|
Post by shropshirelad42 on Jun 13, 2021 14:00:53 GMT 1
No2 & No3 batters are definitely a problem.
Lyth is averaging around 60, so maybe give him another go. I thought he was discarded too soon anyway. Libby is a good County player, but unsure if he is International class !! One good season doesn't assume he is a Test match player. Hameed, possibly !! but do not want him to come back into contention too soon - although he may go to Aus - as it could end up with him being dropped again, and after two droppings there is very rarely a way back.
I remember watching the 'young' Root open and always thought he was the 'real deal', but alas cannot see him reverting back to it. Bairstow & Hildreth (the forgotten man) are certainly better than Sibley & Crawley. Only in my opinion of course.
As others have said...... It's got to be sorted quickly, before the Ashes squad is decided. Bumble and Ward did 'suggest' yesterday that some of them are overcoached and that they should go back to the way that they batted which enabled them to get into the Test squad in the first place. Why tamper with a technique that is working even if it isn't perfect ?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2021 20:09:46 GMT 1
I see Dawid Malan has been suggested for a possible return. I'm not sure to be honest.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2021 20:14:44 GMT 1
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2021 20:25:35 GMT 1
Lays the blame fairly and squarely at the door of the ECB and quite right too. I know I've said it before but test cricket for England doesn't just start and end with the Ashes. We should be respecting all our opponents and our paying customers.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2021 20:43:21 GMT 1
Hameed to open is an option but otherwise who else is there to come in unless they bring back Bairstow as a batsman? Joe Clarke? But clearly the ECB might find his past history a little too difficult to come to terms with. Great knock from him today, albeit in the wrong format 😉
|
|
|
Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Jun 13, 2021 22:01:06 GMT 1
“Overcoached”? Are they told to waft airily at balls wide of the off stump? If so we need new coaches who are able to explain that test cricket is played over 5 days and not 20 overs.
|
|
|
Post by Minormorris64 on Jun 14, 2021 9:13:16 GMT 1
Hameed to open is an option but otherwise who else is there to come in unless they bring back Bairstow as a batsman? Joe Clarke? But clearly the ECB might find his past history a little too difficult to come to terms with. The sporting under statement of 2021 won in June by your good self.
|
|
|
Post by northwestman on Jun 14, 2021 10:03:35 GMT 1
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2021 10:23:28 GMT 1
“Overcoached”? Are they told to waft airily at balls wide of the off stump? If so we need new coaches who are able to explain that test cricket is played over 5 days and not 20 overs. I do think part of the problem is some pundits/cricket supporters who are hypocrites in the sense that they want to see old fashioned test batsmen, but then complain when players are too slow/defensive . I was at the first day, at lunch I think we were about 70 for 0, it was a solid if not spectacular start but there were people complaining about not scoring enough. Of course a few players get out for trying more attacking shots and are then criticised for not being patient enough. In terms of over coaching, that has been something that has been labelled at England coaching for many years, for both batting & bowling in that we are trying to improve/perfect techniques. I've heard various stories of players ditching these improvements and going back to their natural game, would be interesting to see how many times that has happened.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2021 11:41:44 GMT 1
No2 & No3 batters are definitely a problem. Lyth is averaging around 60, so maybe give him another go. I thought he was discarded too soon anyway. Libby is a good County player, but unsure if he is International class !! One good season doesn't assume he is a Test match player. Hameed, possibly !! but do not want him to come back into contention too soon - although he may go to Aus - as it could end up with him being dropped again, and after two droppings there is very rarely a way back. I remember watching the 'young' Root open and always thought he was the 'real deal', but alas cannot see him reverting back to it. Bairstow & Hildreth (the forgotten man) are certainly better than Sibley & Crawley. Only in my opinion of course. As others have said...... It's got to be sorted quickly, before the Ashes squad is decided. Bumble and Ward did 'suggest' yesterday that some of them are overcoached and that they should go back to the way that they batted which enabled them to get into the Test squad in the first place. Why tamper with a technique that is working even if it isn't perfect ? I was just having a quick look at the current first class batting averages, not much to choose from at the moment but it doesn't help that none of the IPL lot have played any red ball cricket so far this season.
|
|
|
Post by northwestman on Jun 14, 2021 12:00:26 GMT 1
|
|
|
Post by Minormorris64 on Jun 14, 2021 12:06:22 GMT 1
I reckon Clarke could average 100 in the CC and they still won't touch him with a barge pole.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2021 12:06:39 GMT 1
Trouble is he wants to play for South Africa...
|
|
|
Post by shropshirelad42 on Jun 14, 2021 17:50:44 GMT 1
Being able to judge batsmen to be of Test match standard is of course quite difficult. Years ago Gower, Edrich, Gatting, Gooch et al were actually facing Test match bowlers in the County Championship. Today Test match bowlers play very little County Championship cricket. This is a big part of where we are getting it wrong. Lots of Test bowlers in Aus, for instance, play Shield cricket. Hence their up and coming batsmen can show if they are good enough or not.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2021 8:25:18 GMT 1
Being able to judge batsmen to be of Test match standard is of course quite difficult. Years ago Gower, Edrich, Gatting, Gooch et al were actually facing Test match bowlers in the County Championship. Today Test match bowlers play very little County Championship cricket. This is a big part of where we are getting it wrong. Lots of Test bowlers in Aus, for instance, play Shield cricket. Hence their up and coming batsmen can show if they are good enough or not. Definitely. Growing up in the 70s I remember the County Championship full of quality international stars, Hadlee, Rice, Richards Viv and Barry, Procter, Roberts, Garner, Lloyd, Kallicharran, Mcewan...the list was endless. The County Championship was the prestige competition, it came first. At the same time the visiting tourists would play county teams and these would be full strength teams. When Geoff Boycott returned to play against Australia he already had a hundred playing for Yorkshire against the tourists earlier in the season. Those days sadly are now long gone. The step up from County to test cricket is now even harder, the ECB sadly has a lot to answer for.
|
|
|
Post by northwestman on Jun 15, 2021 9:30:12 GMT 1
Having virtually no 1st class cricket until the end of August because of the T20, 50 overs competition and The Hundred doesn't help much either.
|
|
|
Post by northwestman on Jun 15, 2021 10:30:38 GMT 1
England have learnt the hard way that you do not muck about with Test-match cricket. It is the hardest and most unforgiving format of the game.
You just cannot keep swapping and changing personnel. The history of Test cricket shows you success comes from the collective being together for many series. Once they started to rotate the Test team in Sri Lanka, I worried it would have a lasting detrimental effect.
Eventually you become a good team over a long period of time. You do not do it by bringing players together series by series.
It is madness that Trent Boult went home from the Indian Premier League when it was halted last month because of Covid-19, flew 10,000 miles to the UK and played at Edgbaston, while Chris Woakes lives five miles up the road in Birmingham and was not playing.
I hear about too many players pulling out of games and not playing.
There are Yorkshire players pulling out of the Friday night Blast game this week to join up with England on Saturday. Why? What is it about cricket they don’t like? Why would you not want to play a Twenty20 on a Friday night? They should be made to play. They are not part-timers. They are full-time professionals. These are the best years of their lives, they are doing the best job in the world and something they are good at: playing cricket.
But the tone has been set at the top, with England players resting from too many Test matches this year. It makes it OK for others to think: “I don’t need to play.”
Michael Vaughan - Daily Telegraph.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2021 12:27:17 GMT 1
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2021 18:54:18 GMT 1
|
|
|
Post by shropshirelad42 on Jun 15, 2021 19:13:02 GMT 1
That's terrible. If it had been a one-off 'mens' Test I'd lay a penny to a pound that they would have found an unused strip, somewhere !!
|
|
|
Post by LetchworthShrew on Jun 18, 2021 11:40:47 GMT 1
The WTC start delayed, just seen some footage from Soton and it is very soggy, seagulls paddling in the outfield!!
|
|
|
Post by LetchworthShrew on Jun 18, 2021 11:50:58 GMT 1
Meanwhile in Bristol on Day 3 .... England 1st innings 397-9 dec India were 167-0 but have slumped to 199-8 still 48 needed to avoid the follow on.
---
India 231, 165 behind. England enforce the follow on.
--- Lunch India 29-1
Been light rain this moring, Not yet resumed after lunch
|
|
|
Post by Minormorris64 on Jun 18, 2021 15:06:57 GMT 1
|
|
|
Post by northwestman on Jun 18, 2021 15:29:54 GMT 1
Words fail me! He's surely got no chance of representing England if he's found guilty of this, though admittedly his chances were pretty slim before. Affray has a maximum of 3 years imprisonment, and sentencing guidelines suggest either imprisonment or at the very least a lengthy community order.
|
|
|
Post by Minormorris64 on Jun 18, 2021 16:22:55 GMT 1
Words fail me! He's surely got no chance of representing England if he's found guilty of this, though admittedly his chances were pretty slim before. Affray has a maximum of 3 years imprisonment, and sentencing guidelines suggest either imprisonment or at the very least a lengthy community order. I'm sure the Clarke family are all very proud of their "boys" ?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2021 17:46:18 GMT 1
The WTC start delayed, just seen some footage from Soton and it is very soggy, seagulls paddling in the outfield!! No play possible on the first day. A least they have a reserve day, if needed.
|
|
|
Post by shropshirelad42 on Jun 19, 2021 10:06:00 GMT 1
Words fail me! He's surely got no chance of representing England if he's found guilty of this, though admittedly his chances were pretty slim before. Affray has a maximum of 3 years imprisonment, and sentencing guidelines suggest either imprisonment or at the very least a lengthy community order. I'm sure the Clarke family are all very proud of their "boys" ? Best not to pre judge before the whole story comes out !! How many times do we hear of well known people being provoked when all they want is a quiet night out ? I lived near Trefonen for over 20 years and never heard anything bad about the family.
|
|
|
Post by northwestman on Jun 19, 2021 10:40:35 GMT 1
I'm sure the Clarke family are all very proud of their "boys" ? Best not to pre judge before the whole story comes out !! How many times do we hear of well known people being provoked when all they want is a quiet night out ? I lived near Trefonen for over 20 years and never heard anything bad about the family. The trouble is that with the trial likely to take place in the Crown Court, there is already a serious backlog of cases which will mean that it will presumably take some considerable time before his case is heard. Clarke has already experienced delays in the Courts system. His former colleague, Alex Hepburn, was charged with rape in November 2017, but his trial only took place in January 2019 and the retrial in April 2019. Clarke was of course a key witness in the case. On the 21 June 2019, the English Cricket Board charged Joe Clarke and Tom Kohler-Cadmore with bringing the game into disrepute in relation to their participation in the group actions which saw Alex Hepburn found guilty of rape. On the 4 July 2019, both players pleaded guilty to the charge and were reprimanded and fined. So Clarke had to wait over 18 months before finding out how the ECB were going to deal with him. He might have to face a similar lengthy delay this time.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2021 21:58:55 GMT 1
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 20, 2021 12:20:45 GMT 1
|
|