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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2007 11:45:56 GMT 1
Morning all,
There's been a fair bit of debate recently about the level of bickering on threads which is putting off some people on B&A.
While a lot of this comes from STFC related topics, there is also a lot which comes from the discussions around politics etc.
A problem stems from this that because of someone's political beliefs they are then not given their chance to discuss STFC by other posters, which in my opinion is wrong.
One potential solution for this, as suggested by several users of the board recently, is to have an off-topic messageboard where non-football related topics could be discussed.
The benefits to this as are per above.
However there are some possible pitfalls too, such as the possibility of off-topic threads not being viewed as much as before - the vareity of topics, both football and non-football has always been a strength of this board in my opinion.
In addition there is no guarantee that it will stop the bickering between supporters.
I'd be interested to know people's thoughts on this, or alternative methods to help improve B&A.
Ta
Ant
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Post by monkeechicken on Dec 10, 2007 11:53:33 GMT 1
what are people complaining about? diversity is good and its not as if the football was replaced by other topics. its just a case of looking a little further sometimes, how difficult can that be? the ultras have been marginalized by people whining, next its non football threads.
how about those who dont like it can have their own board for whinging about anything new.
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Post by martinshrew on Dec 10, 2007 11:58:00 GMT 1
Good Post Ant ... I Think A Politics Board Would Be Neccesary ... And I'm Not Joking ... People Seem To Be Obsessed With It On Here ... There Is Alot Of Outrage In The World With 'Political Correctness' At The Minute And Everybody Has A Viewpoint ... I Don't Think People Would Visit It Though ... Same If You Made An Off-Topic Board ... Although This May Be Viewed More Than The Political Board ... Don't Really Know What I'd Do ... I'd Probably Start A O/T Board ... As A Temp And See How It Goes ... Move All The Topics From The First Page To There ... It Might Take Off, Only One Way To Find Out ... Good Luck, Martin
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Post by Hippo on Dec 10, 2007 12:00:19 GMT 1
I see what you mean, what with every thread being turned in to a political debate by about 5 people. But making an entirely off-topic board would lose much of the comedy from the board IMO; the other board definitely wouldn't get viewed as much.
I think the political arguing seems more prominent than it actually is because of the fact that every STFC topic is an argument as well, at the moment. Just a time of high tensions, i'm sure it'll resolve.
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Post by martinshrew on Dec 10, 2007 12:03:51 GMT 1
Started A Poll For You Ant ... It Might Help
Martin
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2007 12:05:03 GMT 1
Dont think it will work for those who want to read o/t items... its more boards to have to scroll through
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Dec 10, 2007 12:09:45 GMT 1
Its the fact that we have a hard core of political discussers on here, and they regually there are threads that clog up the main board, that are only ever posted on by a select few who want to discuss those matters.
Its a football messageboard at the end of the day, and i we have an off topic room ore even just one for polictics/current affairs, then im all for it...
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Post by El Presidente on Dec 10, 2007 12:12:27 GMT 1
As with Monkey and Ant, I believe the diverse nature of threads and opinions is a board strength. Bickering is fine, differing views is fine, but when it comes to board members stifling the views of others, well I think thats wrong and we should police ourselves on that matter... Shut up Marcus...
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Dec 10, 2007 12:32:14 GMT 1
Also can i say, that we need to start modertaing the titles of posts then if we dont go for a seperate board, that way whats off topic is clearly off tpoic to all users
For example
"Time for Smith to fall on her Sword"
Should be
"O/T Time for Smith to fall on her Sword"
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Post by pawlo on Dec 10, 2007 12:35:26 GMT 1
People can slag off politics as much as they like, but i would hazard a guess that some of the longest running, interesting and diverse threads on here have had political themes, be it in association with things such as the BNP or our local councils attitude towards the club. i agree that it is wrong for a particular posters views on stfc not to be heard because he supports a bunch of kind fluffy bunnies who embrace and enchant our beautifull society with their well thought out and inclusive political agenda. if this happens then its up to the mods to stop it by deleting any offending posts. (HAPPY?)i also agree that one of the strengths of this board is its diversity. Also, where do you draw the line? Do we have a seperate board for politics, you tube videos, polls, other sports, other teams, or is it that you just dont like politics (wow, a 16 year old who finds politics boring). Personally, i think it was wrong to give the Ultras there own board, just like politics, if you didnt like the thread title you dont read it. If you read it and dont like the content either go to another one or report it to a mod. Vote BNP
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Post by El Presidente on Dec 10, 2007 12:37:02 GMT 1
Also can i say, that we need to start modertaing the titles of posts then if we dont go for a seperate board, that way whats off topic is clearly off tpoic to all users For example "Time for Smith to fall on her Sword" Should be "O/T Time for Smith to fall on her Sword" Stop having a go at me...!! You're always picking on me stifling my right to free speech...!!
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Post by El Presidente on Dec 10, 2007 12:40:04 GMT 1
if you didnt like the thread title you dont read it. Vote LOONEY Well Done Matron!
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Post by martinshrew on Dec 10, 2007 12:48:26 GMT 1
People can slag off politics as much as they like, but i would hazard a guess that some of the longest running, interesting and diverse threads on here have had political themes, be it in association with things such as the BNP or our local councils attitude towards the club. i agree that it is wrong for a particular posters views on stfc not to be heard because he supports a bunch of racsist thugs. if this happens then its up to the mods to stop it by deleting any offending posts. i also agree that one of the strengths of this board is its diversity. Also, where do you draw the line? Do we have a seperate board for politics, you tube videos, polls, other sports, other teams, or is it that you just dont like politics (wow, a 16 year old who finds politics boring). Personally, i think it was wrong to give the Ultras there own board, just like politics, if you didnt like the thread title you dont read it. If you read it and dont like the content either go to another one or report it to a mod. Vote Labour I'm Actually Quite Interested In Politics And Always Have Been ... I Think Its Quite Obvious To Me Who Is The Child As When You Don't Have Anything To Say ... You'll Just Knock My 'Age' Or 'Immaturity' ... I Think Its Pretty Pathetic And Boring ... Its Quite Unfair That ''saloppride'' Is Personally Attacked + Ignored/Rubbished With Everything ... Just Because Of His Political Views ... People Say There Is A Clique ... I Don't Know ... Seems Funny That When Anyone Has A Different Opinion ... They Come Under Personal Attack, Abuse And There Views ARe Rubbished By The Majority ... Martin
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2007 12:48:40 GMT 1
People can slag off politics as much as they like, but i would hazard a guess that some of the longest running, interesting and diverse threads on here have had political themes, be it in association with things such as the BNP or our local councils attitude towards the club. i agree that it is wrong for a particular posters views on stfc not to be heard because he supports a bunch of racsist thugs. if this happens then its up to the mods to stop it by deleting any offending posts. i also agree that one of the strengths of this board is its diversity. Also, where do you draw the line? Do we have a seperate board for politics, you tube videos, polls, other sports, other teams, or is it that you just dont like politics (wow, a 16 year old who finds politics boring). Personally, i think it was wrong to give the Ultras there own board, just like politics, if you didnt like the thread title you dont read it. If you read it and dont like the content either go to another one or report it to a mod. Vote Labour Here we go again. This as I see it is currently one of the problems with political debates. It is not illegal to support the BNP as far as I'm aware - yet constantly those who oppose the right's political view do it by using abuse towards the party and its supporters. I would never vote for the BNP however I am all for free speech and having open debates on political subjects. Are we to say we support democracy but result to abuse and slagging matches for certain points of view? I think that the vast majority of the B&A board are more than capable of making up their own minds regarding certain political parties' points of view. If non-BNP supporters are so confident that what the BNP stands for is incorrect then surely they only need to argue their point sensibly for others to see its merits? On a personal note, those who result to abusive arguments against other political parties see their opinion lose respect from myself - and it's swing votes like myself which those of you who are looking to influence voters on this board should be looking to build the respect of! Rant over Ant
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Post by samtheshrew on Dec 10, 2007 12:50:11 GMT 1
You made an Ultras board, and we are about football, so IMO, we need an Off Topic board as soon as possible
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Post by martinshrew on Dec 10, 2007 12:53:46 GMT 1
People can slag off politics as much as they like, but i would hazard a guess that some of the longest running, interesting and diverse threads on here have had political themes, be it in association with things such as the BNP or our local councils attitude towards the club. i agree that it is wrong for a particular posters views on stfc not to be heard because he supports a bunch of racsist thugs. if this happens then its up to the mods to stop it by deleting any offending posts. i also agree that one of the strengths of this board is its diversity. Also, where do you draw the line? Do we have a seperate board for politics, you tube videos, polls, other sports, other teams, or is it that you just dont like politics (wow, a 16 year old who finds politics boring). Personally, i think it was wrong to give the Ultras there own board, just like politics, if you didnt like the thread title you dont read it. If you read it and dont like the content either go to another one or report it to a mod. Vote Labour Here we go again. This as I see it is currently one of the problems with political debates. It is not illegal to support the BNP as far as I'm aware - yet constantly those who oppose the right's political view do it by using abuse towards the party and its supporters. I would never vote for the BNP however I am all for free speech and having open debates on political subjects. Are we to say we support democracy but result to abuse and slagging matches for certain points of view? I think that the vast majority of the B&A board are more than capable of making up their own minds regarding certain political parties' points of view. If non-BNP supporters are so confident that what the BNP stands for is incorrect then surely they only need to argue their point sensibly for others to see its merits? On a personal note, those who result to abusive arguments against other political parties see their opinion lose respect from myself - and it's swing votes like myself which those of you who are looking to influence voters on this board should be looking to build the respect of! Rant over Ant Matron ... Your Doing The Very Thing People Are Getting Completly FCUKED Off With ... ''i agree that it is wrong for a particular posters views on stfc not to be heard because he supports a bunch of racsist thugs.'' Your Just Starting Again With A Personal Attack ... You Sad FCKERS Can't Resist Having A Pop At Somebody Who Does Not Agree With You And Has Different Opinions Pathetic - (Not Aimed At You Ant In The Slightest)
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Post by Dan F on Dec 10, 2007 12:57:09 GMT 1
Not too bothered about Off Topic - I love the diverstiy and think it's one of this board's main selling points over others, but at the very least get the political stuff off the main board - as a floating voter like Ant it has no relevance to me until nearer the time and to be honest it gets boring after a while.
It's not as if you can even avoid some of them, the most irrelevant thread title can turn into a politics debate.
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Post by monkeechicken on Dec 10, 2007 13:07:47 GMT 1
delete the ultras board and bring them back. delete topics that are O/T if they are not prefixed with O/T, people will learn.
as for the bnp lads, bring it on. i am secure in my point of view and like a good discussion. just be sure that the mods know the laws on what constitutes racism, which they would need either way.
I can access all sorts of people here that i dont have many of in my friends/ aquaintances.
I dont know any bnp members for example so my scope is widened from being here. similarly , i didnt really talk to old tory farts before but there are loads on here and they can be quite funny and even sensible at times.
Dont Vote!
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Post by pawlo on Dec 10, 2007 13:08:16 GMT 1
Martin, the "wow, a 16 year old that finds politics boring" comment was very . Should really have added an Sorry if i hurt your feelings. Ant, i apologise for distressing you with my use of the phrase "rascist thugs" Did either of you happen to find anything in the other five paragraphs that where in any way constructive or supportive? Vote for whoever the hell you like.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2007 13:14:09 GMT 1
I'd love to see an end to the political broadcasts on this messageboard mainly because the main protagonists seem set in their ways and are unable to actually debate, prefering to spout the same old rhetoric time and time again.
On the whole, off topic posts make a nice break from the "GP out" and "GP is god" posts. I just hope the arguing and bickering that seems so prevalent at the moment can be stamped out with a few good performances on the pitch and this place can again begin to feel a little wore welcoming and positive.
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Post by BlueinSY2 on Dec 10, 2007 13:35:53 GMT 1
How about if people raise something that is off topic and fail to place O/T in the subject line, then it is automatically deleted by the Mods. It doesn't matter whether it is politics, golf, fave cheesy biscuits. If it is O/T then mark it O/T!!
Oh and Mods do your jobs!!
No need for a seperate board.
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on Dec 10, 2007 13:41:16 GMT 1
Yes, definitely. Or at least try it for 4 weeks and see how it works. We can then run another poll afterwards to see if we keep it.
I don't see how we can judge properly until we have a go at it.
I am so bored at some people's entrenched positions on this board that come over as abuse. It really riles me. I just don't see why everything has to descend into name calling and pettiness. I love grappling with a difficult debate and talking to people with totally different views to me, that is a great thing. But i don't know if the front page of our messageboard should be full of discussion like that.
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oranjemob
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Post by oranjemob on Dec 10, 2007 13:51:30 GMT 1
Firstly, the answer is no. This is one of the best Message Boards around and this is partly due to the wide range of topics that are debated. Why water it down? Secondly, freedom of speech is fundamental to any civilized society. Even though I personally believe that some of the views expressed by certain posters have no place in a civilized society, that does not mean that these views cannot (or should not) be discussed. Censorship is the weapon of the extremist and cannot be justified. Opinions of all should be heard, debated and (in the cases I referred to above) challenged and defeated. Keep B&A whole - "The voice of the masses"
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Post by pawlo on Dec 10, 2007 13:52:54 GMT 1
So can i clarify then.
What is the main page of the board going to allow? Is it purely Shrewsbury Town talk, or will posts about other teams be allowed, what about best italian restraunt type threads, are they ok, and what about best film threads, and saturdays soccerettes, other sports? weather? What about Indy's cookery threads, or is it just politics. And what about local politics and the impact it has on the club, no more cllr armstrong this and that threads, or is that allowed?
personally i dont care what you do, just need some clarification really.
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Post by monkeechicken on Dec 10, 2007 14:01:52 GMT 1
while we're at it, can we stop all this fao stuff? there are pms for thats sort of thing. its a bit cliqueish , a way of having in jokes in public which is annoying if you dont get the reference.
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Post by CuyahogaBlue on Dec 10, 2007 15:37:35 GMT 1
O/T Board - No.
The breadth of discussion etc is what makes B&A interesting.
Having said that:
the "O/T" designation does need to be better utilized; the quality of debate needs to be increased; and, the vitriolic tone of posts should be curtailed.
IMO
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2007 16:17:57 GMT 1
I think the OT threads are a vital part of the b+a mainboard.
To further fragment things i think is wrong.
Lets be honest, i don't know about you guys but its the main reason i post on b+a
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Post by jamo on Dec 10, 2007 16:18:39 GMT 1
Definate No for me.
Why lose the main strength of this place when the simple solution to any percieved abuse is that the moderators do what they are there to do, namely moderate.
This doesn't have to be in a bullish or aggressive way rather through a little diplomacy and a series of quiet warnings.
Most on here are capable of being a little rash at times and can sometimes post stuff that they later regret, thats fine and should be expected from a footbal messageboard but when that threshold is crossed then thosed charged with maintianing the boards integrity should act.
By creating a seperate board for all topics B & A is really setting itself up for self destruction.The ultra's- love'em or hate'em - have already shown that by conducting a campaign of spamming and aggression they can get their own way, whats to stop other splinter groups doing the same ?
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Post by mgkstfc1 on Dec 10, 2007 17:44:37 GMT 1
i agree that it is wrong for a particular posters views on stfc not to be heard because he supports a bunch of racsist thugs. if this happens then its up to the mods to stop it by deleting any offending posts. Vote Labour [/quote] I think this remark is totally uncalled for. Just because you do not agree with someones politics, it does not give you the right to accuse them of supporting a bunch of racist thugs, as you put it.
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Post by Yes on Dec 10, 2007 17:49:08 GMT 1
Yes please make an off topic board
i come on here to read about STFC and Football..
not a host of other rubbish non STFC or football.
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