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Post by Valerioch on Oct 27, 2021 11:07:37 GMT 1
We all want normality , I do more than most , but yesterday we had the most deaths for 8 months , that is a fact , an astonishing number have died since many were giggling about covid being over and single figure deaths some people are either stupid , selfish , ignorant or don’t have a conscience or any morals Or all 5 Like it or lump it You’ve successfully described 90% of those who are unvaccinated 👍🏼 They’re the issue here, not me or you and our different opinions
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Oct 27, 2021 11:20:05 GMT 1
We all want normality , I do more than most , but yesterday we had the most deaths for 8 months , that is a fact , an astonishing number have died since many were giggling about covid being over and single figure deaths some people are either stupid , selfish , ignorant or don’t have a conscience or any morals Or all 5 Like it or lump it 1 - Its true we had the highest number of deaths recorded for 8 months. You are correct. 2 - there is a reason for that as highlighted in my response to your post. Ie a delay on reporting for a few days. 3 - the obvious answer is to look at the 7 day average at all times (this is going down a little, whether you chose to like that or not). 4 - the media only give you the headlines they want you to believe. And you still dont see through it. 5 - and Ricketts was still a manager. So get over it 😀 😇
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Oct 27, 2021 11:27:47 GMT 1
I’m interested in where the figure of 50% of over 50s having had the booster comes from. I don’t know of anyone other than clinically vulnerable or NHS staff who have had one. I’m 74 and mine is a week Saturday, my wife is 69 and hasn’t had an invite, neither has my 78 year old BiL.
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Post by Valerioch on Oct 27, 2021 11:29:52 GMT 1
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Post by Pilch on Oct 27, 2021 11:35:54 GMT 1
We all want normality , I do more than most , but yesterday we had the most deaths for 8 months , that is a fact , an astonishing number have died since many were giggling about covid being over and single figure deaths some people are either stupid , selfish , ignorant or don’t have a conscience or any morals Or all 5 Like it or lump it 1 - Its true we had the highest number of deaths recorded for 8 months. You are correct. 2 - there is a reason for that as highlighted in my response to your post. Ie a delay on reporting for a few days. 3 - the obvious answer is to look at the 7 day average at all times (this is going down a little, whether you chose to like that or not). 4 - the media only give you the headlines they want you to believe. And you still dont see through it. 5 - and Ricketts was still a manager. So get over it 😀 😇 He’s still making jokes when we are discussing deaths Pretty obvious you qualify for all 5 of my points
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Oct 27, 2021 12:06:35 GMT 1
1 - Its true we had the highest number of deaths recorded for 8 months. You are correct. 2 - there is a reason for that as highlighted in my response to your post. Ie a delay on reporting for a few days. 3 - the obvious answer is to look at the 7 day average at all times (this is going down a little, whether you chose to like that or not). 4 - the media only give you the headlines they want you to believe. And you still dont see through it. 5 - and Ricketts was still a manager. So get over it 😀 😇 He’s still making jokes when we are discussing deaths Pretty obvious you qualify for all 5 of my points If I had called another poster all 5 of those things I would probably had a message threatening a ban. Just saying like 😉
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Post by martinshrew on Oct 27, 2021 12:10:07 GMT 1
We all want normality , I do more than most , but yesterday we had the most deaths for 8 months , that is a fact , an astonishing number have died since many were giggling about covid being over and single figure deaths some people are either stupid , selfish , ignorant or don’t have a conscience or any morals Or all 5 Like it or lump it I admire your passionate posting, but you have to play it both ways. It's strikes me you're a bit black or white, there's no middle ground or room for change. To you, Covid is catastrophic. There is no way it can improve, it's just catastrophic. Yes there was a high number of deaths, but there was a technical lag behind it. Cases on a week by week are looking like they may start to tail off. The booster programme is picking up, more 11+ are getting vaccinated. Like someone pointed out, me, you and the rest of the vaccinated population along with whatever opinion we hold aren't the issue. It's not irresponsible to go to the pub, eat out, go on holiday and essentially do what you want providing you don't have symptoms of Covid. People who are unvaccinated are the issue here. I send my huge sympathy to the family of those who have passed that stepped up to the plate, were double vaccinated and unfortunately lost their lives. The less said about the unvaccinated the better.
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Oct 27, 2021 12:12:56 GMT 1
We all want normality , I do more than most , but yesterday we had the most deaths for 8 months , that is a fact , an astonishing number have died since many were giggling about covid being over and single figure deaths some people are either stupid , selfish , ignorant or don’t have a conscience or any morals Or all 5 Like it or lump it I admire your passionate posting, but you have to play it both ways. It's strikes me you're a bit black or white, there's no middle ground or room for change. To you, Covid is catastrophic. There is no way it can improve, it's just catastrophic. Yes there was a high number of deaths, but there was a technical lag behind it. Cases on a week by week are looking like they may start to tail off. The booster programme is picking up, more 11+ are getting vaccinated. Like someone pointed out, me, you and the rest of the vaccinated population along with whatever opinion we hold aren't the issue. It's not irresponsible to go to the pub, eat out, go on holiday and essentially do what you want providing you don't have symptoms of Covid. People who are unvaccinated are the issue here. I send my huge sympathy to the family of those who have passed that stepped up to the plate, were double vaccinated and unfortunately lost their lives. The less said about the unvaccinated the better. Absolutely spot on (again).
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Post by Pilch on Oct 27, 2021 12:13:34 GMT 1
He’s still making jokes when we are discussing deaths Pretty obvious you qualify for all 5 of my points If I had called another poster all 5 of those things I would probably had a message threatening a ban. Just saying like 😉 Yeah well don’t say , I’m not in the mood for joking about death this week Take the hint
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Post by South Stand Salopian on Oct 27, 2021 12:14:57 GMT 1
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Post by Minormorris64 on Oct 27, 2021 12:20:17 GMT 1
The moving average week to week is the more relevant figure or even a 2 week/ 4 week moving average would obviously give a more relevant picture.
Its a bit like looking at a gate at the Meadow for a League game being 4996 but then the following week you have a home FA Cup game against Premier opposition and get 9600, looking at those two figures to gain an impression of an ongoing average is irrelevant, the relevant figure would be using League attendances over 4 games, 8 games, 12 games or a season
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2021 12:35:02 GMT 1
Why do people think 'the media' is one homogeneous entity?
Do the Telegraph and The Mirror have the same take on things? Do Private Eye and The Spectator? The Sun and The Morning Star?
Anyone who claims some sort of conspiracy across all outlets of the 'MSM' is not to be taken seriously.
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Oct 27, 2021 13:11:33 GMT 1
The figures don’t add up. 5.1 million people have had boosters but the UK population over 50 is about 21 million, so 50% is 10 million. Also, a proportion of those who have had boosters are under 50, front line NHS for example. At my age I know a lot of people in their 70s and non of them have had boosters. The only person I know who has is a nephew who is 40 and NHS front line. Hve I missed something or is this ‘fake news’?
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Oct 27, 2021 13:33:04 GMT 1
We all want normality , I do more than most , but yesterday we had the most deaths for 8 months , that is a fact , an astonishing number have died since many were giggling about covid being over and single figure deaths some people are either stupid , selfish , ignorant or don’t have a conscience or any morals Or all 5 Like it or lump it People who are unvaccinated are the issue here. I send my huge sympathy to the family of those who have passed that stepped up to the plate, were double vaccinated and unfortunately lost their lives. The less said about the unvaccinated the better. But I gather it is still the elderly and the vulnerable who are still making up the majority of those who have unfortunately lost their life to Covid? What is the percentage of those who have been vaccinated and those who have not been vaccinated among those who have died? As I would have thought the vaccination uptake would be much higher in the elderly and vulnerable (those who make up the majority of those who unfortunately die due to catching the virus)? I've had my two jabs. Would recommend people to do so too. But I just wonder about the criticism towards those who haven't been vaccinated. I mean do we know how much those who are unvaccinated under the age of say 75, 80 are making up the numbers when it comes to those who have required hospital treatment or lost their lives? Is that information available? As I just wonder just how much of an issue people who have not been vaccinated are...
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Post by Valerioch on Oct 27, 2021 13:35:21 GMT 1
The figures don’t add up. 5.1 million people have had boosters but the UK population over 50 is about 21 million, so 50% is 10 million. Also, a proportion of those who have had boosters are under 50, front line NHS for example. At my age I know a lot of people in their 70s and non of them have had boosters. The only person I know who has is a nephew who is 40 and NHS front line. Hve I missed something or is this ‘fake news’? Maybe - I didn’t think of it in any depth but you make good points
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Oct 27, 2021 13:39:15 GMT 1
Why do people think 'the media' is one homogeneous entity? Do the Telegraph and The Mirror have the same take on things? Do Private Eye and The Spectator? The Sun and The Morning Star? Anyone who claims some sort of conspiracy across all outlets of the 'MSM' is not to be taken seriously. No of course they dont always have the same take on things. But where they are all similar is that they all try to outdo each other for headlines and very often they go way ott to get the best headline. And in doing so they totally skew the overall situation. And a lot of the minions hang on every word they read from the media (sadly).
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Post by zenfootball2 on Oct 27, 2021 13:45:59 GMT 1
We all want normality , I do more than most , but yesterday we had the most deaths for 8 months , that is a fact , an astonishing number have died since many were giggling about covid being over and single figure deaths some people are either stupid , selfish , ignorant or don’t have a conscience or any morals Or all 5 Like it or lump it You’ve successfully described 90% of those who are unvaccinated 👍🏼 They’re the issue here, not me or you and our different opinions "You’ve successfully described 90% of those who are unvaccinated" very true as i posted previously the consultent in a west sussex hospital said in a pressinterview that all the ventilators were in use on non vaccinated people with covid and surgery was having to be cancelled, imagine you had nearly two years were your surgery wad on hold you are givine a date only to have it cancelled due this happening. whilst i apreciate that some people due to specific conditions cant get vaccinated the rest are due to a life choice, it seems it takes been on a ventilator and nearly dying for them to admitt they made a mistake.
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Post by zenfootball2 on Oct 27, 2021 13:49:52 GMT 1
People who are unvaccinated are the issue here. I send my huge sympathy to the family of those who have passed that stepped up to the plate, were double vaccinated and unfortunately lost their lives. The less said about the unvaccinated the better. But I gather it is still the elderly and the vulnerable who are still making up the majority of those who have unfortunately lost their life to Covid? What is the percentage of those who have been vaccinated and those who have not been vaccinated among those who have died? As I would have thought the vaccination uptake would be much higher in the elderly and vulnerable (those who make up the majority of those who unfortunately die due to catching the virus)? I've had my two jabs. Would recommend people to do so too. But I just wonder about the criticism towards those who haven't been vaccinated. I mean do we know how much those who are unvaccinated under the age of say 75, 80 are making up the numbers when it comes to those who have required hospital treatment or lost their lives? Is that information available? As I just wonder just how much of an issue people who have not been vaccinated are... all good points and you would hope with hte amount of data they have collected the information must be there, a bit back i saw a sky news report and in it of the people who had been vaccinated and ended up in hospital most admiison lasted up to 4 days and non vaccinated were in longer and had more sever symptoms
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Oct 27, 2021 15:00:18 GMT 1
Why do people think 'the media' is one homogeneous entity? Do the Telegraph and The Mirror have the same take on things? Do Private Eye and The Spectator? The Sun and The Morning Star? Anyone who claims some sort of conspiracy across all outlets of the 'MSM' is not to be taken seriously. No of course they dont always have the same take on things. But where they are all similar is that they all try to outdo each other for headlines and very often they go way ott to get the best headline. And in doing so they totally skew the overall situation. And a lot of the minions hang on every word they read from the media (sadly). Unlike t’interweb where only rational, informed opinion is found.
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Post by northwestman on Oct 27, 2021 15:31:04 GMT 1
Covid, the capacious cloak of unaccountability that magically covers up all the NHS’s manifold deficiencies. Covid, which allows the British Medical Association, a far-Left militant trade union, to claim GPs are being “bullied” into seeing the same number of patients they somehow managed to see in person before the pandemic. That’s the morally inert BMA which thinks it’s legitimate to ballot GPs on industrial action after Health Secretary Sajid Javid had the cheek to ask them to do their jobs, pretty please. And here’s another £250 million to bribe you to do the work for which you are already so handsomely rewarded!
I ask you, what kind of doctor would consider going on strike during a devastating pandemic when thousands of people are still walking around with undiagnosed cancers?
They know they can get away with such behaviour because our chronically understaffed, criminally over-managed, unfit-for-purpose NHS is the “envy of the world”. God forbid any health minister should begin a speech without a heartfelt encomium to its quasi-divine status. Was it Nigel Lawson who said the NHS was the closest thing Britain had to a national religion? Electoral suicide to try and reform it, or so they say. For the people love “our NHS”, even though, during the pandemic, it was our NHS that shut non-Covid services other countries managed to keep open, almost certainly leading to thousands of premature deaths. Even though it was our NHS which block-purchased private hospital capacity at an estimated cost of £400 million a month – and failed to use two-thirds of it even when surgeons I knew were pleading to be allowed to operate.
And that’s not the worst aspect of this revered institution. Like some Soviet-era ministry, the NHS pumps out misinformation which obscures its woeful productivity and its feather bedded executive class, safe in the knowledge that no politician will dare call them out.
Here’s a sobering thought for you. The UK spending per person on healthcare is above the OECD average. And yet we manage to have fewer doctors and nurses than most well-off countries, one of the lowest hospital beds-per-capita and a standard of in-patient care that leaves most of us just grateful to get out alive. What the hell are they doing with all those billions?
As for all this lobbying for Plan B, it’s outrageous. The NHS seems to think it can have its cake and eat the people who provided the cake. As the exasperated Tory MP Mark Harper put it in the Commons: “The NHS is given billions more, and then sends out representatives who want to shut down our economy to manage their pressures.”
Allison Pearson - Daily Telegraph.
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Post by northwestman on Oct 27, 2021 15:39:38 GMT 1
The early paucity of proper protective equipment for front-line health workers was a scandal and the rush to plug the gaps led to questionable procurement procedures, though they could be justified by the emergency.
What is harder to fathom is the incompetence that beset the NHS Test and Trace (NHST&T) programme which, before the vaccine came along, was intended to be the main line of defence against the virus, obviating the need to lock down. The amounts of money thrown at the regime are stupefying. Some £37 billion – equivalent to 20 per cent of NHS England’s entire annual budget – was handed over, to little discernible benefit.
The expenditure might have been acceptable had the scheme achieved even a modicum of success in suppressing the virus and helping to ease controls. But as the Commons Public Accounts Committee (PAC) reports, it was not only “muddled, overstated and eye-wateringly expensive” but it “failed in its main objective”. Only 96 million of 691 million lateral flow tests distributed by NHST&T have been registered – 14 per cent of the total. The committee says “it is not clear what benefit the remaining 595 million tests have secured”.
The rationale behind the system was to avert another lockdown and yet it failed to do so. Under pressure last Christmas and at Easter its performance collapsed, with only 17 per cent of people receiving tests within 24 hours in December 2020. The agency has not used most of the capacity for which it had paid and continued to employ expensive consultants well into this year, even though the vaccine was making the system redundant.
With almost 90 per cent of the population receiving at least one jab against the disease, it is difficult to understand why this operation continues, since the purpose for which it was established has been superseded by the vaccine. Mass testing of mostly healthy people is an intrusive, pointless and expensive exercise.
Daily Telegraph.
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Post by northwestman on Oct 27, 2021 15:44:25 GMT 1
The sheer waste is devastating. More than £3bn was thrown at laboratory capacity to process PCR tests, but most of it went unused. Only 14 per cent of the lateral flow tests sent out had results registered. We have no idea what happened to the other 600 million. At the outset, SAGE said that for the system to work, no more than 48 hours should elapse between identifying a case and their contacts starting to isolate. Yet it nine months before just 80 per cent of contacts were being traced within three days.
It’s particularly galling that so much money was wasted on consultants. If there’s one thing consultants are good at, it’s selling themselves and promising the earth. But that’s where good government comes in – spotting those who will deliver, and those who’ll take the money and sit back. Sadly, no such sound judgment appears to have been used. Less than half of the 2,000 tracing staff hired were ever in use at any one time. In February, just 11 per cent of them were gainfully occupied, the rest being free to have a snooze. Yet they were each being paid an average of more than £1,000 per day, and some got £6,000 per day. Nice work if you can get it.
Under this supposedly Conservative government, the country is spending money like it’s going out of fashion, with the inevitable result that the tax burden is higher than at any time since the 1940s. That’s bad enough. But when we now find that our hard-earned cash is being thrown away so carelessly, we have a right to ask what on earth’s going on.
Daily Telegraph.
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Post by zenfootball2 on Oct 27, 2021 16:35:35 GMT 1
www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/sailing-kiwi-yachting-great-sir-russell-coutts-accuses-government-of-dictatorship-in-social-media-post/UC7WOEFFRHR36TSDXJQ4PXX4C4/"Kiwi sailing great and America's Cup hero Sir Russell Coutts has launched a stinging attack on the Government, accusing it of turning into a " dictatorship". In a Facebook post on Wednesday, the 59-year-old Olympic gold medallist and five-times America's Cup winner claims Kiwis have been stripped of certain freedoms by the New Zealand government and media. "The fact is that people are living with Covid offshore and although some people, perhaps many, rightly remain cautious, life has largely returned to normal in many places. But that is not what we are being told here in New Zealand," Coutts said." "The sweeping mandate, announced by Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern on Tuesday, will see workers in the hospitality and other sectors given four weeks to get jabbed or risk losing their jobs."
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Post by zenfootball2 on Oct 27, 2021 16:40:02 GMT 1
www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/covid-19-delta-outbreak-how-will-the-rest-of-this-outbreak-play-out/FVVNT3S5F66F53LMP4GJCDL7HA/"As at today, when another 68 cases were confirmed within Auckland, the region's full coverage had risen to 78 per cent – with 90 per cent of eligible residents now having received their first dose. Based on local vaccination data and bookings, the modellers estimated that vaccination would have brought down the outbreak's effective reproduction (Reff) number – or the average number of cases produced from one infection – by 67 per cent by early January, compared to an unvaccinated population. The modelling assumed that level 3 controls were held in place throughout the period they analysed, that the virus-blocking effect of the restrictions didn't weaken over time, and that contact tracers could manage 1000 active cases. It also explored two scenarios for the future of the outbreak: one with low levels of spread, and another with rampant transmission."
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Post by davycrockett on Oct 27, 2021 16:46:00 GMT 1
I’m interested in where the figure of 50% of over 50s having had the booster comes from. I don’t know of anyone other than clinically vulnerable or NHS staff who have had one. I’m 74 and mine is a week Saturday, my wife is 69 and hasn’t had an invite, neither has my 78 year old BiL. But most over 50s aren’t eligible yet. I’m 67 had the first and seconde as soon as able but 6 months is up on 02/11… no invite yet.. BTW if 6 months is up you should be able to book online rather than wait your GP who may or may not be up to speed.
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Post by South Stand Salopian on Oct 27, 2021 18:00:04 GMT 1
Last Wednesdays covid cases - 50,705 Today Wednesday covid cases - 43,941
Down about 14%
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Oct 27, 2021 18:08:42 GMT 1
I’m interested in where the figure of 50% of over 50s having had the booster comes from. I don’t know of anyone other than clinically vulnerable or NHS staff who have had one. I’m 74 and mine is a week Saturday, my wife is 69 and hasn’t had an invite, neither has my 78 year old BiL. But most over 50s aren’t eligible yet. I’m 67 had the first and seconde as soon as able but 6 months is up on 02/11… no invite yet.. BTW if 6 months is up you should be able to book online rather than wait your GP who may or may not be up to speed. . I was only questioning the claim that 50% of over 50s had had their booster. You’ve provided another reason why the claim is false.
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Post by Feedo Gnasher on Oct 27, 2021 19:08:36 GMT 1
Last Wednesdays covid cases - 50,705 Today Wednesday covid cases - 43,941 Down about 14% Glad to see it’s not just Mondays. Long may it continue.
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Post by Valerioch on Oct 27, 2021 19:08:50 GMT 1
But most over 50s aren’t eligible yet. I’m 67 had the first and seconde as soon as able but 6 months is up on 02/11… no invite yet.. BTW if 6 months is up you should be able to book online rather than wait your GP who may or may not be up to speed. . I was only questioning the claim that 50% of over 50s had had their booster. You’ve provided another reason why the claim is false. Innocent mistake on my part 👍🏼 Still it appears to be ramping up, which is good news. Hopefully all who want a booster will get it before long
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Post by The Shropshire Tenor on Oct 27, 2021 19:21:27 GMT 1
. I was only questioning the claim that 50% of over 50s had had their booster. You’ve provided another reason why the claim is false. Innocent mistake on my part 👍🏼 Still it appears to be ramping up, which is good news. Hopefully all who want a booster will get it before long No problem with you, several sources quoted it and it looked like good news. I only checked as it didn’t fit my experience. I do think we need to be sceptical about many of the stats that are quoted to us. This one looks like a mistake but some are manipulated to fit a specific position. The BBC radio show More or Less is very good at investigating dodgy stats.
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