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Post by martinshrew on Jun 21, 2022 10:02:24 GMT 1
There are legitimate reasons why there is a strike. Conditions, Work practices as well as fair pay. All associated on the frontline rail industry do a fine job despite often having one hand tied behind there back thanks to an inept government. People do want to work, but in a fair way. Not much to ask. Why are they so hellbent in holding the railway back? Technology is miles behind, they're trying to reform but the unions are holding them back. If they reform and modernise, they'll end up with a very decent pay rise, but they continue to reject reform. Modernisation of the railway is URGENTLY required and these tossers running the unions need to drag themselves into the 21st century.
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Post by davycrockett on Jun 21, 2022 10:07:46 GMT 1
We've worked from home for that long it should be a breeze for anyone who has previously done it. I feel sorry for those in low wage jobs who can't travel to work being disrupted by these bloody unions and their unrealistic demands. I've seen people worried about their immigration status due to non-attendance of college because of these strikes. It's plain wrong. Or maybe it’s thanks to the unions your allowed to work from home? My sister in law works for Land Registery in Telford. Worked from home due to Covid then all employees ardered to return to their desks. Unions got involved pointed out all the government benefits /risks alluded to during Covid so now official policy permanently allowed to work from home. By definition strikes cause disruption / inconvenience, are you suggesting it should be illegal to for employees to withdraw their labour in protest? How are you going to control unfair employers? Perhaps the UK should withdraw from the the UN and ILO now we’ve withdrawn fro the EU? Not to mention the Universal Declaration of Human Rights…. The right to strike is one of the most important international labor standards. Internationally this right is regulated and governed by several international legal instruments of the UN, the ILO and the EU, which provide that the right to strike gets universal character. The most important international legal instruments of the UN which regulate the right to strike are: the Universal Declaration of Human Rights (1948), International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights (1966).
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Post by martinshrew on Jun 21, 2022 10:13:28 GMT 1
We've worked from home for that long it should be a breeze for anyone who has previously done it. I feel sorry for those in low wage jobs who can't travel to work being disrupted by these bloody unions and their unrealistic demands. I've seen people worried about their immigration status due to non-attendance of college because of these strikes. It's plain wrong. Or maybe it’s thanks to the unions your allowed to work from home? My sister in law works for Land Registery in Telford. Worked from home due to Covid then all employees ardered to return to their desks. Unions got involved pointed out all the government benefits /risks alluded to during Covid so now official policy permanently allowed to work from home. By definition strikes cause disruption / inconvenience, are you suggesting it should be illegal to for employees to withdraw their labour in protest? How are you going to control unfair employers? Perhaps the UK should withdraw from the the UN and ILO now we’ve withdrawn fro the EU? Not to mention the Universal Declaration of Human Rights…. The right to strike is one of the most important international labor standards. Internationally this right is regulated and governed by several international legal instruments of the UN, the ILO and the EU, which provide that the right to strike gets universal character. The most important international legal instruments of the UN which regulate the right to strike are: the Universal Declaration of Human Rights (1948), International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights (1966).
Of course there's a right to strike, but when you break it down their striking over modernisation, which eventually comes to all sectors. The railway needs to modernise, the unions are stopping it. Modernisation will ensure a better, safer and more efficient service whilst ensuring a very decent pay rise. The problem is, the unions are digging their heels in and holding the country back. We deserve a modernised rail service.
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Post by davycrockett on Jun 21, 2022 10:20:02 GMT 1
Or maybe it’s thanks to the unions your allowed to work from home? My sister in law works for Land Registery in Telford. Worked from home due to Covid then all employees ardered to return to their desks. Unions got involved pointed out all the government benefits /risks alluded to during Covid so now official policy permanently allowed to work from home. By definition strikes cause disruption / inconvenience, are you suggesting it should be illegal to for employees to withdraw their labour in protest? How are you going to control unfair employers? Perhaps the UK should withdraw from the the UN and ILO now we’ve withdrawn fro the EU? Not to mention the Universal Declaration of Human Rights…. The right to strike is one of the most important international labor standards. Internationally this right is regulated and governed by several international legal instruments of the UN, the ILO and the EU, which provide that the right to strike gets universal character. The most important international legal instruments of the UN which regulate the right to strike are: the Universal Declaration of Human Rights (1948), International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights (1966).
Of course there's a right to strike, but when you break it down their striking over modernisation, which eventually comes to all sectors. The railway needs to modernise, the unions are stopping it. Modernisation will ensure a better, safer and more efficient service whilst ensuring a very decent pay rise. The problem is, the unions are digging their heels in and holding the country back. We deserve a modernised rail service. Also striking over pay, unions have to dig their heels in due to incompetence of the employers. Your falling for the modernisation part of the argument alone. Your right about needing a modernised rail service which has failed us for years. I don’t believe it’s just down to employees.
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Post by gainsparkshrew on Jun 21, 2022 10:30:24 GMT 1
Listening to Radio Shropshire earlier and they were talking to people who had turned up at Shrewsbury Station this morning.All where totally unaware that there was a strike today and that there weren't any trains running...almost comedy gold!
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Post by martinshrew on Jun 21, 2022 10:34:32 GMT 1
Listening to Radio Shropshire earlier and they were talking to people who had turned up at Shrewsbury Station this morning.All where totally unaware that there was a strike today and that there weren't any trains running...almost comedy gold! Do these people live in caves?
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Post by armchairfan on Jun 21, 2022 10:39:15 GMT 1
Militant transport union barons threatening to bring Britain to a standstill have been accused of defending ruinous work practices that date back to the ‘steam age’. An investigation by The Mail has found that the rail industry is gripped by so-called ‘Spanish practices’ that prolong delays and hike up fare costs. www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10905687/Train-services-cancelled-staff-wont-work-sunny-GUY-ADAMS-investigates.htmlIn addition to ‘walking allowances,’ some railway staff benefit from a bizarre rule that allows them to restart a scheduled break completely if they happen to bump into a manager who says ‘Hello’. Under antiquated conventions, any conversation with the boss class counts as ‘work.’ Astonishingly, this invalidates any break-time. Imagine your line manager stopping to say “Hello” when you are on a formal break. In the office or on-site, that’s a positive sign of teamwork. Ludicrously, in the rail industry the rule book decrees that the break has to restart from the beginning. Unions have also resisted fitting automatic sensors to trains that will check the track for defects. ‘Each one takes 70,000 pictures a minute and finds tiny cracks and flaws no human eye can see. But instead they insist on sending people out to walk along the track looking at the rails,’ adds the source. ‘Not only is this less likely to pick up problems, it’s more dangerous for staff. In the past two years alone, eight rail workers have been killed by trains while working on the track.’ The article lists an amazing number of questionable work practices. Any questinable work practices are 50% down to bad management over the years. It takes two to tango. Such a comment is not wholly untrue, of course, but a reluctance on the part of Management, or ultimately the Government of the day, when BR existed, to face down the Unions with a gun at their heads, is understandable, and if that equates in your mind to "bad management" 50% of the time, I think that you are probably trying too hard to be "fair". Given that this piece was in the Daily Mail, I think it fair to question, on the other hand, it's political motivation: I am not convinced that all the practices described are give an accurate picture of the average work-day experience for most staff, but probably do indicate the existence of a variety of dubious methods of working, or choosing NOT to work; generally, therefore I tend to accept the general thrust of the article, but will await the more balanced and knowledgeable views to be published in "Rail" magazine and in "Railway Magazine" That such practices can remain is symptomatic of the conservatism of the rail unions, who, apparently, still wish the industry to run "as it always has" with no regard for advances in technology; if BR had not given in to ASLEF regarding a "second man" on HSTs when they were being introduced over 40 years ago, those magnificent trains (still in use) wouldn't have left the factory, just because ASLEF insisted upon the "second man" to justify a steam fireman having a job.....
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Post by northwestman on Jun 21, 2022 10:44:35 GMT 1
I've read that this year Sunak is getting an extra £27 billion in tax than originally anticipated, and that the entire cost of giving all public workers an increase to match inflation would be £10 billion.
I can't verify those figures though!
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Post by Pilch on Jun 21, 2022 10:46:16 GMT 1
the clue is in the last 4 words of my post What happened to redeployment? i didn't want to stay in signalling so i moved to birmingham into train planning , 4 years later that moved to milton keynes so i took the money
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Post by Feedo Gnasher on Jun 21, 2022 10:48:26 GMT 1
I've read that this year Sunak is getting an extra £27 billion in tax than originally anticipated, and that the entire cost of giving all public workers an increase to match inflation would be £10 billion. I can't verify those figures though! Or, he could use that extra tax to reduce the overall tax burden on people, then there’d be less need to increase so many peoples wages.
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Post by salop27 on Jun 21, 2022 11:02:28 GMT 1
I live next to a railway line and I'm enjoying the peace. Sympathy to anyone affected negatively though.
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Post by northwestman on Jun 21, 2022 11:23:45 GMT 1
I've read that this year Sunak is getting an extra £27 billion in tax than originally anticipated, and that the entire cost of giving all public workers an increase to match inflation would be £10 billion. I can't verify those figures though! Or, he could use that extra tax to reduce the overall tax burden on people, then there’d be less need to increase so many peoples wages. Agree 100%. The freezing of personal tax allowances until 2026 is a stealth tax of which not enough people are aware. They need unfreezing immediately so that they can be adjusted to reflect the rate of inflation, as has always been the case in the past.
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Post by martinshrew on Jun 21, 2022 11:33:01 GMT 1
Or, he could use that extra tax to reduce the overall tax burden on people, then there’d be less need to increase so many peoples wages. Agree 100%. The freezing of personal tax allowances until 2026 is a stealth tax of which not enough people are aware. They need unfreezing immediately so that they can be adjusted to reflect the rate of inflation, as has always been the case in the past. I agree with the sentiment of not throwing cash at everything, a minimum wage rise to £15 would be economic disaster. I think some tax cuts will come soon, I can imagine some things are being cooked up behind the scenes.
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Post by davycrockett on Jun 21, 2022 14:25:35 GMT 1
I live next to a railway line and I'm enjoying the peace. Sympathy to anyone affected negatively though. That will include the rail workers I guess? They loose pay.
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Post by Pilch on Jun 21, 2022 14:40:39 GMT 1
There are legitimate reasons why there is a strike. Conditions, Work practices as well as fair pay. All associated on the frontline rail industry do a fine job despite often having one hand tied behind there back thanks to an inept government. People do want to work, but in a fair way. Not much to ask. Why are they so hellbent in holding the railway back? Technology is miles behind, they're trying to reform but the unions are holding them back. If they reform and modernise, they'll end up with a very decent pay rise, but they continue to reject reform. Modernisation of the railway is URGENTLY required and these tossers running the unions need to drag themselves into the 21st century. lets not forget how much the gov got criticised on here recently for ... well attempting to modernise the railway blueandamber.proboards.com/thread/102202/hs2the current workers don't want progress either in my 19-20 years on the railway I lost my job 4 times due to modernisation and have to take an alternative
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Post by Pilch on Jun 21, 2022 14:44:17 GMT 1
I've read that this year Sunak is getting an extra £27 billion in tax than originally anticipated, and that the entire cost of giving all public workers an increase to match inflation would be £10 billion. I can't verify those figures though! you don't need to verify any figures, whatever it costs lets just give them the money , much at the taxpayers expense and further push up inflation in the process buy hey, don't worry about the well off train drivers when there is an easy opportunity to blame the gov we don't hear much about low paid workers going on strike do we, because only the well off can afford to strike
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Post by neilsalop on Jun 21, 2022 15:07:31 GMT 1
I've read that this year Sunak is getting an extra £27 billion in tax than originally anticipated, and that the entire cost of giving all public workers an increase to match inflation would be £10 billion. I can't verify those figures though! you don't need to verify any figures, whatever it costs lets just give them the money , much at the taxpayers expense and further push up inflation in the process buy hey, don't worry about the well off train drivers when there is an easy opportunity to blame the gov we don't hear much about low paid workers going on strike do we, because only the well off can afford to strike Are train drivers on strike? I must have missed that, I thought most of them were in ASLEF who aren't striking, but hey what do I know. Funny how Grant Shapps is getting a bit miffed about this coming out again
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Post by northwestman on Jun 21, 2022 15:17:41 GMT 1
No 10 defends giving above-inflation rise to pensioners but not to public sector workers.
At the Downing Street lobby briefing the prime minister’s spokesperson was asked to explain why the government was opposing above-inflation pay rises for public sector workers, on the grounds they would be inflationary, while approving an above-inflation increase in the value of the state pension for next year. The spokesperson said the government thought the pension increase would not be inflationary.
Referring to public sector pay, he said:
The view is that if we were to chase inflation in this way, by matching all demands on public sector pay, some of which would involve matching inflation and adding additional on top of that, that would be inflationary, and that’s what in the long term would actually make people feel like they had less money going forward.
Asked why raising the value of the state pension for 2023-24 by more than the likely rate of inflation for that year was not inflationary, he replied:
The chancellor needs to consider it all in the round and the view is that we can meet that commitment without stoking those inflationary pressures. But we did take difficult decisions with regards to the triple lock, a temporary one-year suspension.
The Guardian.
Work that one out!
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Post by davycrockett on Jun 21, 2022 15:19:30 GMT 1
you don't need to verify any figures, whatever it costs lets just give them the money , much at the taxpayers expense and further push up inflation in the process buy hey, don't worry about the well off train drivers when there is an easy opportunity to blame the gov we don't hear much about low paid workers going on strike do we, because only the well off can afford to strike Are train drivers on strike? I must have missed that, I thought most of them were in ASLEF who aren't striking, but hey what do I know. Funny how Grant Shapps is getting a bit miffed about this coming out again Not yet but very soon Train drivers are represented by their own union, Aslef.
Aslef isn't taking part in the strikes, although it is taking part in separate action on June 23, 2022.
Their website states that drivers at Greater Anglia will strike on Thursday, June 23, 2022.
Hull Trains drivers will walk out on Sunday, June 26, and tram drivers in South London will strike for a fair pay deal on Tuesday, June 28, and Wednesday, June 29, as well as Wednesday, July 13, and Thursday, July 14.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2022 15:23:02 GMT 1
Why are they so hellbent in holding the railway back? Technology is miles behind, they're trying to reform but the unions are holding them back. If they reform and modernise, they'll end up with a very decent pay rise, but they continue to reject reform. Modernisation of the railway is URGENTLY required and these tossers running the unions need to drag themselves into the 21st century. lets not forget how much the gov got criticised on here recently for ... well attempting to modernise the railway blueandamber.proboards.com/thread/102202/hs2the current workers don't want progress either in my 19-20 years on the railway I lost my job 4 times due to modernisation and have to take an alternative They weren't being criticised for attempting to modernise the railway, they were being criticised for pressing ahead with a scheme when there was (apparently) a better way of achieving it.
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Post by Pilch on Jun 21, 2022 15:29:43 GMT 1
you don't need to verify any figures, whatever it costs lets just give them the money , much at the taxpayers expense and further push up inflation in the process buy hey, don't worry about the well off train drivers when there is an easy opportunity to blame the gov we don't hear much about low paid workers going on strike do we, because only the well off can afford to strike Are train drivers on strike? I must have missed that, I thought most of them were in ASLEF who aren't striking, but hey what do I know. Funny how Grant Shapps is getting a bit miffed about this coming out again its probably my bitterness against the drivers who's salary almost doubled in no time whilst I was there whilst mine stayed relatively the same, I blame them for everything like you blame Boris if your car won't start ;-)
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Post by northwestman on Jun 21, 2022 15:51:45 GMT 1
Johnson has a cunning plan! Giving an above-inflation rise to pensioners but not to public sector workers. He's going to bribe pensioners, who get out and vote, to vote for the Tories, and grind down the workers with long hours and low pay so that they're too tired to vote for anyone. And the new voting system requiring ID should keep a number of his detractors away from the ballot box. commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9187/
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Post by martinshrew on Jun 21, 2022 16:08:51 GMT 1
The strike isn't half of what it would be pre-pandemic, the unions are that far behind they've forgot a huge portion of the country can work from home.
According to SkyNews, the roads are barely affected. Thankfully these militant unions don't hold half the power they once did.
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Post by martinshrew on Jun 21, 2022 16:14:24 GMT 1
SkyNews reporting that a divide is emerging in the Labour party.
There already was one, some that wanted to move the party forward and plenty that are still Corbyn sympathisers.
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Post by block12massive on Jun 21, 2022 16:21:40 GMT 1
SkyNews reporting that a divide is emerging in the Labour party. There already was one, some that wanted to move the party forward and plenty that are still Corbyn sympathisers. Two Labour frontbenchers have defied Starmer's orders not to join the picket line. www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/keir-starmer-rail-strike-rmt-picket-line-b2105709.htmlCan someone answer me this - why at the picket lines of those striking do we see the usual 'Socialist Worker' placards accompanied by people waving Palestine flags, 'Boycott Israel' and 'Refugees welcome' placards? I must have missed the relevance to trains somewhere.
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Post by Pilch on Jun 21, 2022 17:37:50 GMT 1
SkyNews reporting that a divide is emerging in the Labour party. There already was one, some that wanted to move the party forward and plenty that are still Corbyn sympathisers. They always get upset if they can't get a train seat, even if there are some
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Post by Pilch on Jun 21, 2022 17:41:14 GMT 1
SkyNews reporting that a divide is emerging in the Labour party. There already was one, some that wanted to move the party forward and plenty that are still Corbyn sympathisers. Two Labour frontbenchers have defied Starmer's orders not to join the picket line. www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/keir-starmer-rail-strike-rmt-picket-line-b2105709.htmlCan someone answer me this - why at the picket lines of those striking do we see the usual 'Socialist Worker' placards accompanied by people waving Palestine flags, 'Boycott Israel' and 'Refugees welcome' placards? I must have missed the relevance to trains somewhere. has anyone made a fire out of an used oil drum yet ?, they only ever do that for a picket line considering the weather maybe pop a grill on top and cook some burgers
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2022 18:32:26 GMT 1
Agree 100%. The freezing of personal tax allowances until 2026 is a stealth tax of which not enough people are aware. They need unfreezing immediately so that they can be adjusted to reflect the rate of inflation, as has always been the case in the past. I agree with the sentiment of not throwing cash at everything, a minimum wage rise to £15 would be economic disaster. I think some tax cuts will come soon, I can imagine some things are being cooked up behind the scenes. So tax cuts isn’t throwing money at something? Our money as tax payers?
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Post by gainsparkshrew on Jun 21, 2022 18:56:24 GMT 1
Why are they so hellbent in holding the railway back? Technology is miles behind, they're trying to reform but the unions are holding them back. If they reform and modernise, they'll end up with a very decent pay rise, but they continue to reject reform. Modernisation of the railway is URGENTLY required and these tossers running the unions need to drag themselves into the 21st century. lets not forget how much the gov got criticised on here recently for ... well attempting to modernise the railway blueandamber.proboards.com/thread/102202/hs2the current workers don't want progress either in my 19-20 years on the railway I lost my job 4 times due to modernisation and have to take an alternative Come on,let's be fair here.As one former railway employee to another. As you stated you "lost your job four times". You weren't made redundant,you where " displaced" and the railway did everything they could to help you find another job on the railway.
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Post by zenfootball2 on Jun 21, 2022 19:06:33 GMT 1
Listening to Radio Shropshire earlier and they were talking to people who had turned up at Shrewsbury Station this morning.All where totally unaware that there was a strike today and that there weren't any trains running...almost comedy gold! were have they been any regular rail passengers knew this was happening and were possible have planned accordingly.
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