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Post by tvor on Jan 15, 2019 20:41:36 GMT 1
Voted down by 230, any decent Prime Minister would resign.
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Post by LetchworthShrew on Jan 15, 2019 20:42:31 GMT 1
lost the vote - 202 to 432
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Post by shrewsace on Jan 15, 2019 20:42:57 GMT 1
The 'I know what I voted for' line from some leavers is increasingly irritating.
How could they? We still don't know what Brexit - if it happens - will 'look like'.
They know what they wanted - but that's probably slightly different to the next Brexiteer and the next one, and the...
There's a big difference between fantasy and what's deliverable.
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Jan 15, 2019 20:44:16 GMT 1
I have absolutely no idea. Sums you up, pal. Go on then, enlighten me. What has parliamentary reform got to do with the referendum and specifically those people who voted leave who now simply wish to see Parliament do what they said would be done, implement the decision made by the referendum. Oh why we're here, whats with the 'absolute' majority?
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Post by mattmw on Jan 15, 2019 20:45:29 GMT 1
May seems to be launching a no confidence vote in herself which is an unusual approach
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Post by tvor on Jan 15, 2019 20:46:45 GMT 1
May seems to be launching a no confidence vote in herself which is an unusual approach Vote of no confidence tabled. To be debated and voted on tomorrow.
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Post by frankwellshrews on Jan 15, 2019 20:53:20 GMT 1
Go on then, enlighten me. What has parliamentary reform got to do with the referendum and specifically those people who voted leave who now simply wish to see Parliament do what they said would be done, implement the decision made by the referendum. Oh why we're here, whats with the 'absolute' majority? Don't like it now the snidy troll comment boot's on the other foot do you? Why don't you try a simple Google search for the difference between a simple and an absolute majority?
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Jan 15, 2019 20:55:07 GMT 1
Go on then, enlighten me. What has parliamentary reform got to do with the referendum and specifically those people who voted leave who now simply wish to see Parliament do what they said would be done, implement the decision made by the referendum. Oh why we're here, whats with the 'absolute' majority? Don't like it now the snidy troll comment boot's on the other foot do you? Why don't you try a simple Google search for the difference between a simple and an absolute majority? I know what it is. I just want to know why you saw a need to reference it. What has that got to do with the referendum result? Why is it relevant?
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Post by venceremos on Jan 15, 2019 20:55:24 GMT 1
The government of the day has lost its most important vote by a significantly bigger margin (230) than actually voted for it (202). It was worth wasting another month delaying the vote for this result? And May has the brass neck to act as though she should continue to lead on this?!
That's an absolutely crushing defeat. May's position is untenable - she tried and failed catastrophically. Her credibility is destroyed and she should resign.
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Post by tvor on Jan 15, 2019 20:57:00 GMT 1
The government of the day has lost its most important vote by a significantly bigger margin (230) than actually voted for it (202). It was worth wasting another month delaying the vote for this result? And May has the brass neck to act as though she should continue to lead on this?! That's an absolutely crushing defeat. May's position is untenable - she tried and failed catastrophically. Her credibility is destroyed and she should resign. "the largest defeat for a sitting government in history." She should have resigned immediately.
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Post by staffordshrew on Jan 15, 2019 21:01:37 GMT 1
When the going gets tough the tough get going, so she will try to cling on.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2019 21:13:36 GMT 1
We now have a no confidence vote in the government tabled by Jeremy Corbyn. That's going to be a waste of time.
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Post by shrewsace on Jan 15, 2019 21:16:17 GMT 1
The government of the day has lost its most important vote by a significantly bigger margin (230) than actually voted for it (202). It was worth wasting another month delaying the vote for this result? And May has the brass neck to act as though she should continue to lead on this?! That's an absolutely crushing defeat. May's position is untenable - she tried and failed catastrophically. Her credibility is destroyed and she should resign. She'll have to be dragged out kicking and screaming, her intransigence knows no bounds!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2019 21:17:42 GMT 1
I don’t know about anyone else, but seems to me Stuttys tone has changed a touch
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Post by tvor on Jan 15, 2019 21:18:25 GMT 1
We now have a no confidence vote in the government tabled by Jeremy Corbyn. That's going to be a waste of time. I don't think it will be successful. The DUP will vote with the Government for example, but the Government may only win by a relatively small margin which would be damaging.
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Jan 15, 2019 21:19:03 GMT 1
Question is though, will it make a difference as who is pushing this? Parliament aren't going to come to some agreement any time soon are they? It's the very reason a referendum was called in the first place. May was not only going up against those who aren't happy with this particular deal, she was up against those who are going to be against any deal because they want more than the EU (which isn't going to happen), she was up against those who are going to be against any deal because they are seeking to force an election, she was up against those who see a no deal the best option and in addition against those who are looking to manoeuvre for a second referendum. How on earth are we going to come to some consensus, who is going to be able to manage that...
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Jan 15, 2019 21:19:46 GMT 1
I don’t know about anyone else, but seems to me Stuttys tone has changed a touch Sure it has...
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Post by salop27 on Jan 15, 2019 21:34:20 GMT 1
Government to win no confidence motion by 12 votes. Heard it hear first 👍
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Post by frankwellshrews on Jan 15, 2019 21:35:16 GMT 1
Don't like it now the snidy troll comment boot's on the other foot do you? Why don't you try a simple Google search for the difference between a simple and an absolute majority? I know what it is. I just want to know why you saw a need to reference it. What has that got to do with the referendum result? Why is it relevant? You know full well why it's relevant, it's been discussed ad nauseam on this very forum. If you haven't understood the argument by this point, that's on you. You understand that just posting that "rofl" emoji in place of an argument is the internet equivalent of "I know you are but what am I?" right?
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Jan 15, 2019 21:40:08 GMT 1
I know what it is. I just want to know why you saw a need to reference it. What has that got to do with the referendum result? Why is it relevant? You understand that just posting that "rofl" emoji in place of an argument is the internet equivalent of "I know you are but what am I?" right? <iframe width="18.720000000000027" height="6.759999999999991" style="position: absolute; width: 18.720000000000027px; height: 6.759999999999991px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none;left: 15px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_91562660" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="18.720000000000027" height="6.759999999999991" style="position: absolute; width: 18.72px; height: 6.76px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 881px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_50486761" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="18.720000000000027" height="6.759999999999991" style="position: absolute; width: 18.72px; height: 6.76px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 15px; top: 244px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_5195407" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="18.720000000000027" height="6.759999999999991" style="position: absolute; width: 18.72px; height: 6.76px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 881px; top: 244px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_87580054" scrolling="no"></iframe> Errrm no. I guess I missed the memo... And I have absolutely no idea what relevance an 'absolute majority' has when discussing democracy and the referendum result, it's irrelevant.
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Post by venceremos on Jan 15, 2019 23:42:05 GMT 1
Question is though, will it make a difference as who is pushing this? Parliament aren't going to come to some agreement any time soon are they? It's the very reason a referendum was called in the first place. May was not only going up against those who aren't happy with this particular deal, she was up against those who are going to be against any deal because they want more than the EU (which isn't going to happen), she was up against those who are going to be against any deal because they are seeking to force an election, she was up against those who see a no deal the best option and in addition against those who are looking to manoeuvre for a second referendum. How on earth are we going to come to some consensus, who is going to be able to manage that... May has had her chance and blown it. It’s not just a defeat, it’s a record defeat and a monumental policy failure. It’s no good people moaning when Parliament’s only doing its job, nor criticising other parties and MPs excluded from policy making and negotiating with the EU. That was the government’s job and May chose not to involve, or even consult, others. She made it party political, even when the country denied her a majority in 2017, and deserves to pay the ultimate price, whether or not the no confidence vote passes. She is now an obstacle to progress and others must be given the chance to break out of the crisis into which May has driven the country. If she wins the vote tomorrow, she should have the decency and integrity to stand down.
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Jan 16, 2019 0:07:10 GMT 1
I’ve officially lost interest in politics. At least until any politician comes knocking my door asking me to vote for them - then whoever it and whatever party will get both barrels from me. I was in the majority in the referendum (was quite surprised ) and we are being ignored.
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Post by theNOTORIOUSfbs on Jan 16, 2019 0:17:49 GMT 1
It's not a surprise but, it's hit home. I'm devastated. Corbyn etc have taken a giant step to power. At the expense of an unsuspecting UK public. People look back in history at extremists gaining control of countries. I never thought I'd see extremists very close to doing the same in the UK. In these days and times. There's a BIG question about integrity among MP's here etc
I'd like to wish everyone a very happy Marxist New Year for 2021..
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Post by albionshrew on Jan 16, 2019 0:54:53 GMT 1
I am still waiting to hear a sane reason why the UK should leave the EU. This is not a 'wind up' question. Is there any sound economic reason to leave? Haven't two world wars showed us that we must have a union of some kind? Do (some) Brexiteers really dislike 'foreigners' so much? Positive answers encouraged.
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Post by franthetownfan on Jan 16, 2019 8:57:31 GMT 1
And they’re suggesting another referendum? Quite clearly by the last one the larger half of the UK have dung for brains!
Just someone with the qualifications and who can make an educated assessment of the state of things say ‘all of this mess for things, you know what? Leaving the EU is stupid and we won’t be doing it!’
Or better yet, negotiate a deal and THEN offer up a referendum.
I’m not much of a politics follower but no good at all can and will come of this. I feel like this country is on the brink of something truly awful. More than half of us have clearly lost our minds for starters or are just living 1833.
Corbyn clearly won’t win this vote so it’s yet another waste of time! Teresa May unfortunately clearly won’t budge. She seems more bothered about how she looks than anything else.
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Post by martinshrew on Jan 16, 2019 9:26:48 GMT 1
And they’re suggesting another referendum? Quite clearly by the last one the larger half of the UK have dung for brains! This attitude is the very problem. Labelling over 17,000,000 people as " dung for brains" just because you don't agree is frankly pathetic. I genuinely believe if we have another referendum leave would win by a lager margin. What do the remain side want though, best of 3, best of 5 or just keep voting until they get the outcome they want? We have voted to leave, we're leaving on the 29th March.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2019 10:22:35 GMT 1
And they’re suggesting another referendum? Quite clearly by the last one the larger half of the UK have dung for brains! This attitude is the very problem. Labelling over 17,000,000 people as " dung for brains" just because you don't agree is frankly pathetic. I genuinely believe if we have another referendum leave would win by a lager margin. What do the remain side want though, best of 3, best of 5 or just keep voting until they get the outcome they want? We have voted to leave, we're leaving on the 29th March. As a remainer who doesn’t want another referendum I wonder what it is leavers want? Because as last nights vote showed us, it’s clearly not just brexit.
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Post by GrizzlyShrew on Jan 16, 2019 10:24:08 GMT 1
I am still waiting to hear a sane reason why the UK should leave the EU. This is not a 'wind up' question. Is there any sound economic reason to leave? Haven't two world wars showed us that we must have a union of some kind? Do (some) Brexiteers really dislike 'foreigners' so much? Positive answers encouraged. The sane reason is or should be clear to everyone. We had a vote, the majority voted to leave. whether that is the best decision for the country is largely irrelevant in my view, there was a chance for everyone to voice their views and they did. Politicians are elected by the voters to represent their views - they don’t do that, they clearly don’t give a stuff about the electorate once they have been voted in, which many of us realised well before all this fiasco.
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Post by martinshrew on Jan 16, 2019 10:29:48 GMT 1
This attitude is the very problem. Labelling over 17,000,000 people as " dung for brains" just because you don't agree is frankly pathetic. I genuinely believe if we have another referendum leave would win by a lager margin. What do the remain side want though, best of 3, best of 5 or just keep voting until they get the outcome they want? We have voted to leave, we're leaving on the 29th March. As a remainer who doesn’t want another referendum I wonder what it is leavers want? Because as last nights vote showed us, it’s clearly not just brexit. It is Brexit. 52% voted Brexit. Most level headed remainers want to see democracy implemented, so the 52% is effectively higher. It's a shame only around 20% of MPs believe in Brexit, the rest are trying to derail it. They're there to support their constituents, but they're failing.
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Post by tdk on Jan 16, 2019 10:41:04 GMT 1
I am still waiting to hear a sane reason why the UK should leave the EU. This is not a 'wind up' question. Is there any sound economic reason to leave? Haven't two world wars showed us that we must have a union of some kind? Do (some) Brexiteers really dislike 'foreigners' so much? Positive answers encouraged. It should be a question of principle, not money. An un-elected bureaucrat dictating how other countries should be punished for not towing the line (Poland, Austria) is very wrong. Add to that the desire for their own army and you have the end of democracy. Economically the Germans were right to vote for Hitler and the Italians for Mussolini. They give you the money and you give them the power to do what they want.
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