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Post by wiganshrew2 on Jan 8, 2004 18:23:43 GMT 1
There's been a lot of talk about class, one way and another. "Shrewsbury's a middle-class town." "Football's a working class game!" "I go to a State School, so I'm working class." Now, the way I see it, the sociologists, poiticians, media-folk- whoever decides what it is that defines "Socio-Economic status" -keeps changing the rules, anyway. So- I'm interested to know- (a)which class would you place yourself? (b) do we live in a classless society with equal opportunities? (c) Does class matter? (d) Is there a "class" of people you really feel you can't get on with, and why? (No Telford jokes, please! ) I'll have to answer it yourself, though, won't I? According to criteria- I'm lower-middle-class by birth, middle class by profession, a working class wife- and qualified but not well-off. So, I don't know!!! No- we don't. Middle-class children get all the advantages. Their parents know which strings to pull, and they're articulate so they're listened to. less than btright middle class children, in general, fare better than bright working class children. I'd love to think it didn't. Because all that really matters is how we relate to others. Unfortunately, in the real world, it does. I really don't like these "all rights and no responsibilies" people- and they're aggressive with it, too! But- it's the system that's made them that way. (They're a nuisance in schools- they don't like rules!) I don't like aggressive braying middle -class people who talk to people as if they're something that they've scraped off their shoes!!! (Occasionally, we meet this type at the Dyslexia Centre- but most parents are really appreciative and supportive.) Posh? Yes- My mother used to insist I said "Shroesbury!" Round here Billinge is considered posh- but we're not posh! Pie-eaters are common.
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RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY
Guest
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Post by RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY on Jan 8, 2004 18:28:15 GMT 1
My wife comes from Preston and she's so posh she gets out of the bath to go to the toilet
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Post by Theoneandonly on Jan 8, 2004 18:35:06 GMT 1
LOL Wiggy. A) Middle. B) Apart from the college milarky yes. C) i don't know ? D) I don't offen get on with "Snobbish people", the way they feel that people less-off are sad unfortuanate persons drives me Crazy! LOUD AND PROUD! THATS ME !!!
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Post by Shady on Jan 8, 2004 18:50:54 GMT 1
My wife comes from Preston and she's so posh she gets out of the bath to go to the toilet No she doesn't!
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Elvito
Shropshire County League
[Mo0:0]
Posts: 46
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Post by Elvito on Jan 8, 2004 19:06:41 GMT 1
a, Upper working class b, No way, richer kids get better educations c, Not to me it doesn't d, Again, snobs who think that they are better than you even you both live on the same street.
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Post by ProfessorPatPending on Jan 8, 2004 21:18:48 GMT 1
I'm working class
To me being working class is all about having a particular set of values and beliefs
I was born working class and i'll die working class
Despite the fact that I now live a very comfortable lifestyle and earn a way above average salary my values and beliefs haven't changed and won't change
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Jan 8, 2004 22:00:01 GMT 1
Sorry Prof, that doesn't work. If your beliefs and values were exactly the same as Lord Montague of Beauleigh would that make him working class?
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Jan 8, 2004 22:02:38 GMT 1
It's very difficult to determine class, so as I'm a helpful bloke I've devised a few questions to help everyone categorise themselves.
1. Working class
- you earn a living from heavy industry - you were brought up as a socialist - you love footy and spend lots of money on your club - you don't wear a tie
Example: Roman Abramovitch
2. Middle class
- you are a professional on above average earnings - you like theatre and art galleries - you occasionally go to football - you are articulate and are therefore considered a poof
Example: Graham Le Saux
3. Upper class
- you are a millionaire who mixes with the rich and famous - you have large houses in more than 1 country - you indulge in country 'sports' - you send you kids to private school - you don't give a toss what people think of you
Example: Vinny Jones
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Post by wiganshrew2 on Jan 8, 2004 22:25:33 GMT 1
What values do you consider to be "working class", Prof? My husband is from a large working class family- mine would be considered lower-middle (white- collar workers - and business..etc..) yet I find that our values are really very similar. We have very similar views and expectations when it came to our childrens' behaviour and how we wanted them to to treat others..etc.. so there wasn't conflict about child-rearing. We both came from families who taught responsibility and good behaviour. The only difference is that my family tended to push for more, educationally. They had more social-climbing tendencies! Possibly, I pushed too much, educationally, too. If I could re-live the days when my daughters were young- I wouldn't do that. One was naturally studious, the other wasn't. What's important is being responsible and treating other people well, not having to live up to a parent's expectations. I'm nothing if not upfront- and if I've made mistakes, I'll admit them, in order that other parents will learn from my mistakes!!!
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Post by SeanBroseley on Jan 8, 2004 22:52:55 GMT 1
I'm a human being but my humanity is being peeled away by the economic system and shocking away form.
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Post by ProfessorPatPending on Jan 8, 2004 23:07:28 GMT 1
Sorry Prof, that doesn't work. If your beliefs and values were exactly the same as Lord Montague of Beauleigh would that make him working class? That's completely unrealistic, I believe people are a product of their environment and upbringing, people from such diverse backgrounds won't end up with the same beliefs and values in my opinion
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Post by ProfessorPatPending on Jan 8, 2004 23:20:40 GMT 1
What values do you consider to be "working class", Prof? Not easy to answer really, at least not very easy to articulate I'd say they're things like recognition of the value of hard work, loyalty to family and community, tolerance and respect, a sense of belonging, a sense of community etc, for some religion also plays a strong part but not for me personally You'll probably come back and tell me they all apply to you too, well I guess the distinction between working class and middle class is quite blurred, probably far more blurred that in previous decades I'm one of those that believes there are really only two classes, working class and the ruling class and that little ever changes if terms of those that hold the real power Anyway, this thread is getting far too serious
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Post by wiganshrew2 on Jan 8, 2004 23:21:52 GMT 1
My mother used to tell a tale about some Shropshire Aristocratic young lady, who went up to London for "the season" as they did in those days. (They dressed up in posh ball-gowns and were presented on show for possible husbands, really.) Anyway- she got a bit drunk and, as a "jolly jape" as they call it when Aristos do naughty things- she "borrowed" a steam-roller and went joy- riding in it, in her ball gown. Everybody thought "Oh! What jolly, jolly fun! What a jolly jape!" (It would be something like joy-riding in a JCB these days I suppose.) Just suppose a lad from a council estate had done the same thing? What would they call it then?
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Post by grinfish on Jan 8, 2004 23:27:49 GMT 1
Woodside Regeneration Project? ;D
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Post by ProfessorPatPending on Jan 8, 2004 23:29:47 GMT 1
My mother used to tell a tale about some Shropshire Aristocratic young lady, who went up to London for "the season" as they did in those days. (They dressed up in posh ball-gowns and were presented on show for possible husbands, really.) Anyway- she got a bit drunk and, as a "jolly jape" as they call it when Aristos do naughty things- she "borrowed" a steam-roller and went joy- riding in it, in her ball gown. Everybody thought "Oh! What jolly, jolly fun! What a jolly jape!" (It would be something like joy-riding in a JCB these days I suppose.) Just suppose a lad from a council estate had done the same thing? What would they call it then? You could be damn sure there would be little equality in terms of the punishment received as a result
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Post by stockportshrew on Jan 9, 2004 0:24:54 GMT 1
Dave your classification scheme is excellent - can I borrow and use it as a discussion point in my seminars
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Jan 9, 2004 0:34:25 GMT 1
I know what you academics are like for plagiarism, I bet you're using it already
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