RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY
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Post by RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY on Dec 18, 2003 9:23:47 GMT 1
Last night I went to look round the Junior school my eldest will move to next year and meet the headmistress. I can see us falling out !
She went on and on and on about how overworked Teachers are (LIKE NOBODY ELSE WORKS HARD !).
Then she said the school do not encourage competative sport so that no children grow up feeling like losers (WE CAN WRITE OFF THE WORLD CUP FOR ANOTHER 20 YEARS THEN !).
The icing on the cake was that she expected us Parents to do the bulk of educating our children, her and her staff only harness home learning. If our Children under achieve academically it is not down to her or her staff (I ACCEPT THAT PARENTS HAVE A DUTY TO EDUCATE CHILDREN BUT TO TOTALLY ABSOLVE TEACHERS FROM ANY POTENTIAL FLACK IS COMPLETELY OUT OF ORDER !)
I came out feeling very bemused, and talking to other parents outside we were dissapointed if not appaled by some of her comments.
You would not have got this garbage spouted by teachers 20 years ago. I know one lad who left teacher training exactly because of this, he morally could not accept these sort of attitudes which were being impressed on teachers.
GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR !
Rant over !
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Post by welshshrew5 on Dec 18, 2003 9:29:17 GMT 1
How lovely of you to slate all teachers based on one bad experience.
Rather than slag her off, why not turn that energy into something constructive to support your child through their education - a lot of parents don't do enough.
I am sure that same teacher could quite have easily come on here with a post entitled "Parents! They drive you mad".
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RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY
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Post by RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY on Dec 18, 2003 9:35:44 GMT 1
Ex wife and Mother were teachers so know teaching quite well !
Yeah, accept I shouldn't generalise but we are talking School policy here, not individual teachers failings. Surely the policies are ill conceived at best.
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Post by welshshrew5 on Dec 18, 2003 9:40:01 GMT 1
They do seem slightly strange policies.
What are the ways of getting involved (I don't know enough about school structures)?
Are Governors elected? How accountable are they? If you'e not happy a few months after they've started, that may be the way to go?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2003 10:08:39 GMT 1
The policies of that individual teacher do seem a bit warped
However I think teachers are, in general, under paid.
Yes they do have bl00dy superb holidays etc.
However the amount of lives they influence is a ridiculously high number and while parents do take a massive responsibility in educating their children too, teachers can make a huge difference as to what qualifications someone can get.
I personally think the level of wages offered to teachers now can price some potentially excellent teachers out of the market as, comared to some jobs, the pay is not nearly as high - and while you'd hope morality was an option when chosing a job, wage level is certainly an important variably too.
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Post by Andy Brewer on Dec 18, 2003 10:20:45 GMT 1
My daughter's primary school actively encourages extra-curricula activities and competitive sport, and as an added bonus her year 7 teacher is an absolute stunner. Makes parents evenings a pleasure - almost as enjoyable as watching the Brewers . Watch out for the Talbot-Corbett dual strikeforce on Saturday - we might just sneak it...!
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Post by ShrewsandRoyals on Dec 18, 2003 11:51:33 GMT 1
Yep. We are all rubbish, swan around doing nothing in the holidays, walk out the door at 3 0'clock and don't care about the kids. I would love to be back at work but am not allowed to for the forseeable future while I still have pelvic problems. Just as information - not moaning - it takes 10 days to work the extra hours that the half term "off" cover. Many teachers then give that time to take kids on trips. That jolly "free holiday" involves having to watch kids for 24 hours and be responsible for them sneaking out and drinking/harming themselves if you dare to sleep. Think back to what we all were like when we went on trips! ;)Parents on trips can absolve themselves of any responsibility for their childrens actions should their offspring be harmed/killed even if the parent is watching. The teacher stood next to them can be, and has been found responsible for involutary manslaughter and jailed. Please don't tar us all with the same brush. After all some of us do bother running football teams; taking trips to internationals (at all levels); running a school fantasy football league with 130 teams; taking kids bowling (all out of school); running extra classes (at lunch and after school); giving kids your home e-mail so you can answer questions about their homework any time of the day any day (even if you are on maternity leave); running revision sessions in the holidays at your own home or in school; running that risk of taking other peoples children on adventure weeks while you have to leave your own at home. Yes some are poor, as are a lot of people in their job. I just despise people who slag all of us off as wingers who have loads of holidays without actually thinking about it I like doing it, and I don't do it for the money. I don't complain about the hours, they are needed, especially to give the kids a chance of the add ons. I happen to think I'm quite good too. My last Science GCSE class averaged 81% on their actual paper between the 32 of them, and Biology A level saw one with 100% and four with over 90%. (That's a non-selective, mixed sex school) Still doesn't stop me having been hit by two kids. But I can enjoy the fact I know there are doctors, physios, vets, and other scientists/non-scientists that I directly had a hand in helping them in their careers. I can also smile when I watch one of "my lads" playing cricket at international level. ;D. The job can provide great laughs too (especially when marking exam papers!). It is a sad fact today that many parents themselves are busy and don't have time to help educate their own children. They do blame teachers if their child has not done their home work too! Am I supposed to call round and check each child at home? I suggest that you look for a different school as you do have some choice in the matter these days if you prepare early, research early and visit the schools in advance of choosing them - as we did last year for this September. You don't get any shocks then as you have made a well informed selection. Oh, and can all you parents please do a bit more on the sex education front. Your children will tell their teacher about your secret stash of porn videos, overheard sex sessions, and what they have managed to spy at. Next time a teacher smiles at you when you sit down for a parents evening remember it may not be because your child is nice! ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2003 12:50:45 GMT 1
I just admit after doing some a-Level tutoring, becoming a teacher id cross my mind. However a few of my uni mates parents are teachers and whenever I've spoken to them they have strongly advised me not to go into teaching because of the stress/long hours(loads of marking out of school etc...).
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Post by wiganshrew2 on Dec 18, 2003 13:34:04 GMT 1
I was a class teacher for 30 years, before I did an M.Ed in Literacy Studies, then a Post Graduate Certificate in Special Needs (Dyslexia) two years ago- I've also got British Dyslexia Association approved teacher status. (I'm only stating this, cos I DO know what I'm talking about!) I often meet a teacher of my generation who does a bit of supply work in the school where I teach a group of "Special Needs" children for an hour each morning. What we do is rant and moan about the state of education today- and she even said, "They have ignorance thrust upon them!!" One day I'm going to write a book about it- only it would probably be banned- or I'd be taken out of circulation, somehow!! I don't blame teachers- a lot of young teachers I see work harder than we ever did- they're heading for total burn-out. I blame the Government's stupid enforced policies. The Literacy Hour is a joke- it encourages children to guess. Why do they institutionalise such short term and stupid methods? Because they want short term results in the tests at age 7. It gets them reading, after a fashion- the brightest manage to move on and read properly- but a lot are stuck in "guessing" mode for their entire Primary "career". Of the children I help, perhaps two are genuinely Dyslexic or have other problems- the others are just average, normal children, totally confused by silly teaching methods enforced by a Government hell-bent on producing short term "results" so it can boast about them in time for the next election!!! Have you heard about "emergent spelling"? No- you want want to- what a load of **** that is!! Because of "emergent spelling", we have 11year olds spelling "said" as "sed" etc... I know from my training in Special Needs that once incorrect spelling goes into the long-term memory- it takes a lot of getting right again. Also- the Government have crowded out the Curriculum with a lot of irrelevant garbage, so that teachers have to fit really important stuff, like teaching children how to work out words and spell properly, have to be fitted into about 10 minutes a day!! And they load up teachers with paperwork- like they load up every other line of work- so teachers have to write about what they do- but don't have time to actually do it properly!! Yes- there were some lazy teachers around in the 1960s and 70s- but instead of taking time to build on the best practice from the best schools- based on WHAT REALLY WORKS- they threw the baby out with the bath water- and imposed a lot of **** methods that only work for the very brightest. Now, they have to have about three different initiatives- like ELS and ALS (Early Literacy Strategy and Alternative Literacy Strategy) aimed at repairing the damage, if you ask me. (And they won't ask us- us older ones who've known better and seen better results- they prefer to put us on the scrapheap, if they could! In my case- I work for an Idependent Dyslexia Centre, as well as in a school' so they can't!!!!) Neither can they shut me up, because I'm one who fights causes!!!! No DO complain, Ratcliffe's ghost- but make sure you complain to the right sources. If more parents wrote to the Government and said "This is a load of **** and we want our children educating properly!" Things might get done- especially if they think it translates into votes- or lack of them- aty the next election. A lot of teachers ARE brainwashed, though- they think they're doing right. You have to be a bit of a rebel to teach well, really. They don't want people who THINK -they want obedient robots!!! That's my rant over!!!!!
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Post by ShrewsandRoyals on Dec 18, 2003 14:31:48 GMT 1
No brainwashed teacher here! Definite rebel and teach kids with attitude and free thought too. You may well know "my kids" in the Central TV area. That lot on the TV about the uniform being imposed on them....they are my stars! ;D
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Post by wiganshrew2 on Dec 18, 2003 15:03:59 GMT 1
That's what I like to hear- a teacher who actually thinks rather than obeys goverment directives blindly! We need to think what the students need, not what the Government wants.
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Post by ShrewsandRoyals on Dec 18, 2003 15:28:41 GMT 1
Too right Wigan. I have to deal with spelling problems myself. Minor league letter omitting and vowel switching, but it makes the kids feel better to know we are all human and that even if you try like mad to correct it, you often can't even see the error, and can not "learn" it whatever you do. I'm also addressed by my first name and have a reputation for standing up for the kids against my HOD even. Got told off for teaching something not on the syllabus - he couldn't argue when I pointed out the syllabus was a guide to the minimum requirement and not what must alone be taught!
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Post by newheyshrew on Dec 18, 2003 17:09:22 GMT 1
I am glad that there are people who are standing up for us teachers here. Yes I am looking forward to my holidays as we've had a hard week. I'll also be back here tonight for our Carol service and I'll be dressed up to dance to the Cheeky Girls tomorrow - god help us all!!!! I;'ve worked dead hard all term, just like all my friends have worked well in their jobs and deserve thier holidays!!!! Some teachers - like loads of other people in other professions have strange ideas - but I wouldn't come on here moaning and groaning about how rude supermarket workers are if one sole shop assistant was rude to me in Asda!!!!
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RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY
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Post by RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY on Dec 19, 2003 11:46:16 GMT 1
Aren't Baker Days supposed to be used for teachers continual professional development ?
If so, why is the Dun Cow going to be full of teachers from one school in shrewsbury on their baker day at 11a.m. this morning.
That is unprofessional, is it not ?
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Post by wiganshrew2 on Dec 19, 2003 11:55:46 GMT 1
I can't answer for that! All I know is that the Baker Days (now called PD- professional development, days) were just that. In fact, as a specialist teacher, I've actually run a course at a school's PD day. (If anyone's interested, I've still got the handout in my documents and would be happy to send it to anyone who would find it useful- it's about Dyslexia. My e-mail is ys.owl@btopenworld.com.) When I retire from my present part-time work, I'm hoping to get a reading scheme up and runnning, together with advice for parents. My ideas- but my daughter's IT expertise, we're going into partnership.
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Post by Shrews and Royals on Dec 19, 2003 12:13:13 GMT 1
They may well have carried out twilight sessions like we do to free a day. We were due in on the Friday at the end of August and held 3 x 2.5 hour training sessions in evenings to make up for it. It's called flexibility in that case. As an extra note, some of my best teaching development has come from sharing a pint or two on a Friday night after school with colleagues from other subject areas. A question from a teacher. Are all parents who take their kids out of school on holiday in term time irresponsible? Those that think they are being responsible demand us to prepare a personal teaching package to take with them for their little dears too (as we all can russle up in the odd couple of hours with a days notice - yes it does happen). They really do use the excuse that it's cheaper to go in school time too - how to make a teacher feel even happier!
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RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY
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Post by RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY on Dec 20, 2003 10:22:24 GMT 1
Opened a real hornets nest here, that was not my intention.
Talking to several people in the watering holes around town last night there are definately two camps on this one. Obviously everyone thinks that their own particular job is the hardest/most stressful on the planet. Teachers are just the same as everyone else in that respect.
Respect to John P, a teacher from Church Stretton who pointed out that he had 4 free periods yesterday and does not consider marking work out of hours as a valid whinge, albeit one which other teachers constantly use while not making use of free periods.
Big Daves opinion that if teachers do not wish to be held responsible for educating children they should be paid the same salary as child minders found plenty of support last night. This was too radical for me but his arguementis is one which had legs (he even got concessions from two lefty teachers on this one late on last night!)
Happy Christmas to all you educators out there. Appologies if I offended anyone.
PS Wiggy, can you e-mail that to me. Spoke to a couple of people last night who have dyslexic family members who would love to read it, as would I. In my proper job I come into contat with many SEN teachers and I have nothing but the utmost respect for them.
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RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY
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Post by RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY on Dec 20, 2003 10:35:59 GMT 1
Sorry Wiggy, forgot to post e-mail address, it is richardndebi@fsmail.net.
Thanks
Oh and ShrewsandRoyals re the post two above concerning teachers talking about work in the pub. Is this a wind up ? Are teachers so insular that they think that no other professions talk about work in the pub ? I certainly do with my workmates sometimes long into the night. But then, that is in my time not my employers, which I think is fair.
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RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY
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Post by RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY on Dec 20, 2003 10:46:18 GMT 1
Shrewsand Royals, just read again my post above and it sounds too arsey for words. Appologies mate, I didn't mean it to come out like that. Merry xmas.
NB: JANUARYS RANT WILL IT BE SOCIAL WORKERS OR THE CPS ? Anyone any opinions on which ?
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Post by ShrewsandRoyals on Dec 20, 2003 11:24:43 GMT 1
R's Ghost - My only complaint was that people tar us all with the same brush! I don't complain about the hours, work hard and like it. Parents also think we are responsible for kids morals, behavioural standards, an level of respect to others. We even get blamed for the level of teenage pregnancies! Sure delegate some reponsiblity to teachers, but parents responsibilites for some personal, social,and intellectual development exist too. You'd agree with that I'm sure. How about suits who have long free business lunches and rounds of golf or trips to rugby to discuss "work" as a topic...are you reading this Mr S&R's ;D ;D (Oops! I'm now dead!) Jolly Crimble!
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RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY
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Post by RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY on Dec 20, 2003 11:32:15 GMT 1
LOL S&R
Respect and fully agree ! You're quite right "Suits" are very high on the rant agenda.
Anyway, as a West Ham fan can we have our money back for Alan Pardew. He doesn't seem to be working right !
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Post by ShrewsandRoyals on Dec 20, 2003 11:36:46 GMT 1
Sticks out tongue, waves fingers in ears and shouts HA HA HA! ;D Methinks we probably came out better on that in the long run. Be warned he may do the same to you as the evil Scotsman did following his abandoning of us.
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RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY
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Post by RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY on Dec 20, 2003 11:44:26 GMT 1
BRING BACK RON GREENWOOD !
I realise he's dead but surely he can still do a better job than Alan Pardew. Faling that someone with more vision, Stevie Wonder perhaps !
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Post by RuytonShrew on Dec 20, 2003 12:50:59 GMT 1
I used to be a teacher and it's very hard work. I was regularly planning and marking til 8 or 9 at night and working most Sundays (gave myself Saturdays off for football!) There was loads to do in the holidays.
I'm a journalist now so there's a profession you can all hate!!!
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Post by wiganshrew2 on Dec 20, 2003 22:32:17 GMT 1
I haven't got an e-mail address for you, Ratcliffe'sghost! Are you the same Ratcliffe's ghost who was behind me and Leah, my grand-daughter at the Tamworth match in September?!!! Either mail me- and I'll mail you back with an attachment- or- are you going to the Boxing day match?
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Post by dhglawdavid on Dec 21, 2003 10:20:53 GMT 1
I can answer that one for you RATCLIFFESGHOSTHONESTLY...because the majority of so called "professional development" courses put on are of such little worth, often an insult to the intelligence and almost invariably patronising rubbish that a lot more will be learnt by social interaction at the Dun Cow than going through the torture of attending them.
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Post by Daisy T on Dec 23, 2003 15:16:38 GMT 1
R'Ghost ! Chill man.
I am a primary school teacher and yes I finished last Friday and yes I am not going back until Tuesday 6th of jan (our PD day is tagged on the start of next term and Yes I am unashamedly using it to prelong my husband and I's ski-ing break !)
I did become a primary school teacher as there is no other profession with conditions of service to match.
For watching kids run round a playground i do get a free lunch. I do have 5 weeks holiday away usually in summer.
Just to really wind you up I spent two labour intensive days on the last days of term, reading on thursday and colouring in on friday ! Oh and every one of the kids without fail brought me a present, mostly chocolates.
You're just jealous you didn't choose primary school teaching I reckon
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Post by Shrews and Royals on Dec 23, 2003 15:51:04 GMT 1
Doh!....You should have picked Secondary.....more classes, more pressies....and the "6th formers" bring alcohol for you as a thank you!;D Plus they know how to control their own bodily fluids!
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Post by samsasholedagain on Dec 24, 2003 9:57:53 GMT 1
Agree with the two above posters RG. Stop bloody moaning will you, you've got 3 days off haven't you. ;D
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Post by Nickjonesy on Dec 24, 2003 12:22:26 GMT 1
As another former secondary teacher (there are quite a few of us, aren't there!) I must admit that the interaction with the kids was great, but the cr*p that went along with it outweighed the positives. The stress levels mean that you actually needed the holidays to restore sanity. I am now 'a suit' earning far more money (and playing more golf) than I could've imagined had I remained in the profession.
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