hankmaloysenior
Midland League Division One
When it's time to party, we will party hard!
Posts: 456
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Post by hankmaloysenior on Feb 1, 2023 11:09:03 GMT 1
Let's face it, town are a small club at this level. No we're not and never have been - we're a middling team at this level - there's a big difference. We've spent 50 of our 70 league years here or the league above. Burton, Fleetwood, Cheltenham, Morecambe, Exeter, Accrington, Forest Green etc are small clubs at this level. Our peers are Oxford, Peterborough, Wycombe (nowadays), Bristol Rovers and Vale. I don't expect us to spend beyond our means or to be challenging at the top every season but equally I'm not going to see avoiding a relegation scrap as a massive achievement. This small club mentality needs to change for us to progress.
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Post by wakemanender on Feb 1, 2023 11:56:07 GMT 1
Good transfer window ending up with all the players who got us into a top ten position and want to play for the club and getting rid of two who did nothing for us and were a big drain on what little money we do have. Phillips a big bonus. There have been a lot of scouts at recent home games so there was always a risk that we could loose someone. Its not always about who you bring in.
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Post by sheltonsalopian on Feb 1, 2023 11:57:01 GMT 1
I think there's a balance to be had. I don't think people were expecting us to splash the cash, but we've got two thirds of our squad out of contract in the summer, and no doubt bigger clubs will be sniffing for most of them.
In my eyes this was the chance to push with the decent squad SC has created, but I can see it being picked apart in the summer and having to go through another rebuild.
It's not often we're upper half of the table at the end of Jan, these opportunities don't come around every season.
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Post by block12massive on Feb 1, 2023 11:57:31 GMT 1
Let's face it, town are a small club at this level. No we're not and never have been - we're a middling team at this level - there's a big difference. We've spent 50 of our 70 league years here or the league above. Burton, Fleetwood, Cheltenham, Morecambe, Exeter, Accrington, Forest Green etc are small clubs at this level. Our peers are Oxford, Peterborough, Wycombe (nowadays), Bristol Rovers and Vale. I don't expect us to spend beyond our means or to be challenging at the top every season but equally I'm not going to see avoiding a relegation scrap as a massive achievement. This small club mentality needs to change for us to progress. Correct. It's becoming a bit of a weird self-fulfilling prophecy that the best we should aim is to merely exist as a club. With the exception of Plymouth who are flying the flag for similar sized clubs like ourselves, the top of the league is well stocked with genuine 'big clubs'. Charlton and Portsmouth are probably the only two that aren't up there. I've always said finishing 8th or 9th represents finishing as 'the best of the rest' and this is a target well within our grasp now.
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Post by Pilch on Feb 1, 2023 12:26:41 GMT 1
Good transfer window ending up with all the players who got us into a top ten position and want to play for the club and getting rid of two who did nothing for us and were a big drain on what little money we do have. Phillips a big bonus. There have been a lot of scouts at recent home games so there was always a risk that we could loose someone. Its not always about who you bring in. and now they can lay the beach towels out and relax until the end of the season , no competition in the squad
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Post by frankwellshrews on Feb 1, 2023 12:28:01 GMT 1
No we're not and never have been - we're a middling team at this level - there's a big difference. We've spent 50 of our 70 league years here or the league above. Burton, Fleetwood, Cheltenham, Morecambe, Exeter, Accrington, Forest Green etc are small clubs at this level. Our peers are Oxford, Peterborough, Wycombe (nowadays), Bristol Rovers and Vale. I don't expect us to spend beyond our means or to be challenging at the top every season but equally I'm not going to see avoiding a relegation scrap as a massive achievement. This small club mentality needs to change for us to progress. Correct. It's becoming a bit of a weird self-fulfilling prophecy that the best we should aim is to merely exist as a club. With the exception of Plymouth who are flying the flag for similar sized clubs like ourselves, the top of the league is well stocked with genuine 'big clubs'. Charlton and Portsmouth are probably the only two that aren't up there. I've always said finishing 8th or 9th represents finishing as 'the best of the rest' and this is a target well within our grasp now. Plymouth is a bigger club than Shrewsbury. They turned over £11m in 21/22 and have had about £8m pumped in by the owner as share capital over 20/21. Higher average gates, bigger ground (not surprising given Plymouth is a city with a population pushing 300k). Comparable to Charlton and Portsmouth but probably on a sounder financial footing. If anything, Plymouth are historical underachievers; it's a one club city of a comparable size to Newcastle, similar working class industrial heritage. All of which proves your point a bit more really; I'd say Barnsley are the only real over achievers in the top 6 at the moment (like their South Yorkshire rivals Rotherham, the Tykes just seem to have a knack for getting out of this division). One thing that strikes me is if you an get into that yo yo club category it does seem to make signing players easier. Wycombe haven't quite cracked it but were still able to sign players like Vokes etc ahead of us.
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Post by frankwellshrews on Feb 1, 2023 12:29:27 GMT 1
Good transfer window ending up with all the players who got us into a top ten position and want to play for the club and getting rid of two who did nothing for us and were a big drain on what little money we do have. Phillips a big bonus. There have been a lot of scouts at recent home games so there was always a risk that we could loose someone. Its not always about who you bring in. and now they can lay the beach towels out and relax until the end of the season , no competition in the squad The scenes at the end of the Forest Green game didn't really look like a group that wasn't trying to push on.
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Post by wakemanender on Feb 1, 2023 12:37:08 GMT 1
Good transfer window ending up with all the players who got us into a top ten position and want to play for the club and getting rid of two who did nothing for us and were a big drain on what little money we do have. Phillips a big bonus. There have been a lot of scouts at recent home games so there was always a risk that we could loose someone. Its not always about who you bring in. and now they can lay the beach towels out and relax until the end of the season , no competition in the squad Lots of competition in the squad. Five subs on Saturday who all made a difference. The manager has difficult decisions to make for future games. No players relax under SC.
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Post by staffordshrew on Feb 1, 2023 12:40:22 GMT 1
and now they can lay the beach towels out and relax until the end of the season , no competition in the squad The scenes at the end of the Forest Green game didn't really look like a group that wasn't trying to push on. Is that just the Pilch sense of humour at work?
Some are loanees trying to build their career. Some are out of contract and hoping for another one, with us or somewhere else. All look to have "gelled" as a team for Steve.
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Post by The Tactician on Feb 1, 2023 12:58:23 GMT 1
back on page 1 of this thread hate to say i told you so 🫣🫣🫣 Yes, a good prediction of not much incoming business but the board hasn’t fulfilled your other point by cashing assets like Pennington and Bayliss, who people thought would attract Championship attention. It’s not all bad, although I must admit I would have liked a LWB to come in, releasing Shipley to play more centrally. The first signs of ambition should start from here - if we can extend the contracts of Pennington, Leahy etc. we have a solid base to build on in the summer. Midfield creativity should be a major priority. We need to unearth at least one Nolan/Chapman/Docherty type player. And to all those bemoaning a lack of ambition, can they point to other examples of mid-table teams which have been transformed into genuine promotion prospects by big spending in January? I’m not talking about sneaking into the playoffs, I mean building a squad good enough to compete in the Championship, because if that isn’t the aim, then why bother with promotion anyway? Having said all that, I expect all those possible contract extensions to be still unresolved or not even offered come May because that’s how RW operates. Aren’t Bayliss & out of position playing Shipley the midfield creators? I don’t think there’s room for another one. I’m also not sure there are many better in this league!
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Post by ssshrew on Feb 1, 2023 13:00:10 GMT 1
Have we actually saved that much money if O’Brien is only out on loan and presumably will return at the end of the season?
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Post by Pilch on Feb 1, 2023 13:19:56 GMT 1
Have we actually saved that much money if O’Brien is only out on loan and presumably will return at the end of the season? who knows , my guess we are paying half of his wages , that could still save us maybe £10k a month with cotterills comments the other day it seems like they wanted him for next to nothing , ball wasn't in our court in this one
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Post by ProudSalopian on Feb 1, 2023 13:21:41 GMT 1
About a month ago I said that our form over christmas had come up at the worst possible time for Roland as we had dropped down the league just as the transfer window had reopened and people would panic. Luckily for Roland the good run of form happened towards the end which meant that he didn't need to panic buy and whilst some fans (including myself) would like to have seen us show some ambition to make a go of challenging for the play-offs, it was never going to happen.
Personally I'd have liked another striker, we have lost our first choice strike pair (Udoh & O'Brien) and whilst Street's performances have picked up, he's not going to get many goals for us
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Post by davycrockett on Feb 1, 2023 13:25:32 GMT 1
Looking back over the last 18 pages of hope, dreams and disappointment I can’t see how anyone’s happy or even fairly content with the transfers window. References back to our current league position only the most optimistic can think we’ll continue to push on and compete towards the top half. Has anyone watched the last few games where we’ve snatched victory against the run of play?
So we’re surprisingly sat in 9th (or 7th =) set up for the remaining 18 games with 15 fit senior outfield players. Not the way I’d plan it, we’ve got money unspent with the manager saying the coffers are bare.
Am I just being pessimistic or do others think we’ll end up in a lower position than currently? 17th maybe?
I hope I’m proved wrong and Oxford makes it 5 in a row or even a draw which would be great.
Wonder if SC and BC are working on the transfer round up yet?
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Post by Rusholme Ruffian on Feb 1, 2023 13:52:32 GMT 1
Let's face it, town are a small club at this level. No we're not and never have been - we're a middling team at this level - there's a big difference. We've spent 50 of our 70 league years here or the league above. Burton, Fleetwood, Cheltenham, Morecambe, Exeter, Accrington, Forest Green etc are small clubs at this level. Our peers are Oxford, Peterborough, Wycombe (nowadays), Bristol Rovers and Vale. I don't expect us to spend beyond our means or to be challenging at the top every season but equally I'm not going to see avoiding a relegation scrap as a massive achievement. This small club mentality needs to change for us to progress. Is that idea not based off 30 years or so ago though? Town haven't been at top of the 3rd division for a very long time (other than one anamalous season). Peterborough, Wycombe et al have been, and budgets will be there accordingly. What is Shrewsburys budget compared to other clubs? Plymouth have had a big bump of investment from an American firm. They haven't magically got to the top of the league on a tiny budget.
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Post by northwestman on Feb 1, 2023 14:04:36 GMT 1
I wouldn't have bracketed Exeter in the 'small clubs' category outlined by hankmaloysenior.
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Post by Feedo Gnasher on Feb 1, 2023 14:04:37 GMT 1
It seems like nearly everyone falls into one of two groups - those who think failure to splash the cash in this window is a chronic lack of ambition and those who think we should just be grateful to be in the league and competing with giants of the game such as Burton and Forest Green. The reality is somewhere in the middle, we’re in a good place, would’ve been nice to add some extra genuine quality (on top of Phillips), but the budget is what it is and we should be building from a relatively solid position in the summer.
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Post by vladimir on Feb 1, 2023 14:14:55 GMT 1
I think there's a balance to be had. I don't think people were expecting us to splash the cash, but we've got two thirds of our squad out of contract in the summer, and no doubt bigger clubs will be sniffing for most of them. In my eyes this was the chance to push with the decent squad SC has created, but I can see it being picked apart in the summer and having to go through another rebuild. It's not often we're upper half of the table at the end of Jan, these opportunities don't come around every season. Precisely this, and a failure to keep this squad together and seeing the better players picked off (again) in the summer and I can see a real discontent sweep into the fan base. The club need to get these core players signed on now, not p**s about with agents and the usual whinging come May. Other clubs manage to keep the bulk of their squads together, (looking at Wycombe here), it would be nice to see us do the same.
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Post by Pilch on Feb 1, 2023 14:16:48 GMT 1
The scenes at the end of the Forest Green game didn't really look like a group that wasn't trying to push on. Is that just the Pilch sense of humour at work?
Some are loanees trying to build their career. Some are out of contract and hoping for another one, with us or somewhere else. All look to have "gelled" as a team for Steve.
we'll our board seem to be on the beach already
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Post by South Stand Salopian on Feb 1, 2023 14:54:53 GMT 1
Don’t forget we can still sign free agents so maybe we’re not quite confined to the players we’ve got, without expecting anything.
I note Connor Wickham still hasn’t got a club - when he was released I thought he perhaps had something lined up. Wishful thinking though I guess.
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Post by frankwellshrews on Feb 1, 2023 16:24:26 GMT 1
Don’t forget we can still sign free agents so maybe we’re not quite confined to the players we’ve got, without expecting anything. I note Connor Wickham still hasn’t got a club - when he was released I thought he perhaps had something lined up. Wishful thinking though I guess. He's been released by the bottom club in the division who doubtlessly could afford his wages if they wanted. Maybe there's a reason we're not dashing to offer him a contract.
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Feb 1, 2023 16:46:11 GMT 1
Is it just me or do others think that in a few weeks time, when we will hopefully be over the 50 point mark that our squad will be boosted in numbers at least by SC blooding several of the youngsters who have filled the bench during the autumn.
Surely it will give maybe 10 games or so to let them show us what they can do without too much pressure on them. One or two get a run of a few games them try a few more. At least I'd hope he will do.
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Post by Worthingshrew on Feb 1, 2023 17:05:22 GMT 1
Is that just the Pilch sense of humour at work?
Some are loanees trying to build their career. Some are out of contract and hoping for another one, with us or somewhere else. All look to have "gelled" as a team for Steve.
we'll our board seem to be on the beach already With the size of the club’s Board, they could fit on one beach towel couldn’t they?
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Post by martinshrew on Feb 2, 2023 0:21:06 GMT 1
Nobody is expecting us to go and blow £1m on a player. I said top half would be progress, we're on for it, I think keeping our best players is key now.
Give SC another couple of years and get Pennington and the like tied down if we can. Finish 7th-12th and they'll be plenty wanting to sign for us next year.
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Post by DiglisShrew on Feb 2, 2023 0:25:03 GMT 1
Is it just me or do others think that in a few weeks time, when we will hopefully be over the 50 point mark that our squad will be boosted in numbers at least by SC blooding several of the youngsters who have filled the bench during the autumn. Surely it will give maybe 10 games or so to let them show us what they can do without too much pressure on them. One or two get a run of a few games them try a few more. At least I'd hope he will do. So have you written off the play offs I haven’t!!
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Post by Rusholme Ruffian on Feb 2, 2023 8:47:53 GMT 1
Is it just me or do others think that in a few weeks time, when we will hopefully be over the 50 point mark that our squad will be boosted in numbers at least by SC blooding several of the youngsters who have filled the bench during the autumn. Surely it will give maybe 10 games or so to let them show us what they can do without too much pressure on them. One or two get a run of a few games them try a few more. At least I'd hope he will do. Has SC shown at any point he has any faith in them? Not sure I can see him playing youth unless he absolutely has to
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Feb 2, 2023 9:20:53 GMT 1
It seems like nearly everyone falls into one of two groups - those who think failure to splash the cash in this window is a chronic lack of ambition and those who think we should just be grateful to be in the league and competing with giants of the game such as Burton and Forest Green. I think for a good few its about being grateful for being in the league and not the next Telford, Chester, Wrexham or Hereford. I do think the experiences of our near neighbours has played a part in the expectations of a fair few Town fans. So it'll be interesting to see what happens (well, for me anyhow) when one of those gets their act together and starts to see some success...as we know that's just around the corner for at least one of them. Now granted the situation at Wrexham is different in that we don't some Hollywood A lister financing things but even so, once we see them drawing level and perhaps moving ahead I think we might see a change in attitude. If only in those who are asking why we can't push on getting a little louder and looking to put more pressure on the club to do so. I think some healthy local opposition might focus minds a little and see Town fans starting to demand more from the club. Maybe. Just throwing that out there. Time will tell.
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Feb 2, 2023 15:48:18 GMT 1
Is it just me or do others think that in a few weeks time, when we will hopefully be over the 50 point mark that our squad will be boosted in numbers at least by SC blooding several of the youngsters who have filled the bench during the autumn. Surely it will give maybe 10 games or so to let them show us what they can do without too much pressure on them. One or two get a run of a few games them try a few more. At least I'd hope he will do. So have you written off the play offs I haven’t!! I havnt written them off totally but they may well be out of reach by the time we get to 50 points. We have beaten 4 of the poorest teams in the division, 2 of those without looking very good for the majority of the games. We are still an inconsistent team as I'm sure games against clubs around us will show. I'm guessing we will have little to play for from early March through to early May.
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Feb 2, 2023 15:51:01 GMT 1
Is it just me or do others think that in a few weeks time, when we will hopefully be over the 50 point mark that our squad will be boosted in numbers at least by SC blooding several of the youngsters who have filled the bench during the autumn. Surely it will give maybe 10 games or so to let them show us what they can do without too much pressure on them. One or two get a run of a few games them try a few more. At least I'd hope he will do. Has SC shown at any point he has any faith in them? Not sure I can see him playing youth unless he absolutely has to Why have them if they arent given a try out once we get to a safe position in the league, especially if the play offs are out of reach too. If we cant give them a run out in those circumstances we may as well save yourself the expense of running that area of the club.
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Post by gainsparkshrew on Feb 2, 2023 17:07:43 GMT 1
Has SC shown at any point he has any faith in them? Not sure I can see him playing youth unless he absolutely has to Why have them if they arent given a try out once we get to a safe position in the league, especially if the play offs are out of reach too. If we cant give them a run out in those circumstances we may as well save yourself the expense of running that area of the club. Grizzlys last paragraph is the heart of the matter. Back in the 70s and 80s we used to pride ourself in producing our own or taking players from non-league and actually turning them into what is now Championship level players. EG Colin Robinson went from Boldmere St Michaels(who?)to our first team.Almost unbelievable these days We have a large academy structure yet very few make it to the first team.Gwynnedshrew and I do go on about this regularly,there's something wrong within our structure that players aren't coming through
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