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Post by zenfootball2 on May 19, 2022 17:11:35 GMT 1
whilst thre is a RMT dispute with Network Rail and UK Dft (Department for Transport) operators. and a shortage of drivers across the uk. you would hope the union could recognise the benefit's to its own members of a nationalized railway www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10833741/Nicola-Sturgeon-blames-Boris-Johnson-industrial-dispute-Scotlands-renationalised-train"Nicola Sturgeon tries to blame Boris Johnson for industrial dispute on Scotland's trains that will see 700 services cut EVERY DAY just weeks after she nationalised the rail network ScotRail has said it will cut 700 services from Monday amid driver shortage They are refusing to work on rest days and Sundays to keep the network going Company was taken back into public ownership last month by SNP Government" "Nicola Sturgeon tried to blame Boris Johnson today for an industrial dispute on Scotland's newly renationalised rail network that will see hundreds of services cancelled every day from next week." "The SNP's Fiona Hyslop caused uproar at First Ministers Questions when she asked Ms Sturgeon if she shared 'my concern that events elsewhere in the UK are souring industrial relations here in Scotland and affecting the new beginning of public ownership of Scotland’s railway'." "After the furore died down, Ms Sturgeon replied: 'The situation in Scotland is the responsibility of ScotRail, which of course is now a publicly owned company, so therefore my responsibility and the responsibility of the Government."
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Post by staffordshrew on May 19, 2022 18:03:11 GMT 1
whilst thre is a RMT dispute with Network Rail and UK Dft (Department for Transport) operators. and a shortage of drivers across the uk. you would hope the union could recognise the benefit's to its own members of a nationalized railway www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10833741/Nicola-Sturgeon-blames-Boris-Johnson-industrial-dispute-Scotlands-renationalised-train"Nicola Sturgeon tries to blame Boris Johnson for industrial dispute on Scotland's trains that will see 700 services cut EVERY DAY just weeks after she nationalised the rail network ScotRail has said it will cut 700 services from Monday amid driver shortage They are refusing to work on rest days and Sundays to keep the network going Company was taken back into public ownership last month by SNP Government" "Nicola Sturgeon tried to blame Boris Johnson today for an industrial dispute on Scotland's newly renationalised rail network that will see hundreds of services cancelled every day from next week." "The SNP's Fiona Hyslop caused uproar at First Ministers Questions when she asked Ms Sturgeon if she shared 'my concern that events elsewhere in the UK are souring industrial relations here in Scotland and affecting the new beginning of public ownership of Scotland’s railway'." "After the furore died down, Ms Sturgeon replied: 'The situation in Scotland is the responsibility of ScotRail, which of course is now a publicly owned company, so therefore my responsibility and the responsibility of the Government." Privatisation didn't really go too well on the railways did it?
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Post by gainsparkshrew on May 19, 2022 18:14:26 GMT 1
I understand that it was the SNP who took it back after ongoing and major failures by the franchise holder, who I think may have been Dutch.Highly unlikely to have been British
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Post by zenfootball2 on May 19, 2022 19:13:13 GMT 1
I understand that it was the SNP who took it back after ongoing and major failures by the franchise holder, who I think may have been Dutch.Highly unlikely to have been British are there any british rail franchises apart from Scot rail wich at last is state owned .
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Post by zenfootball2 on May 19, 2022 19:14:25 GMT 1
whilst thre is a RMT dispute with Network Rail and UK Dft (Department for Transport) operators. and a shortage of drivers across the uk. you would hope the union could recognise the benefit's to its own members of a nationalized railway www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10833741/Nicola-Sturgeon-blames-Boris-Johnson-industrial-dispute-Scotlands-renationalised-train"Nicola Sturgeon tries to blame Boris Johnson for industrial dispute on Scotland's trains that will see 700 services cut EVERY DAY just weeks after she nationalised the rail network ScotRail has said it will cut 700 services from Monday amid driver shortage They are refusing to work on rest days and Sundays to keep the network going Company was taken back into public ownership last month by SNP Government" "Nicola Sturgeon tried to blame Boris Johnson today for an industrial dispute on Scotland's newly renationalised rail network that will see hundreds of services cancelled every day from next week." "The SNP's Fiona Hyslop caused uproar at First Ministers Questions when she asked Ms Sturgeon if she shared 'my concern that events elsewhere in the UK are souring industrial relations here in Scotland and affecting the new beginning of public ownership of Scotland’s railway'." "After the furore died down, Ms Sturgeon replied: 'The situation in Scotland is the responsibility of ScotRail, which of course is now a publicly owned company, so therefore my responsibility and the responsibility of the Government." Privatisation didn't really go too well on the railways did it? i use the railways a lot and i know this subject can be divisive but in my view no it has not .
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Post by Pilch on May 19, 2022 21:32:46 GMT 1
I understand that it was the SNP who took it back after ongoing and major failures by the franchise holder, who I think may have been Dutch.Highly unlikely to have been British are there any british rail franchises apart from Scot rail wich at last is state owned . here's a good quiz question for you there was 1 piece of the railway that didn't get privatised what ? no googling
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2022 21:38:06 GMT 1
I was at Crewe station the other Saturday and I didn't realise that there were so many train operating companies!
I spotted 5 and I was only at the station for 40 odd minutes.
Shows you how long it's been since I used the train regularly.
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2022 21:40:47 GMT 1
are there any british rail franchises apart from Scot rail wich at last is state owned . here's a good quiz question for you there was 1 piece of the railway that didn't get privatised what ? no googling Postal services?
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Post by Pilch on May 19, 2022 21:42:35 GMT 1
I was at Crewe station the other Saturday and I didn't realise that there were so many train operating companies! I spotted 5 and I was only at the station for 40 odd minutes. Shows you how long it's been since I used the train regularly. who were the 5 ? you might have spotted a few more in the sidings too
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2022 21:50:39 GMT 1
I was at Crewe station the other Saturday and I didn't realise that there were so many train operating companies! I spotted 5 and I was only at the station for 40 odd minutes. Shows you how long it's been since I used the train regularly. who were the 5 ? you might have spotted a few more in the sidings too Transport for Wales, Arriva, Avanti West coast, a freight train (not sure the company) and Trans Pennine (I think)...
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Post by gainsparkshrew on May 19, 2022 21:51:49 GMT 1
I was at Crewe station the other Saturday and I didn't realise that there were so many train operating companies! I spotted 5 and I was only at the station for 40 odd minutes. Shows you how long it's been since I used the train regularly. who were the 5 ? you might have spotted a few more in the sidings too There where 26 train operating companies (TOCs) back on my day,mid to late 90s
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Post by gainsparkshrew on May 19, 2022 21:52:48 GMT 1
here's a good quiz question for you there was 1 piece of the railway that didn't get privatised what ? no googling Postal services? Come on give us a clue 😀
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Post by staffordshrew on May 19, 2022 22:17:15 GMT 1
are there any british rail franchises apart from Scot rail wich at last is state owned . here's a good quiz question for you there was 1 piece of the railway that didn't get privatised what ? no googling The transport police?
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Post by Pilch on May 19, 2022 22:17:29 GMT 1
who were the 5 ? you might have spotted a few more in the sidings too Transport for Wales, Arriva, Avanti West coast, a freight train (not sure the company) and Trans Pennine (I think)... its the most iconic thing on British railway ;-)
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Post by gainsparkshrew on May 19, 2022 22:45:01 GMT 1
OK got it but TBF I googled it😛
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Post by Pilch on May 19, 2022 23:00:16 GMT 1
OK got it but TBF I googled it😛 I usually listen to frank skinners Saturday podcast during the week, he says NEVER google something that you should or probably should know, it will usually come to you a couple of days later and you'll feel great about getting it and it keeps the brain working, I've followed this for a few years now and its good advice ;-)
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Post by Dale on May 20, 2022 5:55:52 GMT 1
I understand that it was the SNP who took it back after ongoing and major failures by the franchise holder, who I think may have been Dutch.Highly unlikely to have been British are there any british rail franchises apart from Scot rail wich at last is state owned . Transport for Wales is owned by the Welsh government.
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Post by armchairfan on May 20, 2022 10:52:34 GMT 1
It never ceases to amaze/anger/amuse me, to varying degrees, the extent to which some people have an attachment to the nationalised railway which came into being in 1948; certainly, during the sixties, as a government concern, the railways were subjected to attacks from the Left and Right, a stoutly pro-road Dept of Transport in collusion with the road lobby, not to mention the pressure resulting from the resource-demand of other nationalised (and National) obligations. One allegedly Labour intellectual (Tony Crosland) was against ALL investment by government in rail, as he considered that the taxation requirement was "regressive"; Ernest Marples had more than a finger in the road construction industry, certainly, and appointed Richard Beeching to stem rail financial losses by reducing route-mileage with the road industry - cars and lorries - covering the gaps, but there was also disgraceful inter-union warfare (TGWU v NUR and the other railway unions), all of which soured the railways both in Government and Civil Service minds, and importantly, in the minds of the travelling public.
In short, the notion that a renationalisa of the railways would, in and of itself, result in a cheaper/more modern/more efficient network, is unmitigated tosh, and to believe such an idea represents a total lack of understanding of the whole issue. So, please, bear that in mind when framing your contributions.
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Post by kenwood on May 20, 2022 11:01:50 GMT 1
Transport for Wales, Arriva, Avanti West coast, a freight train (not sure the company) and Trans Pennine (I think)... its the most iconic thing on British railway ;-) I’ve got it, the Buffet service . I do like a nice Buffett .😂
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Post by block12massive on May 20, 2022 11:31:52 GMT 1
are there any british rail franchises apart from Scot rail wich at last is state owned . Transport for Wales is owned by the Welsh government. And it shows. A single carriage train from Cardiff to Manchester the morning of the Manchester derby a few weeks ago where anyone trying to alight at any station on route with a pushchair, bike or wheelchair were forced to wait for the next train. £41.00 from Craven Arms to Cardiff and over £10.50 from Craven Arms to Shrewsbury ONE WAY. A similar length journey from Shrewsbury to Manchester is £25.30. I'm only just old enough to remember the pre-privatisation era but lets not pretend it was all bells and whistles when it wasn't.
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Post by Minormorris64 on May 20, 2022 13:01:59 GMT 1
Transport for Wales is owned by the Welsh government. And it shows. A single carriage train from Cardiff to Manchester the morning of the Manchester derby a few weeks ago where anyone trying to alight at any station on route with a pushchair, bike or wheelchair were forced to wait for the next train. £41.00 from Craven Arms to Cardiff and over £10.50 from Craven Arms to Shrewsbury ONE WAY. A similar length journey from Shrewsbury to Manchester is £25.30. I'm only just old enough to remember the pre-privatisation era but lets not pretend it was all bells and whistles when it wasn't. Shrewsbury to Cardiff open return £63 Stayed for four nights, how much to drive and 4 nights parking a damn sight more than £63 so I would say that rail travel properly planned and researched is more than reasonably priced
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Post by zenfootball2 on May 20, 2022 13:25:43 GMT 1
are there any british rail franchises apart from Scot rail wich at last is state owned . Transport for Wales is owned by the Welsh government. how on earth did i forget that !!!!!!!!!
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Post by zenfootball2 on May 20, 2022 13:28:47 GMT 1
Transport for Wales is owned by the Welsh government. And it shows. A single carriage train from Cardiff to Manchester the morning of the Manchester derby a few weeks ago where anyone trying to alight at any station on route with a pushchair, bike or wheelchair were forced to wait for the next train. £41.00 from Craven Arms to Cardiff and over £10.50 from Craven Arms to Shrewsbury ONE WAY. A similar length journey from Shrewsbury to Manchester is £25.30. I'm only just old enough to remember the pre-privatisation era but lets not pretend it was all bells and whistles when it wasn't. i agree that hte state owned railway had issues and problems b ut not on the scale the private ones do and yes we had price hikes especially after the 70's jump in crude oil but for some tme it seems every time i go on a train the tickets have gone up.
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Post by Minormorris64 on May 20, 2022 14:17:18 GMT 1
Transport for Wales is owned by the Welsh government. And it shows. A single carriage train from Cardiff to Manchester the morning of the Manchester derby a few weeks ago where anyone trying to alight at any station on route with a pushchair, bike or wheelchair were forced to wait for the next train. £41.00 from Craven Arms to Cardiff and over £10.50 from Craven Arms to Shrewsbury ONE WAY. A similar length journey from Shrewsbury to Manchester is £25.30. I'm only just old enough to remember the pre-privatisation era but lets not pretend it was all bells and whistles when it wasn't. Shrewsbury to Cardiff open return £63 Stayed for four nights, how much to drive and 4 nights parking a damn sight more than £63 so I would say that rail travel properly planned and researched is more than reasonably priced
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Post by armchairfan on May 20, 2022 14:39:28 GMT 1
And it shows. A single carriage train from Cardiff to Manchester the morning of the Manchester derby a few weeks ago where anyone trying to alight at any station on route with a pushchair, bike or wheelchair were forced to wait for the next train. £41.00 from Craven Arms to Cardiff and over £10.50 from Craven Arms to Shrewsbury ONE WAY. A similar length journey from Shrewsbury to Manchester is £25.30. I'm only just old enough to remember the pre-privatisation era but lets not pretend it was all bells and whistles when it wasn't. i agree that hte state owned railway had issues and problems b ut not on the scale the private ones do and yes we had price hikes especially after the 70's jump in crude oil but for some tme it seems every time i go on a train the tickets have gone up. I have to disagree strongly with your assertion that the "issues and problems" - an all-inclusive and vague expression - are greater now under a semi-privatised system of Network Rail + the various TOCs; the problems, such as they are, are different, and certainly more complex, but despite it all, our railways now possess the safest and most modern rolling stock that they have EVER had. Has there been waste - yes; could things be done differently - probably; but the taking back of Great British Railways into public ownership is not the answer - such an expensive and foolish move would simply set us on the track (pun intended) of repeating the damaging errors of 50 and 60 years ago, in my opinion.
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Post by block12massive on May 20, 2022 14:47:04 GMT 1
And it shows. A single carriage train from Cardiff to Manchester the morning of the Manchester derby a few weeks ago where anyone trying to alight at any station on route with a pushchair, bike or wheelchair were forced to wait for the next train. £41.00 from Craven Arms to Cardiff and over £10.50 from Craven Arms to Shrewsbury ONE WAY. A similar length journey from Shrewsbury to Manchester is £25.30. I'm only just old enough to remember the pre-privatisation era but lets not pretend it was all bells and whistles when it wasn't. Shrewsbury to Cardiff open return £63 Stayed for four nights, how much to drive and 4 nights parking a damn sight more than £63 so I would say that tail travel properly planned and researched is more than reasonably priced I'm normally the first to plan ahead and see what bargains I can snag but the real world doesn't really work like that. Obviously it's not just TFW who are guilty of extortionate fares but to think that a return to public ownership would make it more affordable and improve reliability is 'pie in the sky' thinking.
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Post by armchairfan on May 25, 2022 15:17:28 GMT 1
Whilst not related to Scotland specifically, the news today of the overwhelming support for industrial action by NUR members, whatever the reason may be, fulls me with horror; have not these people learned of the damage caused by, for example, the national stoppages of earlier years, especially the ASLEF one in, I think, 1955? The resultant permanent loss of income to the railways was in no small part a contributory factor in the (mis)managed decline of the railway system in the following decades.
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Post by zenfootball2 on May 25, 2022 15:25:34 GMT 1
Shrewsbury to Cardiff open return £63 Stayed for four nights, how much to drive and 4 nights parking a damn sight more than £63 so I would say that tail travel properly planned and researched is more than reasonably priced I'm normally the first to plan ahead and see what bargains I can snag but the real world doesn't really work like that. Obviously it's not just TFW who are guilty of extortionate fares but to think that a return to public ownership would make it more affordable and improve reliability is 'pie in the sky' thinking. i dont look at a return to public ownership through rose tintted glasses and unfortently i suspect fairer rail tickets at reasonable price would not happen but equally you would not get the scenario of franchises runing down services when they lose hte franchise or see the money from fares going to foreign owned companys who's priority is to move the money abroad rather than improve services.
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Post by zenfootball2 on May 25, 2022 15:33:26 GMT 1
Whilst not related to Scotland specifically, the news today of the overwhelming support for industrial action by NUR members, whatever the reason may be, fulls me with horror; have not these people learned of the damage caused by, for example, the national stoppages of earlier years, especially the ASLEF one in, I think, 1955? The resultant permanent loss of income to the railways was in no small part a contributory factor in the (mis)managed decline of the railway system in the following decades. when the railways were privatized many companies were concerned about the cost of industrial action, so if you have a franchise that is not sensible or just wonts to play hard ball htey still get paid and dont lose out. www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/may/08/from-blacklist-to-boardroom-mick-lynch-the-rail-leader-gearing-up-for-a-new-battle
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Post by armchairfan on May 25, 2022 15:43:44 GMT 1
I'm normally the first to plan ahead and see what bargains I can snag but the real world doesn't really work like that. Obviously it's not just TFW who are guilty of extortionate fares but to think that a return to public ownership would make it more affordable and improve reliability is 'pie in the sky' thinking. i dont look at a return to public ownership through rose tintted glasses and unfortently i suspect fairer rail tickets at reasonable price would not happen but equally you would not get the scenario of franchises runing down services when they lose hte franchise or see the money from fares going to foreign owned companys who's priority is to move the money abroad rather than improve services. In part, I accept that, but I'm not sure that there is evidence of (TOCs) "running down services when they lose the franchise - indeed that would be a breach of the franchise, for which there are penalties, as proven recently with one TOC; the running down of services was a practice employed by BR in the sixties and seventies, to the degree that the elimination of many routes and services became a self-fulfilling prophecy. The clarion-cry has, for years, been that the user of a service (the passenger in this instance) should pay the greater part of the cost of providing that service: looked at crudely, I can understand ( though not agree with) Tony Crosland's aversion to those costs being borne by the general taxpayers.
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