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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2015 9:51:56 GMT 1
Nice to know Gerrard still does what he does best. Causing disharmony in squads by giving his own players abuse. Wonderful team ethic, and just what you need in a relegation fight... Gerrard giving Lootwiler a bollocking for not moving off his line to catch a ball is long, long, long overdue. Well Done Mr Gerrard  |
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Post by capitalsalopian on Dec 2, 2015 10:12:00 GMT 1
A few things worried me tonight. As has been said, the Black sending off was inevitable after his first booking, anyone with any football nous could see it coming miles away. Gerrard having a right good go at Lieutwiler looked bad, no harmony there. Then we have Grandison doing his best, he had a good first half, but absolutely knackered second half as was almost begging to be subbed. Then we have the minor set to between the Goal-keeping coach and Jackson, plus Mellons demeanour at the end of the match. Alls NOT well at Wycherley Towers. In all fairness if I was a centre back and a corner/free kick/cross was dropping inside the 6 yard box I would be asking my keeper to clear everyone out including me if I was in the way. He was right to tell him in my opinion and it also led to the goal from the corner. Another ball into a 6 yard box that the keeper didn't deal with. I'm not asking him to catch it just deal with it, tip it over, punch it, whatever - just don't watch it go onto the head of the attacker and into the back of the net. However maybe if it was Collins on the end of it he would have probably missed from within 3 yards again!!!! |
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Post by thesensationaljt on Dec 2, 2015 10:34:26 GMT 1
At 2 - 0, we would have had them rocking. Black is a calamity waiting to happen. Why do you think he struggled to get a club. Not taking him off was a shocking error from Mickey. I didn't see him getting the red card, for the red mist surrounding him.
Dear Mr Mellon, I'll say this slowly......Grandison...is...NOT....a....right....back. He doesn't even think so himself.
I know it's panto time, and I have to say I'm feeling grumpy today. |
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Post by Minormorris64 on Dec 2, 2015 10:40:22 GMT 1
At 2 - 0, we would have had them rocking. Black is a calamity waiting to happen. Why do you think he struggled to get a club. Not taking him off was a shocking error from Mickey. I didn't see him getting the red card, for the red mist surrounding him.
Dear Mr Mellon, I'll say this slowly......Grandison...is...NOT....a....right....back. He doesn't even think so himself.
I know it's panto time, and I have to say I'm feeling grumpy today. He's behind you........................... |
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crowshrew
Midland League Division Two
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Post by crowshrew on Dec 2, 2015 10:40:24 GMT 1
In rugby, the management don't stand on the touch line, where their view of the game is limited, but high up, where they can see what's going on, and they use technology to quickly asses problems.
Why doesn't at least one of our management team sit in the stand. They might've seen how knackered Grandison was from a better view.
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Post by victorsboots on Dec 2, 2015 10:54:48 GMT 1
Smith should be our right back.
Tootle seems to have been cast aside
Patterson is never going to make it.
Ogogo played right back at d&r
All that and we haven't mentioned our other full back area.
Also if I were an opposing manager I'd have every corner swung in to land about 6 yards out so as to head a goal past the keeper standing on his goal line.
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Post by callum on Dec 2, 2015 11:34:04 GMT 1
Pity we can't get Oggy in to coach Leutwiler,he came for everything, and normally got it.
What is wrong with Grandison? Surely he shouldn't be this unfit, to the point he's asking to be taken off.
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Post by venceremos on Dec 2, 2015 13:23:37 GMT 1
B&A seemed a bit over-emotional last night so I decided to steer clear and hope it calmed down. Not sure it has. For what it's worth, I'll have my say. Black was our best player until he was sent off. Yes he was playing on the edge but that's part of his game and our results seem better when he plays. Once in a while it might backfire but I wouldn't have subbed him last night. I would have subbed Grandison though, he seemed injured and clearly couldn't get back for their 3rd goal, though it was academic by then. Don't understand the poster berating him for not trying, he was hobbling around for the last few minutes. Gerrard bawling out Leutwiler is nothing. Team spirit isn't all about pre-match hugs and fist bumping after every clearance. Sometimes players will fall out. I hope someone called out Gerrard for his cr@ppy long balls over the goal line. Leutwiler's our best keeper in years and still improving. He can make his own decisions when to come for a ball and when to stay. Like all keepers he'll get some wrong but he's usually right. Who let Downing have a free run for a header? Why didn't anybody even block him off? The team's defending was abysmal at the corner (and the one after with the near post flicked header). Leutwiler can't cover the whole 6 yard box on his own. At the moment, we aspire to being an average League 1 side and, for 70 minutes, we held our own against an above average League 1 side, as we did against Gillingham. Until the sending off, I thought the game was heading for 1-1, as both teams were visibly tiring. Had Walsall played like Bury and lumped balls into the box we'd have had a fair chance of holding out. But their passing and movement exploited the extra man advantage well. But I thought we played pretty well overall and feel more confident about staying up than I did a couple of weeks ago. Sawyers looks to be their best player by far. Be surprised if he's there much longer. Can't resist mentioning that I said he looked a good player when he was with us, though the consensus on here was that he was no good!
Walsall fans made a good noise although at least half of it was directed against us, which was dreary and unimaginative. That said, it never fails to amuse to hear Walsall fans singing "Shrewsbury's a ****hole, I wanna go home." Their use of irony is always excellent. It also means I'm glad the M54 was closed, hope they had difficult journeys home and don't get promoted!
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Post by saddler1975 on Dec 2, 2015 13:50:29 GMT 1
B&A seemed a bit over-emotional last night so I decided to steer clear and hope it calmed down. Not sure it has. For what it's worth, I'll have my say. Black was our best player until he was sent off. Yes he was playing on the edge but that's part of his game and our results seem better when he plays. Once in a while it might backfire but I wouldn't have subbed him last night. I would have subbed Grandison though, he seemed injured and clearly couldn't get back for their 3rd goal, though it was academic by then. Don't understand the poster berating him for not trying, he was hobbling around for the last few minutes. Gerrard bawling out Leutwiler is nothing. Team spirit isn't all about pre-match hugs and fist bumping after every clearance. Sometimes players will fall out. I hope someone called out Gerrard for his cr@ppy long balls over the goal line. Leutwiler's our best keeper in years and still improving. He can make his own decisions when to come for a ball and when to stay. Like all keepers he'll get some wrong but he's usually right. Who let Downing have a free run for a header? Why didn't anybody even block him off? The team's defending was abysmal at the corner (and the one after with the near post flicked header). Leutwiler can't cover the whole 6 yard box on his own. At the moment, we aspire to being an average League 1 side and, for 70 minutes, we held our own against an above average League 1 side, as we did against Gillingham. Until the sending off, I thought the game was heading for 1-1, as both teams were visibly tiring. Had Walsall played like Bury and lumped balls into the box we'd have had a fair chance of holding out. But their passing and movement exploited the extra man advantage well. But I thought we played pretty well overall and feel more confident about staying up than I did a couple of weeks ago. Sawyers looks to be their best player by far. Be surprised if he's there much longer. Can't resist mentioning that I said he looked a good player when he was with us, though the consensus on here was that he was no good!
Walsall fans made a good noise although at least half of it was directed against us, which was dreary and unimaginative. That said, it never fails to amuse to hear Walsall fans singing "Shrewsbury's a ****hole, I wanna go home." Their use of irony is always excellent. It also means I'm glad the M54 was closed, hope they had difficult journeys home and don't get promoted!
M54 was not closed just the junction leading to the A5, got back home for 11.15 after drop offs.
Regarding the game itself, we were always the better side without creating too many clear cut chances until after the sending off. Congrats to the defender who did a job on Bradshaw luckily its only a cut ankle and hopefully should be back for Saturday. The key moment in the game was obviously Collins inexcusable miss from 5 yards, we had let our heads drop after the 1 st goal and that miss seemed to spur us on.
Sawyers and Henry are a different class.
Such a silly sending off, acting like a petulant child throwing his ball back and then berating the ref when he gets booked, do footballers not know the rules? And then rightfully getting a second yellow for a studs up challenge.
I told you when Gerrard joined he's a bad apple and we saw that again yesterday, teams who are struggling do not need this they need player to encourage each other, Gerrard did this afew times when we had Clayton Ince in goal and many of us wanted Ince to deck the Bellend, also he looks so fat.
You easily have more than enough to stay up and I certainly do not mean that in a patronising way. I hope and want you to stay up.
A special mention to the adults/parents (both set of supporters) who put their arms basically saying 'come over here' while stood behind police men and stewards, you really are special. Embarrassing songs by embarrassing fans, and an embarrassing blow up sheep by someone who should not be allowed in the community.
A fantastic show of unity and togetherness by the Walsall players, staff and fans at the end.
p.s The Balti Pie was awful
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2015 13:56:57 GMT 1
ok, lots of discussion points about last night.
If i was MM, at half time my talk would have consisted of more of the same please, apart from Collins who would have had a discussion about missing an OG from 6 yards, but overall the half was pleasing, however not sure if the wind got up in the second half but my god we struggled for the next 45.
We spent about a total of 5 - 7 mins in opposition half, and insisted on hitting high balls into the wind, which was blowing the ball back, when we tried to play the ball on the ground, we were closed down and rushed into passing. make no bones about it, Walsall were good, they were very good. The officials were giving most 50/50 challenges against us, infact they appeared to give most 60/40 decisions against us. We cannot use that as an excuse, Blacks first Yellow will probably be down as dissent, and was plain stupid, you cannot through the ball back in that fashion, was pure petulance. after that he was a red card lunging... every person to a man boy and woman around me stated that he was going to be off within 10 minutes, either subbed or sent off.
The only people who obviously could not see it was our management team, although he was the best player by a mile in Blue & Amber, we would have stood a better chance of holding of for a point if we had 11 on the pitch.
So what is the issue, I expected to get nothing from this game, and duly got that, so cannot complain, expected us to put in a spirited performance, and we got that so cannot complain, maybe we learnt a lot out of the vision on MM and MJ so that is a positive. Next Game please and hope for a healthy points return after we play the POSH
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2015 14:02:18 GMT 1
M54 was not closed just the junction leading to the A5, got back home for 11.15 after drop offs.
Regarding the game itself, we were always the better side without creating too many clear cut chances until after the sending off. Congrats to the defender who did a job on Bradshaw luckily its only a cut ankle and hopefully should be back for Saturday. The key moment in the game was obviously Collins inexcusable miss from 5 yards, we had let our heads drop after the 1 st goal and that miss seemed to spur us on.
Sawyers and Henry are a different class.
Such a silly sending off, acting like a petulant child throwing his ball back and then berating the ref when he gets booked, do footballers not know the rules? And then rightfully getting a second yellow for a studs up challenge.
I told you when Gerrard joined he's a bad apple and we saw that again yesterday, teams who are struggling do not need this they need player to encourage each other, Gerrard did this afew times when we had Clayton Ince in goal and many of us wanted Ince to deck the Bellend, also he looks so fat.
You easily have more than enough to stay up and I certainly do not mean that in a patronising way. I hope and want you to stay up.
A special mention to the grown adults/parents (both set of supporters) who put their arms basically saying 'come over here' while stood behind police men and stewards, you really are special. Embarrassing songs by embarrassing fans, and an embarrassing blow up sheep by someone who should not be allowed in the community.
A fantastic show of unity and togetherness by the Walsall players, staff and fans at the end.
p.s The Balti Pie was awful
How many did you have thrown out for scrapping among each other at Half time, think i counted 3 in the one incident, but what about the other 2? Most of the fans i spoke to were ODF's (ordinary decent fans). |
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Post by saddler1975 on Dec 2, 2015 14:08:46 GMT 1
M54 was not closed just the junction leading to the A5, got back home for 11.15 after drop offs.
Regarding the game itself, we were always the better side without creating too many clear cut chances until after the sending off. Congrats to the defender who did a job on Bradshaw luckily its only a cut ankle and hopefully should be back for Saturday. The key moment in the game was obviously Collins inexcusable miss from 5 yards, we had let our heads drop after the 1 st goal and that miss seemed to spur us on.
Sawyers and Henry are a different class.
Such a silly sending off, acting like a petulant child throwing his ball back and then berating the ref when he gets booked, do footballers not know the rules? And then rightfully getting a second yellow for a studs up challenge.
I told you when Gerrard joined he's a bad apple and we saw that again yesterday, teams who are struggling do not need this they need player to encourage each other, Gerrard did this afew times when we had Clayton Ince in goal and many of us wanted Ince to deck the Bellend, also he looks so fat.
You easily have more than enough to stay up and I certainly do not mean that in a patronising way. I hope and want you to stay up.
A special mention to the grown adults/parents (both set of supporters) who put their arms basically saying 'come over here' while stood behind police men and stewards, you really are special. Embarrassing songs by embarrassing fans, and an embarrassing blow up sheep by someone who should not be allowed in the community.
A fantastic show of unity and togetherness by the Walsall players, staff and fans at the end.
p.s The Balti Pie was awful
How many did you have thrown out for scr@pping among each other at Half time, think i counted 3 in the one incident, but what about the other 2? Most of the fans i spoke to were ODF's (ordinary decent fans).
I saw one chav thrown out at H/T but luckily I was towards the other end and seemingly in the grown up block
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Post by Deleted on Dec 2, 2015 15:18:36 GMT 1
ok, lots of discussion points about last night. If i was MM, at half time my talk would have consisted of more of the same please, apart from Collins who would have had a discussion about missing an OG from 6 yards, but overall the half was pleasing, however not sure if the wind got up in the second half but my god we struggled for the next 45. We spent about a total of 5 - 7 mins in opposition half, and insisted on hitting high balls into the wind, which was blowing the ball back, when we tried to play the ball on the ground, we were closed down and rushed into passing. make no bones about it, Walsall were good, they were very good. The officials were giving most 50/50 challenges against us, infact they appeared to give most 60/40 decisions against us. We cannot use that as an excuse, Blacks first Yellow will probably be down as dissent, and was plain stupid, you cannot through the ball back in that fashion, was pure petulance. after that he was a red card lunging... every person to a man boy and woman around me stated that he was going to be off within 10 minutes, either subbed or sent off. The only people who obviously could not see it was our management team, although he was the best player by a mile in Blue & Amber, we would have stood a better chance of holding of for a point if we had 11 on the pitch. So what is the issue, I expected to get nothing from this game, and duly got that, so cannot complain, expected us to put in a spirited performance, and we got that so cannot complain, maybe we learnt a lot out of the vision on MM and MJ so that is a positive. Next Game please and hope for a healthy points return after we play the POSH Excellent post IMO , particularly the last para.which succinctly sums it up . Our season isn't going to be determined by losing at home to Walsall . They played well and we did our best . If Collins had shown more composure instead of trying to smash the ball into the net and if Black had shown more composure perhaps he wouldn't have been sent off , then we just may have got something out of this game . But , as they say , if your Auntie had balls she'd be your Uncle . |
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Post by callum on Dec 2, 2015 18:38:14 GMT 1
What happened in the west stand at full time? Saw a lot of stewards running about half way down the length of the stand.
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Post by northwestman on Dec 2, 2015 20:56:21 GMT 1
For some reason the Collins miss isn't on the highlights.
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pkd
Midland League Division One
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Post by pkd on Dec 2, 2015 21:02:36 GMT 1
Smith should be our right back. Tootle seems to have been cast aside Patterson is never going to make it. Ogogo played right back at d&r All that and we haven't mentioned our other full back area. Also if I were an opposing manager I'd have every corner swung in to land about 6 yards out so as to head a goal past the keeper standing on his goal line. Now let's see. Smith is a young & promising centre back who has played precisely one senior game at right back against the might of, erm, Gainsborough Trinity. In that game he ventured into the opposition half for about one nano second, and most of the time was content to hang back with the centre halves, thereby giving us 3 players to attend to Trinity's rather underwhelming sole striker. Which, in turn, deprived us of an attacking threat up the right flank. So do we really want him as our right back? I would love to be proved wrong, but I think we have more experienced and better (ie less bad) options. |
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Post by venceremos on Dec 2, 2015 21:27:53 GMT 1
That's harsh pkd. Inexperience doesn't make Smith a bad option and he may develop into a fine right back.
I don't agree with the right back crisis theory. Tootle could return and do well (he's not been out as long as Vernon), Patterson could make it (why do some insist on writing off youngsters before they get a chance?), Smith or a fully fit Grandison could do well there.
We're not looking for a Gary Neville, just someone to tighten it up on the right and get forward sometimes. We've enough options to work with already.
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pkd
Midland League Division One
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Post by pkd on Dec 2, 2015 22:52:43 GMT 1
My beef isn't with Smith. I've been impressed with him. At centre back.
What I can't understand is that some B&A contributors seem to think he's our answer at right back when he was barely adequate there at Gainsborough, and we have 4 other players who have far more experience in that position. And, btw, I agree with you in your comments about them.
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Post by jimmelrosesjaw on Dec 2, 2015 23:45:29 GMT 1
What happened in the west stand at full time? Saw a lot of stewards running about half way down the length of the stand. Somebody dropped a quid! |
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Post by mattmw on Dec 3, 2015 0:20:55 GMT 1
The dropping of Tootle was a bit odd.
Amongst others I was very critical of him in a number of games this season but in the 5-6 games before he was dropped he was looking fitter and putting in steady performances
I do really like Grandison and he's given us some great performances, but something is clearly up with him physically, he just can't get through 70 minutes never mind 90 at the moment. That really needs sorting out
Any chance of getting Grimmer back on loan or is he still injured?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2015 1:11:24 GMT 1
Obviously something seriously not right with Grandison. Seems to be struggling with his hip . Starts off o.k. but after about 70 mins he' s finished .
Makes you wonder what happened during the Summer .
His agent was trying to get him a move but , if I remember there wasn't a lot of activity was there. I think the word has got around that he is crocked and cannot last a full season never mind a full 90 mins.
He certainly is not the player we know .
Hope the problem can be sorted out , if not I think he will be on his way .
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Post by shrewinjapan on Dec 3, 2015 5:28:04 GMT 1
I think the word has got around that he is crocked and cannot last a full season never mind a full 90 mins. Think you got that the wrong way round, but that shouldn't surprise anyone since you clearly don't know your arse from your elbow. |
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Post by camdenshrew on Dec 3, 2015 7:17:18 GMT 1
For some reason the Collins miss isn't on the highlights. It's like North Korea. They won't be showing opposition goals next. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2015 10:06:40 GMT 1
I think the word has got around that he is crocked and cannot last a full season never mind a full 90 mins. Think you got that the wrong way round, but that shouldn't surprise anyone since you clearly don't know your arse from your elbow. Nice to hear from you owd Oriental One . Unfortunately I think you are right on both counts but don't worry , it will not prevent me from posting my usual . The thought of my words of wisdom ? winding you up gives me great pleasure . |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2015 21:26:17 GMT 1
In recent years, Walsall games have always been a bit of a watershed in fans' assessment of where we are. Whilst the mismanagement of other local rivals has seen them disappear out of sight, Walsall remain as a team we still compare ourselves to. Despite the glory of knocking them out of the cup last season, they've got the better of us far too many times in recent years. Tuesday was no different: we had our moments, but if we're honest, they were significantly better than us in several departments. Their financial strength may be a mystery, but as the spine of their team contains 3 players that have played for us, I would suspect that we are both competing in the same sector of the market for players. In fact I felt like I'd been watching many of their team for several seasons, suggesting they have a squad stability that we are still searching for.
Ive always rated Sawyers... he seems to be playing a bit deeper these days but he is a big threat going forward and is stronger defensively than people think. I don't think we've got a player like him in our squad, Lawrence a few years ago maybe, but not now. An attacking midfielder is a priority in January IMO.
Like GT 2nd season, the challenges of League 1 are currently not being met by our current manager. One step forward, two back. We're struggling. January will be defining in terms of players retained and players acquired. COYB !
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Post by shrewsoftheworld on Dec 3, 2015 23:17:21 GMT 1
Agree with much of what you say Paul.
The key has been keeping faith with a very good manager even during long winless periods and smith keeping faith in his own philosophy of playing good football and developing players over time.
It will be interesting to see if his successor can keep it going.
I have no doubt that MM can do something similar for us given the same time and support from the chairman and us.
You mention Sawyers and I agree he is a very good player at our level who offers something a bit different. But I remember how many of our fans slated him after 1 particularly poor performance when on loan to us early in his career.
Too many at GM are quick to judge players and seem to focus on weaknesses rather than positives or take account of their age and often huge potential for improvement.
A good example at the moment is our keeper JL whose overal contribution has been superb since he has been here and he has won us many more points than he has cost us. He isn't perfect that's why he is currently in league 1 but with the potential to go higher. However there are some people who seem pleased to be able to knock him over claiming crosses rather than praise his strengths.
Sadly I don't think it will change. For many how well we play depends solely on the result.
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Post by saddler1975 on Dec 4, 2015 0:47:48 GMT 1
What did you guys make of Henry? He's being followed by near enough every PL team and without a shadow of doubt will be England's future LB/LM.
Defensively he can be beaten but those 3 runs he did Tuesday were breathtaking, especially the one on the first half were he just went past 2 or 3 of your guys like they were not there and the desire to run 60 yards from LB to almost CF position the lay on the 3rd goal was stunning and he's only 18.
Without any hesitation this kid is the best thing to ever come through our youth system and if we get anything less than 2.5 million with add ons and a loan back we will be robbed.
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Post by shrewswolf on Dec 4, 2015 1:29:32 GMT 1
What did you guys make of Henry? He's being followed by near enough every PL team and without a shadow of doubt will be England's future LB/LM. Defensively he can be beaten but those 3 runs he did Tuesday were breathtaking, especially the one on the first half were he just went past 2 or 3 of your guys like they were not there and the desire to run 60 yards from LB to almost CF position the lay on the 3rd goal was stunning and he's only 18. Without any hesitation this kid is the best thing to ever come through our youth system and if we get anything less than 2.5 million with add ons and a loan back we will be robbed. Class act. Any player that can run at such a pace while still in complete control of the ball at our level is rare, let alone a full back. I don't think such marauding runs would be so welcome against teams capable of capatilising when he does lose it though so that'll be his test. Just like he punished an out of position Grandison for your 3rd. Don't think you'll ever get that money for a young third division left back though. And as for Black - I understand frustrations with Mellon but you have to place trust in professionals not to do anything stupid and especially those who are your best players. Both bookings were more than stupid, so I'd say he let Mellon down massively. Don't agree that Gerrard is right to publically fall out with Leutweiler either, especially in front of travelling support wanting to see exactly that. Have your disagreements but leave the big words for the dressing room. He could certainly come for the ball but it's hardly a gaffe and Gerrard hasn't been here long enough to realise how many points our keeper has won us since his arrival. |
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osprey
Midland League Division One
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Post by osprey on Dec 4, 2015 1:31:28 GMT 1
What did you guys make of Henry? He's being followed by near enough every PL team and without a shadow of doubt will be England's future LB/LM. Defensively he can be beaten but those 3 runs he did Tuesday were breathtaking, especially the one on the first half were he just went past 2 or 3 of your guys like they were not there and the desire to run 60 yards from LB to almost CF position the lay on the 3rd goal was stunning and he's only 18. Without any hesitation this kid is the best thing to ever come through our youth system and if we get anything less than 2.5 million with add ons and a loan back we will be robbed. Very impressed. Thought he looked very lightweight for a defender, but on second thoughts the position of full- back is not all about brute strength and kicking people. His first run was superb, I found myself , for a split second, hoping that he would accept the return pass and go on and score. It was that good, and I make no apologies for my comments to anyone, it would have been a pleasure to see n pure football terns. Obviously I also wanted us to score one more goal than your lot. I think you are living in cloud cuckoo land if you think you will get a sniff of 2.5million. Big clubs will come in, offer you just enough to excite you which will be well south of what you have wanted, but more than you have seen before, and you will fold, bare your arse and get well shafted. It happens all the time. Yes, you will be robbed. Good player, hope he stays injury free. |
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Post by saddler1975 on Dec 4, 2015 8:18:13 GMT 1
Thanks for your thoughts. The reasons why I mentioned £2.5mil are
1, his age and talent
2, recently signed a 3 year contract
3, due to the lack of young raw English talent they always seem to go for a premium price
4, we've always undersold our best players and I think Uncle Jeff has learnt his lesson
5, part of the England u19 squad
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