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Post by Nath on Sept 3, 2014 21:08:34 GMT 1
IS is pretty scary. A movement with so much hatred towards the West and towards people who are not willing to convert. The mass executions that they boast and show to the world are frightening and even more so with the beheading of two journalists.
How to deal with them... Can you fight an ideology/philosophy? Is it possible to tackle something that is not physical?
I think we're in an even weaker position to do something about this due to our previous 'commitments' in the Middle East with the US. We can't tackle them with ground troops because committing forces on the ground is simply a no go there. Drones are the only viable option at the minute but I am 100% against the use of these as they create so much more hatred and civilian deaths are far too high because of them for my liking. Drone pilots have been found to suffer with psychological problems afterwards also.
If only diplomacy was an option here... We find ourselves in a position where there is no talking to the opposition and there is no committed war with the opposition.
I do find it very worrying that we're finding increasing numbers joining from the UK. That is chilling.
As for Fox News, I would stay well away from it. In short, it is woeful!
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Post by SeanBroseley on Sept 3, 2014 23:40:31 GMT 1
Saudi Arabia's involvement in funding the Islamic Front is interesting - it seems to be fighting the IS, Free Syrian Army, Assad and perhaps anything in Syria that breathes and walks.
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Post by SeanBroseley on Sept 3, 2014 23:41:31 GMT 1
Did cameron really say that? The V2 was more of a threat than ISIS. Not got much to offer on this thread apart from that. I've just finished Soldaten, the German academic book on the POW tapes from WW2. An incredible and deeply uncomfortable read, but also backed up with great stuff that challenges assumptions we have about Japanese soldiers being prepared to die, German Wehrmacht being ideologically driven, etc etc. Helped me advance my thinking on some of this stuff. Ever tried Forgotten Soldier?
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Post by neilsalop on Sept 4, 2014 8:36:48 GMT 1
IS is pretty scary. A movement with so much hatred towards the West and towards people who are not willing to convert. The mass executions that they boast and show to the world are frightening and even more so with the beheading of two journalists. How to deal with them... Can you fight an ideology/philosophy? Is it possible to tackle something that is not physical? I think we're in an even weaker position to do something about this due to our previous 'commitments' in the Middle East with the US. We can't tackle them with ground troops because committing forces on the ground is simply a no go there. Drones are the only viable option at the minute but I am 100% against the use of these as they create so much more hatred and civilian deaths are far too high because of them for my liking. Drone pilots have been found to suffer with psychological problems afterwards also. If only diplomacy was an option here... We find ourselves in a position where there is no talking to the opposition and there is no committed war with the opposition. I do find it very worrying that we're finding increasing numbers joining from the UK. That is chilling. As for Fox News, I would stay well away from it. In short, it is woeful! This is so true. This level of terrorism/ extremism know no boundaries, they don't care about targets, because everyone else is a target; they don't care about anyone elses' views, because theirs is the only view; they don't want negotiation, they want complete compliance. Even back in the dark days of the IRA there was Sinn Fein trying to take the political road, this lot don't want a political road. Also they don't have boundaries, because they don't recognise them, they won't be happy until the Islamic State is the whole of humanity and don't care if they have to kill half of it to get the rest to toe the line. Back in the old days war was fought between two opposing armies with different uniforms, so you knew who you were fighting, these days it could be the guy from the paper shop, your next door neighbour, the woman on the train reading a book, the guy in front of you in the queue at Tesco. Scary indeed.
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Post by QuorndonShrew on Sept 4, 2014 12:20:31 GMT 1
Pathetic joke about Palestine? Sorry, what? Or is this just another example of you taking offence on behalf of a nationality/race of people you don't belong to when there was nothing to be offended about in the first place? Unless of course you are a mixed race Luton supporting Palestinian, in which case I apologise for your lack of sense of humour. Now I wonder who posted this: "Oh but dose poor kids in Palestine dough... *shakes fist*" Oh, it was you, remember now? Anyone else out there find that remotely funny? You know, jokes about kids being killed and maimed? Maybe it's just you LSF. Let's hope so. Had you forgotten? Or wasn't it meant to be a joke? Perhaps you were making a serious point there, it's hard to tell with you sometimes; everything just tends to merge into a nonsensical mush that even you struggle to make sense of afterwards. And I didn't realise you had to belong to a particular group before you could find something offensive. Well if that's the case, feel free to joke about rape (I'm not a woman), disability (I'm not disabled), paedophilia (I'm not a child), anti-semitism (I'm not Jewish) - blimey, the field's wide open for you. I don't doubt that you have many things to apologise for but you needn't apologise for my supposed lack of sense of humour. I'd worry about your own first. The 'joke' was clearly completely lost on you. No real surprise that though is it?
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Post by QuorndonShrew on Sept 4, 2014 13:26:36 GMT 1
We need to support Assad in smoking out the terrorists making their way across the non-existent border with Iraq.
The UN needs to take control of the border and suffocate ISIS with a series of air strikes on known terror targets and continue the distribution of arms and aid to the Kurdish region of the country.
The only hesitance in supporting Assad are his links to Russia, but Assad is a teddy bear compared to some of the Arab dictators we've armed in the past.
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Post by venceremos on Sept 4, 2014 13:30:43 GMT 1
Now I wonder who posted this: "Oh but dose poor kids in Palestine dough... *shakes fist*" Oh, it was you, remember now? Anyone else out there find that remotely funny? You know, jokes about kids being killed and maimed? Maybe it's just you LSF. Let's hope so. Had you forgotten? Or wasn't it meant to be a joke? Perhaps you were making a serious point there, it's hard to tell with you sometimes; everything just tends to merge into a nonsensical mush that even you struggle to make sense of afterwards. And I didn't realise you had to belong to a particular group before you could find something offensive. Well if that's the case, feel free to joke about rape (I'm not a woman), disability (I'm not disabled), paedophilia (I'm not a child), anti-semitism (I'm not Jewish) - blimey, the field's wide open for you. I don't doubt that you have many things to apologise for but you needn't apologise for my supposed lack of sense of humour. I'd worry about your own first. The 'joke' was clearly completely lost on you. No real surprise that though is it? Thankfully no. Tasteless "jokes" about the current suffering of children, Palestinian or otherwise, leave me cold. Don't try any open mic nights with that material. Bit risky. On second thoughts ...
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Post by QuorndonShrew on Sept 4, 2014 13:35:37 GMT 1
The 'joke' was clearly completely lost on you. No real surprise that though is it? Thankfully no. Tasteless "jokes" about the current suffering of children, Palestinian or otherwise, leave me cold. Don't try any open mic nights with that material. Bit risky. On second thoughts ... You've kind of just adhered to the original point I was trying to make hook line and sinker Good to know that all the genocide and suffering in the rest of the world is relegated to simply 'or otherwise'. I suppose you're a bit less of an expert in those areas.
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Post by venceremos on Sept 4, 2014 13:46:53 GMT 1
IS is pretty scary. A movement with so much hatred towards the West and towards people who are not willing to convert. The mass executions that they boast and show to the world are frightening and even more so with the beheading of two journalists. How to deal with them... Can you fight an ideology/philosophy? Is it possible to tackle something that is not physical? I think we're in an even weaker position to do something about this due to our previous 'commitments' in the Middle East with the US. We can't tackle them with ground troops because committing forces on the ground is simply a no go there. Drones are the only viable option at the minute but I am 100% against the use of these as they create so much more hatred and civilian deaths are far too high because of them for my liking. Drone pilots have been found to suffer with psychological problems afterwards also. If only diplomacy was an option here... We find ourselves in a position where there is no talking to the opposition and there is no committed war with the opposition. I do find it very worrying that we're finding increasing numbers joining from the UK. That is chilling. As for Fox News, I would stay well away from it. In short, it is woeful! This is so true. This level of terrorism/ extremism know no boundaries, they don't care about targets, because everyone else is a target; they don't care about anyone elses' views, because theirs is the only view; they don't want negotiation, they want complete compliance. Even back in the dark days of the IRA there was Sinn Fein trying to take the political road, this lot don't want a political road. Also they don't have boundaries, because they don't recognise them, they won't be happy until the Islamic State is the whole of humanity and don't care if they have to kill half of it to get the rest to toe the line. Back in the old days war was fought between two opposing armies with different uniforms, so you knew who you were fighting, these days it could be the guy from the paper shop, your next door neighbour, the woman on the train reading a book, the guy in front of you in the queue at Tesco. Scary indeed. The fearful reaction to the barbarity of IS is understandable - and exactly what they intend when they carry out such acts. However, it still presents a largely regional threat, not a global one. It's estimated that IS is 10,000 strong - not very big. Its activities have been restricted to Syria and Iraq. It presents a terrorist threat in Europe and elsewhere but its scope for carrying out attacks must be questionable. It will not take over the world, or even any significant parts of the Middle East. If we get into a mindset of thinking that anyone of vaguely Muslim appearance in a corner shop or on a bus might be our enemy, then we'll be handing a huge propaganda victory to IS on a plate.
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Post by venceremos on Sept 4, 2014 13:58:21 GMT 1
Thankfully no. Tasteless "jokes" about the current suffering of children, Palestinian or otherwise, leave me cold. Don't try any open mic nights with that material. Bit risky. On second thoughts ... You've kind of just adhered to the original point I was trying to make hook line and sinker Good to know that all the genocide and suffering in the rest of the world is relegated to simply 'or otherwise'. I suppose you're a bit less of an expert in those areas. Oh really, I missed the subtlety of your satirical barbs eh? Well please feel free to enlighten me and any other dunderheads as to your "original point". Can't wait to hear it. You made a sick joke - or do you still think it was funny? I called you out and now you're trying to worm out of it by accusing me of dismissing other suffering. On what grounds? Because I didn't make a long list of all the suffering everywhere. How callous of me. I'll say one thing for you. You never fail to surprise with the new depths of ludicrousness you manage to reach.
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