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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2019 11:54:39 GMT 1
In all of my posts, whatever the subject, I try to just say it as I see it without being vindictive, rude or upsetting anyone. Unlike some other posters !!!!!!!! You've literally just palmed off children in this countries absolute poverty (that's absolute btw not relative, which has risen recently I'd add) because they're not comperable apparently to your anecdotal experiences in other countries. Pretty rude I'd say. Suck it up school child wearing the same unwashed school uniform with no lunch to eat this afternoon, because dad's got mental health issues and mum's on a zero hours contract. You could be in India. Just saying it how it is. Freespeech4lyf.
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Post by davycrockett on Apr 12, 2019 12:02:28 GMT 1
In light of what has transpired over those last two-and-a-half years, of course it's worth asking the question again. Many of those 17.4m may have believed the leave promises of striking the 'easiest trade deal in history', that the EU would come crawling as 'they need us more than we need them'. As one-time leading Brexiteer Peter Oborne recently admitted here they were misled. We can now go to the country and say 'You wanted to leave - this is the deal that your Prime Minister, leader of the elected government of your sovereign state has been able to strike with the EU. " do you want this deal, yes or no?" "If no, do you want to leave the EU under a 'no deal' or would you rather stay in the EU". There may be some leavers who think that May's deal still keeps us too closely tied to the EU but without the influence we have previously been able to yield. They may think that, in that case, we might as well remain as full members of the EU. Some may think that they would rather go down the no deal route. Others may have totally changed their minds as they've witnessed the turmoil unfold before them since 2016 and now back remain. So why not ask the question again, and find out exactly where the nation stands now? Don't assume that the other 17.4m who voted to leave think exactly as you do. I actually agree with this... under the caveat the the first question should be a binary Remain or Leave. there should be a secondary question, but only for those that elect to leave, and that question should be to accept the negotiated deal (which is virtually a remain answer) or to leave under WTO terms and negotiate again for a deal... which we would get and on far better terms than under a WA (my opinion) There is no way remainers should get a 3rd chance to keep us in.... Oh and is the boot on the other foot when all the remainers state that many who voted leave in the first instance... just another assumption.... Alleluia this is progress. Downie wants second referendum👍 Why not just have a simple choice of three questions with only one selection allowed. Remain Leave with Mays deal Leave with no deal
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Apr 12, 2019 12:12:04 GMT 1
I actually agree with this... under the caveat the the first question should be a binary Remain or Leave. there should be a secondary question, but only for those that elect to leave, and that question should be to accept the negotiated deal (which is virtually a remain answer) or to leave under WTO terms and negotiate again for a deal... which we would get and on far better terms than under a WA (my opinion) There is no way remainers should get a 3rd chance to keep us in.... Oh and is the boot on the other foot when all the remainers state that many who voted leave in the first instance... just another assumption.... Alleluia this is progress. Downie wants second referendum👍 Why not just have a simple choice of three questions with only one selection allowed. Remain Leave with Mays deal Leave with no deal And thus splitting the Leave vote. Yes, I can see why that would appeal to some...
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Post by shrewsace on Apr 12, 2019 13:22:25 GMT 1
I’m absolutely certain the brexit party will attract some lovely, wholesome folk, real salt of the earth types, people with real heartfelt conviction and warmth, honesty and virtue. Much like the far left Labour under Corbyn will attract those wonderful types. Lets face it, a party cannot control who assosiates to it. I'm sure no party would want paedos, murderers etc for example assosiating to them but they'll allign themselves to one party or another. Intriguing. Seem to remember the Corbyn-critics demanding he take responsibility for all sorts of stuff in the Twittersphere over which he had no control on the grounds it was being done 'in his name'. And that's not to mention a broken window in the building which housed Angela Eagle's constituency office. Despite the fact that - to this day - no one knows who broke the window, or how, or what their motivation was. Anyway, recognition this was nonsense is a welcome development, although I suspect double-standards will apply.
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Post by salop27 on Apr 12, 2019 13:30:34 GMT 1
As I said yesterday the brexit fight back has indeed begun this morning. So refreshing to hear leaving the EU spoken about in such positive terms again. The European elections are going to deliver a two finger salute to both main parties.
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Post by shrewsace on Apr 12, 2019 13:31:40 GMT 1
As I said yesterday the brexit fight back has indeed begun this morning. So refreshing to hear leaving the EU spoken about in such positive terms again. The European elections are going to deliver a two finger salute to both main parties. Good to have the adults back in the room.
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Post by staffordshrew on Apr 12, 2019 13:49:22 GMT 1
One thing about Theresa May, she doesn't listen and certainly doesn't take any notice of anyone.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2019 14:50:52 GMT 1
30 years ago? But it isn't 30 years ago though is it. And we are all interested in the state of the nation and the concerns you list but that doesn't mean that we then turn a blind eye to someone that we do not deem fit to be Prime Minister. The things that were mentioned in the post I replied to matter in that regard (to me anyhows, to others too clearly). And in addition, in order for those things you mention to be addressed we need people in place who we deem competent to do so. I wouldn't trust Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott to run a bath. I'm not sure what martin mentioned but what do you contest from the post from salop27 that I replied to? I think my version sounds more sincere as I can safely say I've never shared stages with anti semitic organisations or individuals or accidentally been involved in wreath laying ceremonies commemorating terrorists or have ever belonged to private Facebook groups featuring racist abuse.
What is incorrect from what is stated in that post? Because as I understand it, all the things that are listed there can be leveled at Corbyn. How do you understand it, what have we missed? So if this isn't the historic 30 year ago stuff, then what is it you're referring to? The 2012 conference which hamas attended? Top american officials have had meeting with hamas to try and find a way for peace in Palestine. But oh no, jeremy corbyn does it and he's a terrorist sympathiser. Bill clinton meets up with jerry adams, and he's looking to make peace, but oh no, jeremy corbyn does it and he's a terrorist sympathiser. Benjamin Netenyahu orders phosphorus bombs be dropped on Gaza civilians and he's greeted with handshakes around the world. But Jeremy Corbyn farts in bed and he's a terrorist sympathiser. Tell me what JC has said or done to justify claims of antisemitism? thats the question i asked martin. Neither you or he has answered. I responded to the post by salop 27 (its there in blue and yellow for all to see). I have no idea who salop 27 is, i do not know his history, i do not know what he's been up to in the past. how can i therefore judge him? How can i judge his sincerity? For all you or i know he may be an extreme right wing nazi sympathiser, how sincere does that make him? And of course, taken in isolation you can draw any conclusion you like from salops post. And of course, being on the right, you will agree with him. Doesn't mean you're right though. just means your perspective is different, and your view of things is just as selective as mine.
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Post by salop27 on Apr 12, 2019 15:11:36 GMT 1
Matron, I can guarantee you I'm not a nazi sympathiser!! This might not come as a surprise but I'm not a Corbyn fan. For all the problems the UK has and the positives, he's not the person to lead us forward. I do however NOT believe him to be a racist in any form. However, when you look at the organisations and events he lends his support to, some of which I mentioned previously,you can see why people have legitimate doubts about him and the Labour party/membership.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2019 16:12:36 GMT 1
Great post. For all the talk of this being in the media its good to post a reminder or two, seems this sort of thing can to be quickly and easily forgotten... Oh stop it 😂 Seriously, it’s a great diversion from people living in poverty, having to rely on food banks to survive, the crumbling (literally) nhs, spiralling knife crime and disorder on our streets, the governments all mighty **** up of brexit, our crumbling infrastructure, disintegration of local government.......... but yes, we need a reminder of jeremy corbyns past. Keep em coming stutty, despite you and the B&A right wings best efforts I think most people can see right through your silliness! 👍 Spot on. Mind you, all the above also detracts from the casual racism and Islamophobia in the Tory Party people seem willing to ignore.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2019 18:21:19 GMT 1
Matron, I can guarantee you I'm not a nazi sympathiser!! This might not come as a surprise but I'm not a Corbyn fan. For all the problems the UK has and the positives, he's not the person to lead us forward. I do however NOT believe him to be a racist in any form. However, when you look at the organisations and events he lends his support to, some of which I mentioned previously,you can see why people have legitimate doubts about him and the Labour party/membership. I realise that, and I’m pretty sure you’re not a nazi to, but perhaps the point I was pretty badly making, is that often, the conclusions we come to arnt in fact true, but reflect as much our own bias and perspective as anything else. I support both the Palestinian cause and to an extent republicanism in NI, but that doesn’t mean I support bombing Israel or Belfast.
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Apr 12, 2019 18:24:25 GMT 1
30 years ago? But it isn't 30 years ago though is it. And we are all interested in the state of the nation and the concerns you list but that doesn't mean that we then turn a blind eye to someone that we do not deem fit to be Prime Minister. The things that were mentioned in the post I replied to matter in that regard (to me anyhows, to others too clearly). And in addition, in order for those things you mention to be addressed we need people in place who we deem competent to do so. I wouldn't trust Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott to run a bath. I'm not sure what martin mentioned but what do you contest from the post from salop27 that I replied to? I think my version sounds more sincere as I can safely say I've never shared stages with anti semitic organisations or individuals or accidentally been involved in wreath laying ceremonies commemorating terrorists or have ever belonged to private Facebook groups featuring racist abuse.
What is incorrect from what is stated in that post? Because as I understand it, all the things that are listed there can be leveled at Corbyn. How do you understand it, what have we missed? So if this isn't the historic 30 year ago stuff, then what is it you're referring to? The 2012 conference which hamas attended? Top american officials have had meeting with hamas to try and find a way for peace in Palestine. But oh no, jeremy corbyn does it and he's a terrorist sympathiser. Bill clinton meets up with jerry adams, and he's looking to make peace, but oh no, jeremy corbyn does it and he's a terrorist sympathiser. Benjamin Netenyahu orders phosphorus bombs be dropped on Gaza civilians and he's greeted with handshakes around the world. But Jeremy Corbyn farts in bed and he's a terrorist sympathiser. Tell me what JC has said or done to justify claims of antisemitism? thats the question i asked martin. Neither you or he has answered. I responded to the post by salop 27 (its there in blue and yellow for all to see). I have no idea who salop 27 is, i do not know his history, i do not know what he's been up to in the past. how can i therefore judge him? How can i judge his sincerity? For all you or i know he may be an extreme right wing nazi sympathiser, how sincere does that make him? And of course, taken in isolation you can draw any conclusion you like from salops post. And of course, being on the right, you will agree with him. Doesn't mean you're right though. just means your perspective is different, and your view of things is just as selective as mine. The wreath laying incident was when? 2014. So no, not 30 years ago. Did those top American officials speak of Hamas and Hezbollah as 'friends'. I'm pretty sure those top American officials would have no issue denouncing Hamas and Hezbollah. Corbyn? Did Bill Clinton attend rallies where those who had fought and died for the IRA were honored? As Corbyn did? And what Netenyahu has to do with this I have no idea, I wouldn't want him anywhere near government either. That just looks like a whole lot of whataboutery. I'm not aware of any top American officials, Clinton or Netenyahu having aspirations of becoming the next Primer Minister of the United Kingdom? Tell me what JC has said or done to justify claims of antisemitism?I have never stated he has. However, what was stated by salop27 is correct or? I think my version sounds more sincere as I can safely say I've never shared stages with anti semitic organisations or individuals or accidentally been involved in wreath laying ceremonies commemorating terrorists or have ever belonged to private Facebook groups featuring racist abuse.
That is true of Corbyn or? You don't seem concerned about Corbyn's past. I am. Its not about any diversion and I don't deem it silliness either. I think he would be an absolute disaster for the UK. You didn't need to reply to my post in response to salop27, maybe you just need to appreciate that people see things differently to you.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2019 18:31:36 GMT 1
You didn't need to reply to my post in response to salop27, maybe you just need to appreciate that people see things differently to you. Which is ironic, because that’s just what I said to you in my reply!
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Apr 12, 2019 18:47:15 GMT 1
You didn't need to reply to my post in response to salop27, maybe you just need to appreciate that people see things differently to you. Which is ironic, because that’s just what I said to you in my reply! Yep. So that we do agree on. 👍
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2019 18:51:57 GMT 1
Which is ironic, because that’s just what I said to you in my reply! Yep. So that we do agree on. 👍 Indeed 👍
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2019 19:59:17 GMT 1
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Post by frankwellshrews on Apr 12, 2019 21:55:34 GMT 1
That’s almost a direct quote from one of Jeremy Corbyns speeches, except his version sounds more sincere. I think my version sounds more sincere as I can safely say I've never shared stages with anti semitic organisations or individuals or accidentally been involved in wreath laying ceremonies commemorating terrorists or have ever belonged to private Facebook groups featuring racist abuse. Ok. How do you feel about this then? www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/20/leader-of-pro-brexit-party-catherine-blaiklock-resigns-over-anti-islam-messagesYour guy, Farage; leader of his party had to resign after basically being exposed as a racist. In fact, "exposed" is generous, this person wasn't parricularly bothered about hiding it. Party's only been running for a matter of weeks. Why won't you and people like you apply the same standards to your own politicians as you use on the opposition?
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Post by shrewsace on Apr 12, 2019 22:33:55 GMT 1
I think my version sounds more sincere as I can safely say I've never shared stages with anti semitic organisations or individuals or accidentally been involved in wreath laying ceremonies commemorating terrorists or have ever belonged to private Facebook groups featuring racist abuse. Ok. How do you feel about this then? www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/20/leader-of-pro-brexit-party-catherine-blaiklock-resigns-over-anti-islam-messagesYour guy, Farage; leader of his party had to resign after basically being exposed as a racist. In fact, "exposed" is generous, this person wasn't parricularly bothered about hiding it. Party's only been running for a matter of weeks. Why won't you and people like you apply the same standards to your own politicians as you use on the opposition? Not to mention the 'hostile environment', the Windrush scandal and, of course, the Saudi arms flogging. Take their concern with a rather large pinch of salt.
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Post by salop27 on Apr 12, 2019 23:29:25 GMT 1
Wtf does "you and people like you" mean exactly? I'm extremely happy if someone has been removed from a political party as they're racist by the way.
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Post by shrewinjapan on Apr 12, 2019 23:31:33 GMT 1
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Post by martinshrew on Apr 14, 2019 13:58:01 GMT 1
Come on, it's a bit more than hysteria. Numerous MPs leaving, 100s of complaints of anti-Semitism not looked into ... There are a lot of vested interests is my honest opinion. A lot of people who believe that opposition to Israeli foreign policy towards the Palestinians is the same as antisemitism. People who think that antizionism is the same as antisemitism. But anyway, as you’re there. I asked a few days ago if you could give some examples of Jeremy Corbyns antisemitism. You didn’t answer. Have you come up with anything yet? 👍 Jeremy Corbyn has privately admitted that evidence of anti-semitism in Labour has been “mislaid, ignored or not used”, The Sunday Times can reveal.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2019 14:06:02 GMT 1
There are a lot of vested interests is my honest opinion. A lot of people who believe that opposition to Israeli foreign policy towards the Palestinians is the same as antisemitism. People who think that antizionism is the same as antisemitism. But anyway, as you’re there. I asked a few days ago if you could give some examples of Jeremy Corbyns antisemitism. You didn’t answer. Have you come up with anything yet? 👍 Jeremy Corbyn has privately admitted that evidence of anti-semitism in Labour has been “mislaid, ignored or not used”, The Sunday Times can reveal.
Still waiting. But anyway, as you’re there. I asked a few days ago if you could give some examples of Jeremy Corbyns antisemitism. You didn’t answer. Have you come up with anything yet? 👍
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Post by martinshrew on Apr 14, 2019 14:14:08 GMT 1
Jeremy Corbyn has privately admitted that evidence of anti-semitism in Labour has been “mislaid, ignored or not used”, The Sunday Times can reveal.
Still waiting. But anyway, as you’re there. I asked a few days ago if you could give some examples of Jeremy Corbyns antisemitism. You didn’t answer. Have you come up with anything yet? 👍 Think Salop27 provided you some examples, you chose to ignore them. Similarly you'll chose to ignore the fact Corbyn knowingly allows his party to mislay, ignore or not investigate claims of antisemitism.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2019 14:28:20 GMT 1
Still waiting. But anyway, as you’re there. I asked a few days ago if you could give some examples of Jeremy Corbyns antisemitism. You didn’t answer. Have you come up with anything yet? 👍 Corbyn knowingly allows his party to mislay, ignore or not investigate claims of antisemitism. Spectacular stretch that. He expressed concerns over the handling of it to Hodge. No doubt as it had been p**s poor and no doubt now tightened up by the NEC at corbyns behest. In fact he states 'because I was concerned that it was either being mislaid, ignored or not used, and there had to be some better system.'
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Post by shrewsace on Apr 14, 2019 14:40:11 GMT 1
There are a lot of vested interests is my honest opinion. A lot of people who believe that opposition to Israeli foreign policy towards the Palestinians is the same as antisemitism. People who think that antizionism is the same as antisemitism. But anyway, as you’re there. I asked a few days ago if you could give some examples of Jeremy Corbyns antisemitism. You didn’t answer. Have you come up with anything yet? 👍 Jeremy Corbyn has privately admitted that evidence of anti-semitism in Labour has been “mislaid, ignored or not used”, The Sunday Times can reveal.
Absolutely explosive expose in the Sunday Times revealing that, er, Jeremy Corbyn met with a party colleague and engaged in good faith in a discussion about how complaints of anti-semitism could be better investigated and handled. Absolutely damning isn't it? The scoundrel! If you bother to read beyond the headline (and with all due respect, your opinions largely come off as regurgitated soundbites you've scr@ped together from the right-wing media) the Sunday Times framing of what he said is rather misleading. He said 'I was concerned that it was either being mislaid, ignored or not used, and there had to be some better system." So, hardly a man guilty of denying the problem or refusing to tackle it as he has oft been painted. If anyone comes out of this looking untrustworthy and slippery it is Hodge! Think this will damage her more than Corbyn once it sinks in what a non-story this is once you peel away the headline. And even Salop27 said he did not believe Corbyn was personally anti-semitic, so I guess Matron's wait continues...
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2019 14:45:27 GMT 1
Jeremy Corbyn has privately admitted that evidence of anti-semitism in Labour has been “mislaid, ignored or not used”, The Sunday Times can reveal.
Absolutely explosive expose in the Sunday Times revealing that, er, Jeremy Corbyn met with a party colleague and engaged in good faith in a discussion about how complaints of anti-semitism could be better investigated and handled. Absolutely damning isn't it? The scoundrel! If you bother to read beyond the headline (and with all due respect, your opinions largely come off as regurgitated soundbites you've scr@ped together from the right-wing media) the Sunday Times framing of what he said is rather misleading. He said 'I was concerned that it was either being mislaid, ignored or not used, and there had to be some better system." So, hardly a man guilty of denying the problem or refusing to tackle it as he has oft been painted. If anyone comes out of this looking untrustworthy and slippery it is Hodge! Think this will damage her more than Corbyn once it sinks in what a non-story this is once you peel away the headline. And even Salop27 said he did not believe Corbyn was personally anti-semitic, so I guess Matron's wait continues... Its a truly bizarre stance by Hodge to have called corbyn 'a ****ing anti semite' to then release secret recordings of him committed to dealing with it and improving the process. Then again as proven with Martin above if one only reads the headlines and draw their own (incorrect) assertions from it then no doubt it'll do the damage to Labour just as they pull away in the polls and as election period kicks in.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2019 14:52:06 GMT 1
Unbelievable and wilful misrepresentation of what Corbyn said from Martinshrew. Beyond parody.
The funny thing is, this is supposed to discredit Corbyn, but it actually shows he's concerned about anti-Semitism in the LP and the lack of action. Which is, probably historical....
Anyway, watched Marr this morning. Batten was on, spouting his usual Islamophobic, racist nonsense. Surprised that hasn't been mentioned....
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2019 14:54:16 GMT 1
Absolutely explosive expose in the Sunday Times revealing that, er, Jeremy Corbyn met with a party colleague and engaged in good faith in a discussion about how complaints of anti-semitism could be better investigated and handled. Absolutely damning isn't it? The scoundrel! If you bother to read beyond the headline (and with all due respect, your opinions largely come off as regurgitated soundbites you've scr@ped together from the right-wing media) the Sunday Times framing of what he said is rather misleading. He said 'I was concerned that it was either being mislaid, ignored or not used, and there had to be some better system." So, hardly a man guilty of denying the problem or refusing to tackle it as he has oft been painted. If anyone comes out of this looking untrustworthy and slippery it is Hodge! Think this will damage her more than Corbyn once it sinks in what a non-story this is once you peel away the headline. And even Salop27 said he did not believe Corbyn was personally anti-semitic, so I guess Matron's wait continues... Then again as proven with Martin above if one only reads the headlines and draw their own (incorrect) assertions from it then no doubt it'll do the damage to Labour just as they pull away in the polls and as election period kicks in. Timing is everything...
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2019 14:56:53 GMT 1
Of course, Hodge has experience of ignoring concerns of abuse. Irony everywhere today.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 14, 2019 15:33:44 GMT 1
Still waiting. But anyway, as you’re there. I asked a few days ago if you could give some examples of Jeremy Corbyns antisemitism. You didn’t answer. Have you come up with anything yet? 👍 Think Salop27 provided you some examples, you chose to ignore them. Similarly you'll chose to ignore the fact Corbyn knowingly allows his party to mislay, ignore or not investigate claims of antisemitism. Errr no he didn’t (unless I’ve missed them, in which case pop em up and I’ll address them)! Either way, you made the sound bite, I mean, accusation, do your own homework! So.........still waiting!
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