Post by El Presidente on Jul 23, 2010 22:07:06 GMT 1
Jul 23, 2010 21:37:38 GMT 1 @nicko said:
Nicko, I hear what you're saying. My point is that public perception seems to be earing on the side of the negative towards the police in general; they can not be all things to all people. Maybe this is the problem, that they have become responsible for too much. If we devided the 'force' into sections similar to how the French system works, would this appease the critics? For example, cut away completely the TSUs from the rank and file police, call them something different, and give them different, more robust powers? Or keep their powers the same, and limit the powers of the rank and file?
How should we manage large-scale public disorder? Internationally, most countries use very offensive methods usually left to the military...
If public confidence in the police is low then incidents like the Ian Tomlinson and this:
www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/officers-claim-they-dont-need-law-to-stop-photographer-taking-pictures-2012827.html
aren't going to help.
Training, improved discipline and making sure that officers are mentally able to carry out duties like TSU are what's needed and the CPS having the balls and letting a jury decide if a criminal act had taken place.
As for your last point, we don't need the Army on the streets. Remember the hunt for Roal Moat and the loan of armoured vehicles from NI?
Nicko, sorry, what I meant with my last point was that tactics used by police in other countries to contain and defeat public disorder are considerably more offensive than that which we currently employ.
Anyhow, re your point on better training and discipline - I'm not sure where you gain your insight from ... but with regard to training, as I mentioned above, perhaps the police do too much and try to be all things to all people - only limited numbers of officers are given specialist training in, and remian employed on, specialist duties for long periods of time - most bobbies cut around different departments every few years over the course of their careers. so you will get skill fade, and depth/lack of depth, of knowledge of legislation with each different officer you meet. The rule of Law is an extreamly broad subject. The fix is not as simple as better training per se, it has to be smartly targetted.
With regard to the CPS - certainly they could authorise a charge and put the case before a Jury. However their decision not to was based on UK case law; and the burden of 'reasonable doubt'. Regardless how the jury reaches a verdict, the presiding Judge still has to ratify the verdict, ensuring that it sits in keeping with statute law. I doubt the judge could do that given the PM evidence before him would easily be contradicted, and is now unratifasle given much of the body matter has been destroyed.
Day to day, how many of us come into contact with the police, and day to day, how often is the experience negative? Not negative in respect of 'bugger, I got a ticket' ... but negative as though we feel we have been abused or mistreated...I would hazard a guess that perception seriously diverges from factual reality.