to curb the numbers of urban foxes, which again i dont really have an opinion on, im pretty sure they wont be sending in 20 people on hoarse back armed with a pack of 30 hounds. not even boris is that stupid, although.....................
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Post by El Presidente on Jun 17, 2010 16:52:22 GMT 1
A fox was photographed by a police officer at the property just after the attack on twins. He spotted the fox through a patio door at the home and a photo using his mobile telephone. It is not certain whether the officer's photograph is of the fox which mauled the twins. Following the attack, London Mayor Boris Johnson called on all councils to "focus on their duties" regarding pest control. news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/10342570.stmSo the Fox is a pest then... i for one have never argued that a fox is a pest or not. however, what is clear is that if its decided to curb the numbers of urban foxes, which again i dont really have an opinion on, im pretty sure they wont be sending in 20 people on hoarse back armed with a pack of 30 hounds. not even boris is that stupid, although..................... I've heard its all part of his policy on reducing the carbon footprint of tfl...
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Post by WindsorShrew on Jun 17, 2010 18:03:56 GMT 1
your average fisherman doesnt send in a pack of otters to chase and terrorise the fish for an hour or so before the fish can swim no longer and is hence pulled limb from limb till dead by said otters. Since when have fish had limbs ? you imposter !
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Post by Victoria on Jun 21, 2010 12:13:54 GMT 1
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Post by RBA on Jun 21, 2010 12:34:57 GMT 1
foxes are pretty brutal animals whether they should be hunted is another matter- I would probably leave the law where it is on the grounds the last parliament wasted much too much time on it Anyway there is no sign the law is effective
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Post by SeanBroseley on Jun 22, 2010 0:02:26 GMT 1
Is it against the law to kill foxes? Are they protected species?
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Post by RBA on Jun 22, 2010 10:04:09 GMT 1
as there is no sign at all that the law is effective why cant we leave it where it is? I know you cant have too many unenforceable laws but the odd one wont do too much harm The Burns report set up by Tony Blair was in my view balanced but sadly ignored here is a BBC reminder of its key points which will upset some on both sides of the arguement news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1873419.stm
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Post by El Presidente on Jun 22, 2010 12:19:30 GMT 1
as there is no sign at all that the law is effective why cant we leave it where it is? I know you cant have too many unenforceable laws but the odd one wont do too much harm The Burns report set up by Tony Blair was in my view balanced but sadly ignored here is a BBC reminder of its key points which will upset some on both sides of the arguement news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/1873419.stmAgain the key point for me was the whole politicisation of this issue...it was undemocratically forced through parliament, simply to meet a Labour Manefesto pledge aimed squarely at securing floating voters for whom this issue was key...where is the integrity in this?! Anyhow, the law is pretty unworkable; there have been prosecutions, but not many, and the fact is every hunt ties up considerable police resourcing to: monitor the hunt monitors; monitor the hunt followers; monitor the hunt itself; and to prevent fights and public order/obstruction offences.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2010 16:02:36 GMT 1
[ Again the key point for me was the whole politicisation of this issue...it was undemocratically forced through parliament, simply to meet a Labour Manefesto pledge aimed squarely at securing floating voters for whom this issue was key...where is the integrity in this?! "simply to meet a labour manefesto pledge" God, imagine that eh. a political party promises to do something in its manifesto, then blow me, they go and do it once elected, how bloody undemocratic is that. Anyhow, the law is pretty unworkable; there have been prosecutions, but not many, and the fact is every hunt ties up considerable police resourcing to: monitor the hunt monitors; monitor the hunt followers; monitor the hunt itself; and to prevent fights and public order/obstruction offences. simple answer then, start charging hunts for policing like many other "sports" have to.
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Post by El Presidente on Jun 22, 2010 17:22:42 GMT 1
[ Again the key point for me was the whole politicisation of this issue...it was undemocratically forced through parliament, simply to meet a Labour Manefesto pledge aimed squarely at securing floating voters for whom this issue was key...where is the integrity in this?! "simply to meet a labour manefesto pledge" God, imagine that eh. a political party promises to do something in its manifesto, then blow me, they go and do it once elected, how bloody undemocratic is that. Anyhow, the law is pretty unworkable; there have been prosecutions, but not many, and the fact is every hunt ties up considerable police resourcing to: monitor the hunt monitors; monitor the hunt followers; monitor the hunt itself; and to prevent fights and public order/obstruction offences. simple answer then, start charging hunts for policing like many other "sports" have to. Pab, you're over simplifying again...! Just because a certain party has a manefesto pledge, which it acts on, does not make it democratic as, not everyone in the country agreed with the manefesto. The measure of a true democracy is tolerance: tolerance of minorities, and tolerance of activities that the majority might not support. Legislation, especially legislation that prohibits an activity of profound cultural importance, should be considered only if it can be proved to remove a demonstrable harm. Despite years of consultation and debate, and a Government Inquiry, there was never any evidence that hunting created that harm. There is, however, considerable evidence that the motivation of many who supported the Act was straightforward prejudice and the settling of old political scores.Tony, if you invoke the Parliament Act it will be the most illiberal act of the last century. Former Labour Home Secretary and mentor to Tony Blair, Roy Jenkins to Blair shortly before Lord Jenkins’ death in January 2003“Now that hunting has been banned, we ought at last to own up to it: the struggle over the Bill was not just about animal welfare and personal freedom, it was class war.” Peter Bradley MP, PPS to Defra Minister Alun Michael, Sunday Telegraph, 21st November 2004.I've more quotes if you're intersted... On the principle of charging a fee hunt monitors should also be levied a fee...but charging a fee does not solve the problem of resources being diverted from core tasks...
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Post by jamo on Jun 22, 2010 18:34:12 GMT 1
The country has debts of £180 billion.......and the subject is ...fox hunting If BLIAR and his cronies hadn't wasted 700 hours debating hunting and instead concentrated on something slightly more important like the national debt, well who knows ? For christ sake can someone puncture that bubble that protects Bishops Castle.
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