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Post by martinshrew on May 26, 2022 16:28:03 GMT 1
Whatever help is given wont be enough in some communities. give some people 10 grand, they would waste and and their kids would still be cold and hungry Education is key, and I'm not talking Maths, English, Science as such, but life education. I never received any life advise or education in school, didn't know the first thing about mortgages, loans, compound interest, the impact of every financial decision, credit scores etc. I have over the years engaged myself financially purely because it really interests me, I'm always hunting for the best deal, the best rate, the best fix or switch. Again I feel basic education around cooking fresh meals, stretching your budget, prioritisation are lacking badly. A lot of people are missing the point, but the below should be followed: 1) Mortgage/Rent > 2) Bills/Food > 3) Anything else For some, they're asking why the government isn't providing a breakfast club or free meals for their child, yet smoking 20 a day whilst piping off on social media on the latest iPhone on a Ā£60 a month contract. Plenty are in section 3) before they've covered off section 2) Again I will reiterate, and reiterate in the strongest possible terms that if a family has stripped back their bills, don't smoke, don't drink to excess, don't clammer for the latest electronic gadgets and don't have multiple monthly TV subscriptions and are still struggling to get by then that is completely and utterly wrong.
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Post by Valerioch on May 26, 2022 16:30:58 GMT 1
give some people 10 grand, they would waste and and their kids would still be cold and hungry Education is key, and I'm not talking Maths, English, Science as such, but life education. I never received any life advise or education in school, didn't know the first thing about mortgages, loans, compound interest, the impact of every financial decision, credit scores etc. I have over the years engaged myself financially purely because it really interests me, I'm always hunting for the best deal, the best rate, the best fix or switch. Again I feel basic education around cooking fresh meals, stretching your budget, prioritisation are lacking badly. A lot of people are missing the point, but the below should be followed: 1) Mortgage/Rent > 2) Bills/Food > 3) Anything else For some, they're asking why the government isn't providing a breakfast club or free meals for their child, yet smoking 20 a day whilst piping off on social media on the latest iPhone on a Ā£60 a month contract. Plenty are in section 3) before they've covered off section 2) Again I will reiterate, and reiterate in the strongest possible terms that if a family has stripped back their bills, don't smoke, don't drink to excess, don't clammer for the latest electronic gadgets and don't have multiple monthly TV subscriptions and are still struggling to get by then that is completely and utterly wrong. Similar to your similar post last week, couldn't agree more Yet more eye watering spending from a "Conservative" Government
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Post by Pilch on May 26, 2022 16:31:16 GMT 1
This money should be paid straight to the gas and electric suppliers, admittedly very ironic. I say this as a lot of people,both poor and wealthy, find it very hard to budget money correctly. Difference being if you have a shed load of money it doesn't matter if you're useless with it. of even simpler forget the windfall tax forget the handout just get them to cut the price a bit too easy that ;-)
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Post by martinshrew on May 26, 2022 16:38:37 GMT 1
"Energy policy in this country has been a disaster for decades and all three of the main political parties have contributed to the mess." Ian King, Sky News. I also agree with his point around France, everyone keeps citing the 4% increase cap but they're not talking about how the French government are raising taxes on ordinary French people to cover the shortfall. A set of questions and some excellent answers here: news.sky.com/story/rishi-sunak-announcement-windfall-tax-cost-of-living-latest-12615118
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Post by staffordshrew on May 26, 2022 16:52:15 GMT 1
Whatever help is given wont be enough in some communities. give some people 10 grand, they would waste and and their kids would still be cold and hungry If that's the case then you have more common sense than Rishi Sunak. He thought it was a good idea to take the Ā£20 a week Universal Credit extra Covid payment away and suspend the triple lock and then give recipients a lump sum...
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Post by martinshrew on May 26, 2022 16:55:35 GMT 1
give some people 10 grand, they would waste and and their kids would still be cold and hungry If that's the case then you have more common sense than Rishi Sunak.Ā He thought it was a good idea to take the Ā£20 a week Universal Credit extra Covid payment away and suspend the triple lock and then give recipients a lump sum... "Covid payment". Covid is long gone and we're living as normal. People are working, there's less unemployment than before Covid and businesses are all open as normal. Why would a Ā£20 Covid payment remain when we're not in a Covid pandemic?
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Post by venceremos on May 26, 2022 16:57:11 GMT 1
More top level assumption making there ... Less assumption, more personal experience. Albeit I haven't been round the entire country, I've sampled 100s "in need". When broken down, there is some genuine need coupled with a lot of mixed priorities and lack of life education/skill set. Noted & I will correct: More top level making of sweeping generalisations based on anecdotal evidence there. I don't understand this obsession some have with poor people owning technology. You can't function in modern society without a digital identity, it's not the 1970s. Good that you at least recognise there to be some genuine need though.
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Post by frankwellshrews on May 26, 2022 17:00:12 GMT 1
Interesting. This was leaked ahead of the budget but then didn't materialise till the tories need a distraction from partygate.
Fairly transparently Rishi's "war chest" coming in to play but what's a few months of stress for people struggling to make ends meet eh? Clearly positive PR to distract from the leaderships fairly appalling behaviour with what amounts to a "bare minimum" measure is far more important.
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Post by staffordshrew on May 26, 2022 17:02:56 GMT 1
If that's the case then you have more common sense than Rishi Sunak. He thought it was a good idea to take the Ā£20 a week Universal Credit extra Covid payment away and suspend the triple lock and then give recipients a lump sum... "Covid payment". Covid is long gone and we're living as normal. People are working, there's less unemployment than before Covid and businesses are all open as normal. Why would a Ā£20 Covid payment remain when we're not in a Covid pandemic? You really are hard work! You give anyone, rich or poor Ā£20 a week extra and it becomes part of your budget. You then take it away from the poorest sector of society and expect them to go back to "normal". Better to have not let them get used to having Ā£20 a week extra in the first place, maybe Ā£10 that you could maintain at that level, capiche?
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2022 17:05:04 GMT 1
Is this the long term strategy? When things get bad or there is some bad news they want to bury, throw a one off lump sum to the entire country?
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Post by martinshrew on May 26, 2022 17:08:03 GMT 1
Less assumption, more personal experience. Albeit I haven't been round the entire country, I've sampled 100s "in need". When broken down, there is some genuine need coupled with a lot of mixed priorities and lack of life education/skill set. Noted & I will correct: More top level making of sweeping generalisations based on anecdotal evidence there.Ā Ā I don't understand this obsession some have with poor people owning technology.Ā You can't function in modern society without a digital identity, it's not the 1970s. Good that you at least recognise there to be some genuine need though. I'm not suggesting people go without technology. There's a difference between a functioning smartphone and a flagship iPhone: Samsung Galaxy A03 128GB - Ā£139 Iphone 13 Pro 128GB - Ā£949 Both phones do social media, email, browsing, banking, apps, storage etc. Again, priorities.
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Post by staffordshrew on May 26, 2022 17:10:57 GMT 1
Is this the long term strategy? When things get bad or there is some bad news they want to bury, throw a one off lump sum to the entire country? When things get bad or there is bad news, see what Starmer says and do that. Don't think Boris really has his heart in this government lark, he just likes the prestige. As for Sunak, he has absolutely no idea about how people budget on less than Ā£50million or so a year.
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Post by martinshrew on May 26, 2022 17:11:29 GMT 1
"Covid payment". Covid is long gone and we're living as normal. People are working, there's less unemployment than before Covid and businesses are all open as normal. Why would a Ā£20 Covid payment remain when we're not in a Covid pandemic? You really are hard work!Ā You give anyone, rich or poor Ā£20 a week extra and it becomes part of your budget. You then take it away from the poorest sector of society and expect them to go back to "normal".Ā Better to have not let them get used to having Ā£20 a week extra in the first place, maybe Ā£10 that you could maintain at that level, capiche? You're hard work. My Nan won't get used to the extra Ā£300 warm discount this year (Total Ā£600) and introduce it to her normal budget, frankly because she's not stupid. She'll realise it's a one off payment to help during these times of crisis and she'll return to Ā£300 next year, capiche?
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Post by staffordshrew on May 26, 2022 17:16:47 GMT 1
You really are hard work! You give anyone, rich or poor Ā£20 a week extra and it becomes part of your budget. You then take it away from the poorest sector of society and expect them to go back to "normal". Better to have not let them get used to having Ā£20 a week extra in the first place, maybe Ā£10 that you could maintain at that level, capiche? You're hard work. My Nan won't get used to the extra Ā£300 warm discount this year (Total Ā£600) and introduce it to her normal budget, frankly because she's not stupid. She'll realise it's a one off payment to help during these times of crisis and she'll return to Ā£300 next year, capiche? Of course she won't, nor will anyone else, because it's clearly stated it's not a regular payment. I bet most benefit recipients, rather than pensioners, will just spend it to ensure their kids get what they want for Christmas, maybe those new trainers and clothes, like all the other kids have.
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Post by Pilch on May 26, 2022 17:22:47 GMT 1
Is this the long term strategy? When things get bad or there is some bad news they want to bury, throw a one off lump sum to the entire country? I see your long term strategy good day to bury good news and lets not forget the embarrassing Labour MP who coined the original phrase on 9/11
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Post by martinshrew on May 26, 2022 17:23:16 GMT 1
You're hard work. My Nan won't get used to the extra Ā£300 warm discount this year (Total Ā£600) and introduce it to her normal budget, frankly because she's not stupid. She'll realise it's a one off payment to help during these times of crisis and she'll return to Ā£300 next year, capiche? Of course she won't, nor will anyone else, because it's clearly stated it's not a regular payment.Ā I bet most benefit recipients, rather than pensioners, will just spend it to ensure their kids get what they want for Christmas, maybe those new trainers and clothes, like all the other kids have. Like you stated, it was a Covid uplift, everyone knew Covid wasn't going to be around forever. I think the measures today go about and beyond, they're extraordinary numbers!
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Post by staffordshrew on May 26, 2022 17:31:52 GMT 1
Of course she won't, nor will anyone else, because it's clearly stated it's not a regular payment. I bet most benefit recipients, rather than pensioners, will just spend it to ensure their kids get what they want for Christmas, maybe those new trainers and clothes, like all the other kids have. Like you stated, it was a Covid uplift, everyone knew Covid wasn't going to be around forever. I think the measures today go about and beyond, they're extraordinary numbers! Well, he has got all that extra VAT from increased prices of goods, services and fuel. All that extra cash from not raising the tax thresholds and suspension of the triple lock. He gives on the one, well publicised, hand and takes away, quietly, with the other hand.
His windfall tax doesn't appear to have been too much of a burden on the oil companies either, Shell shares are slightly up, so he hasn't upset his city chums.
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Post by frankwellshrews on May 26, 2022 17:46:16 GMT 1
Is this the long term strategy? When things get bad or there is some bad news they want to bury, throw a one off lump sum to the entire country? It is - Richard Murphy did quite an interesting piece on Tax Research about some of the assumptions underpinning the last budget, namely that inflation would stay high over the long term meaning the government would need to set aside billions of pounds to repay inflation linked bonds that will probably never actually be used. Whilst I think Murphys view is as overly optimistic as the government's is overly prudent, there's also already thought to have been a windfall from freezing personal allowance thresholds at a time of higher than usual wage inflation. The Ā£400 is likely to be funded by the famous windfall tax on energy companies too. One way of the other it's fairly likely that Rishi has a fair bit more leeway in the budget than he's letting on but rather than he upfront about it they're going to throw us a bone every now and again when it's expedient, safe in the knowledge the people whose vote they're courting will lap it up.
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Post by DiglisShrew on May 26, 2022 17:49:22 GMT 1
I was referring to Johnson, but you in typical Tory fashion deflect from the point and point the finger at someone else. That to me, says that you will turn a blind eye to Johnsonās many deficiencies. The time will come, as it did with Thatcher that the faithful will turn on him and will then be queueing up to stab in the back. woooh there just a sec the thread is about the fuel handout but you not once but twice posted, Ā 'never trust a liar' so I responded to that to remind you that your faith is with another liar you reply suggesting it was ME ! deflecting from the point ? and then you bring Thatcher in to it ?, Ā all whilst conveniently not saying one word about the Liar you support, Ā Ā and you accuse me of turning a blind eyeĀ Ā , Ā as Jargon would say , WOW and if you check back to the time cake gate erupted my opinion was Boris should be sacked so lets get that bit right at least, I judge them all on their own merit that's why I don't do politics, Ā its saves having to become a hypocrite ;-) For someone who ādonāt do politicsā you donāt half post a lot on the subject !! šš
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Post by servernaside on May 26, 2022 17:52:38 GMT 1
āshould haveā doing a lot of the heavy lifting, in what is a matter of opinion. Were you also up in arms in the four tax years since 2013/14 where the arbitrary 2.5% increase applied, gifting boomer pensioners above inflationary increases and widening the generational wealth gap needlessly further still? When the Tories were elected they promised to keep the triple lock. They also promised no tax increases. Whether the promises were the right thing to do or not, the Tories have broken those election promises. Did they also break their promise on no global pandemic and no war in Europe?
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Post by staffordshrew on May 26, 2022 18:02:10 GMT 1
When the Tories were elected they promised to keep the triple lock. They also promised no tax increases. Whether the promises were the right thing to do or not, the Tories have broken those election promises. Did they also break their promise on no global pandemic and no war in Europe? Are we saying world events affect the government? Perhaps you will reappraise Gordon Brown's record then, Tories spent years blaming Labour for an economic downturn when it was a world crisis. I note that now the Tories are quite prepared to sell off chunks of the bank Brown saved for billions and quietly pocket the money.
As for Covid, the fact that the Tories didn't have the NHS prepared for a pandemic in line with a report a few years back is well documented.
Then there is the way Russian money has been accepted by the Tories, never did look right, now it looks like a very big mistake.
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2022 19:42:03 GMT 1
The left "It's a distraction technique and Labour thought of it first" Well letās be honest here, theyāre right arnt they??
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2022 19:46:40 GMT 1
Energy price go up around Ā£1500 so everyone is given around Ā£400 (possibly) all while the big energy firms make an obscene amount of profit. Excuse me if I don't jump for joy. It won't change the fact there will be far too many families choosing between heating there homes or eating. Assuming they are rich enough to have that choice. Don't you just love Tory Britain. There seems to be a complete reliance on government since the Covid pandemic. The government is giving out enormous amounts of money to help people. Make no mistake, the amounts are absolutely enormous. I don't doubt there are families struggling, but find me the ones who don't smoke, drink to excess, have the latest smart phones and multiple TV subscription packages and put them to the front of the queue for everything. It's about priorities, some people's are all over the place. All the above should equally apply to MPs yet theyāve awarded themselves a Ā£4k pay rise this year.
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2022 19:47:49 GMT 1
Of course she won't, nor will anyone else, because it's clearly stated it's not a regular payment.Ā I bet most benefit recipients, rather than pensioners, will just spend it to ensure their kids get what they want for Christmas, maybe those new trainers and clothes, like all the other kids have. Like you stated, it was a Covid uplift, everyone knew Covid wasn't going to be around forever. I think the measures today go about and beyond, they're extraordinary numbers! Extraordinary numbers of our money!
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2022 19:48:28 GMT 1
When the Tories were elected they promised to keep the triple lock.Ā They also promised no tax increases.Ā Whether the promises were the right thing to do or not, the Tories have broken those election promises. Did they also break their promise on no global pandemic and no war in Europe? Were they manifesto pledges?
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Post by Worthingshrew on May 26, 2022 20:25:26 GMT 1
Kier Starmer - Captain Hindsight captain Foresight is more appropriate. it appears that there is a money tree after all, which the Tories said didnāt exist before the last election.
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Post by staffordshrew on May 26, 2022 20:44:21 GMT 1
Kier Starmer - Captain Hindsight captain Foresight is more appropriate. it appears that there is a money tree after all, which the Tories said didnāt exist before the last election. There is no magic money tree, it's the extra money he's taking in VAT because of higher prices on fuel, goods and services, plus not raising tax thresholds, plus suspending the triple lock, plus the odd billion off selling bits of the bank Gordon Brown nationalised to save it, plus a little off the oil companies - not enough to affect the share price - etc. Make no mistake, Sunak is a slippery customer.
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Post by Pilch on May 26, 2022 21:10:40 GMT 1
woooh there just a sec the thread is about the fuel handout but you not once but twice posted, Ā 'never trust a liar' so I responded to that to remind you that your faith is with another liar you reply suggesting it was ME ! deflecting from the point ? and then you bring Thatcher in to it ?, Ā all whilst conveniently not saying one word about the Liar you support, Ā Ā and you accuse me of turning a blind eyeĀ Ā , Ā as Jargon would say , WOW and if you check back to the time cake gate erupted my opinion was Boris should be sacked so lets get that bit right at least, I judge them all on their own merit that's why I don't do politics, Ā its saves having to become a hypocrite ;-) For someone who ādonāt do politicsā you donāt half post a lot on the subject !! šš order order not really , i said he should be sacked on day one of cake gate , all i've done since is act as speaker of the house š
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Post by venceremos on May 26, 2022 21:34:27 GMT 1
Noted & I will correct: More top level making of sweeping generalisations based on anecdotal evidence there. I don't understand this obsession some have with poor people owning technology. You can't function in modern society without a digital identity, it's not the 1970s. Good that you at least recognise there to be some genuine need though. I'm not suggesting people go without technology. There's a difference between a functioning smartphone and a flagship iPhone: Samsung Galaxy A03 128GB - Ā£139 Iphone 13 Pro 128GB - Ā£949 Both phones do social media, email, browsing, banking, apps, storage etc. Again, priorities. Again, anecdotes.
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Post by Chief Inspector Swan on May 27, 2022 0:23:09 GMT 1
I'm not suggesting people go without technology. There's a difference between a functioning smartphone and a flagship iPhone: Samsung Galaxy A03 128GB - Ā£139 Iphone 13 Pro 128GB - Ā£949 Both phones do social media, email, browsing, banking, apps, storage etc. Again, priorities. Again, anecdotes. Just collecting some witness statements here. Are you claiming the price of a Samsung Galaxy A03 and an iPhone 13 Pro are anecdotal?
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