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Post by zenfootball on Oct 20, 2017 17:05:40 GMT 1
i fail to understand why we cant have offences like vehicle homicide and vehicle manslaughter with clear definitions. this man may have a dependency issue but he presumably had capacity and understood the potential consequences to my mind that is vehicle homicide and sentences should reflect this.his age is irrelevant the family get a life sentence. what is the point of impact statements and then judges give the minimum sentence . I'm not referring to this one case, my comments here are general, so please don't come after me on that point. You can't have a vehicle murder crime because, terrorists apart, does anyone use a car with the intention to kill? A perpetrator might be negligent, remorseless, despicable and so on but did they intend to kill? That's what needs to be proven for murder. Manslaughter is a different case but I don't see why a vehicle is any different to a knife, fist, boot or whatever. It's the means by which someone kills and is killed. I'm surprised manslaughter convictions don't seem to arise more often in killings by drunk or otherwise dangerous drivers. hi am sorry you felt i was "coming after you" that was not my intention and i am sorry if you felt it was. This was just an observation on how we can have a better system to deal with this kind of crime and that was the only thing i intended to do
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Post by venceremos on Oct 20, 2017 17:33:34 GMT 1
I'm not referring to this one case, my comments here are general, so please don't come after me on that point. You can't have a vehicle murder crime because, terrorists apart, does anyone use a car with the intention to kill? A perpetrator might be negligent, remorseless, despicable and so on but did they intend to kill? That's what needs to be proven for murder. Manslaughter is a different case but I don't see why a vehicle is any different to a knife, fist, boot or whatever. It's the means by which someone kills and is killed. I'm surprised manslaughter convictions don't seem to arise more often in killings by drunk or otherwise dangerous drivers. hi am sorry you felt i was "coming after you" that was not my intention and i am sorry if you felt it was. This was just an observation on how we can have a better system to deal with this kind of crime and that was the only thing i intended to do No, I didn't think you were, no problem - I hadn't posted before so would have had no reason to think that anyway. I just wanted to make it clear I was commenting generally, not about this specific case. Emotions are understandably running high and I didn't want to add fuel to it.
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Post by callum on Oct 20, 2017 20:06:42 GMT 1
I fail to see how anyone can argue the case, this person should never see the light of day again.
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Post by northwestman on Oct 20, 2017 20:33:29 GMT 1
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Post by wiseone on Oct 20, 2017 21:14:38 GMT 1
Pathetic postings Pilch, really pathetic anyway back to topic lock this bloke up forever move on regardless of why i'll leave the lynch mob alone now I do not see a lynch mob anywhere, just a consensus that the sentence is far to lenient. Personally I agree that anyone who has a ongoing battle with alcohol should receive help, just as anyone else should with any addiction - not just for the individual but society as a whole. It is however beyond belief that there is any defence for drink driving , especially if you are aware enough to know you have both a alcohol problem ( are driving to buy alcohol) and have a pre-existing medical condition. It it appears from both the chatter on social media before he was named and the reports afterwards that this was not a one off event or a silly mistake . His actions are therefore even more repulsive and the results devistating. This makes the punishment so disappointing and it is right that they are being challenged.
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Post by Pilch on Oct 20, 2017 22:58:37 GMT 1
anyway back to topic lock this bloke up forever move on regardless of why i'll leave the lynch mob alone now I do not see a lynch mob anywhere, just a consensus that the sentence is far to lenient. Personally I agree that anyone who has a ongoing battle with alcohol should receive help, just as anyone else should with any addiction - not just for the individual but society as a whole. It is however beyond belief that there is any defence for drink driving , especially if you are aware enough to know you have both a alcohol problem ( are driving to buy alcohol) and have a pre-existing medical condition. It it appears from both the chatter on social media before he was named and the reports afterwards that this was not a one off event or a silly mistake . His actions are therefore even more repulsive and the results devistating. This makes the punishment so disappointing and it is right that they are being challenged. did i ever say i'm on his side ? if it sounds like i am, i'm most certainly not i'm totally in favour of him getting the full sentence, if for no one else but the girls mum as i said is before we all get him locked up for longer take a sec to think about what he did and why ? not to get him off lightly but to think about the future and prevent this happening again i may not have had the best timing or the best case i admit, but we need to get alcoholism tackled yes indeed, he could have got help and not driven people with a mental illness usually dont make the right decision but at the same time, why are doctors not doing the dirty deed and informing the dvla once they have spotted an issue ? why was he allowed to drive having done this twice before ? if we sell guns in every shop and someone goes on the rampage, we ask why we sell guns and now gun laws have all been tightened, you need a good reason to buy a gun and yet the biggest alky can walk in any shop and get all the tools they need to ruin lives ps sorry if i upset you on this thread horse that wasnt my intention had you asked me to pin the thread & lock it after your initial post , as it was most personal to you thats exactly what i could have done but it was for me too i used to live with someone with such a problem and part of that problem was driving trying to tackle it alone was impossible and last thing you want are the authorities involved mine was a happy ending but it could well have ended on the front page, many many times
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Post by horse01 on Oct 21, 2017 10:17:11 GMT 1
I appreciate that Pilch.
I too had an alcoholic in the family, and no matter what you say to them, often the drink takes over. They finally realised they had a problem after putting their car through someone’s garden fence at the bottom of their road. It was their choice to drive, and fortunately nobody was hurt in this case. But at the risk of losing that family member, we reported them to the police. Yes they lost their licence- the best thing that could have happened. And happily they have been tea-total ever since.
In Goodalls case, from what I understand, he has been doing it for years. People who knew him, could and should have reported him years ago. Maybe they too have blood on their hands to some extent? But this animal has shown no remorse whatsoever.
It’s hard when you’ve got a normally incredibly strong family member, break down in front of you. Crying uncontrollably on your shoulder.
There is a mother that is lost. Where she once had her little girl with her, her best friend, did everything for her and with her, she now has nothing. She now wakes up to an empty house.
People who haven’t experienced this kind of loss, don’t know the true impact. You expect to bury an older family member at some point, but you should never have to bury a child- especially not for the foolish actions of someone who has lived their life. Birthdays, Christmas, Easter, Halloween, bonfire night, the date they died, even just the everyday mundane things that you take for granted that you used to do together- eating, travelling to School, shopping, even those silly little arguments- gone? And for what?? So that he could have his little bit of pleasure from a bottle, and screw everyone else and the consequences.
He obviously knew he had a problem, as he had already been informed by the doctor. Whether the doctor should inform the DVLA or not, that’s open to debate. But Goodall was instructed to do so, and didn’t. He would have undoubtedly lost his licence.
The rest, as they say, is history. Well for most people it is anyway. Not for Olivia’s family though. The pain will be there every minute of every day. This animal still gets to experience life. To eat, sleep, breathe fresh air, and at some point, he will have his freedom back too.
Unfortunately the same can never be said for Olivia
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Post by horse01 on Oct 22, 2017 9:36:23 GMT 1
Please sign. Thanks
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 9:51:15 GMT 1
If he has a mental illness that he can’t control, and is a danger to the public as he has clearly demonstrated, then he should be sectioned and locked up in a mental hospital.
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Post by Pilch on Oct 22, 2017 10:07:38 GMT 1
If he has a mental illness that he can’t control, and is a danger to the public as he has clearly demonstrated, then he should be sectioned and locked up in a mental hospital. his option to drive should have been completely removed from him at least and yet he may still drive again which is more worrying/annpying that seeing him being able to walk the streets again
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Post by davycrockett on Oct 22, 2017 10:14:18 GMT 1
Signed the petition as I do think the sentence is a joke.......
However the reason poor Olivia was killed was that the Guy chose to drive whilst obviously drunk...... The same crime many (Martin O'Neil for example) commit and get away with not through their actions but just luck but why did he get 16'month ban and £1300 fine and even kept his job yet he'd did the same but was lucky!!!,
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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2017 10:37:42 GMT 1
If he has a mental illness that he can’t control, and is a danger to the public as he has clearly demonstrated, then he should be sectioned and locked up in a mental hospital. his option to drive should have been completely removed from him at least and yet he may still drive again which is more worrying/annpying that seeing him being able to walk the streets again But what would have been the point of removing the option? He already had the option not to drink and drive but his “illness” meant he didn’t make the rational decision. If his licence was revoked is there just as much chance he would have made a similarly irrational decision and jumped in his car anyway? Licence or not? If someone with another mental illness, schizophrenia for example, had picked up a knife and stabbed someone to death, we wouldn’t simply say “well let’s keep him away from knives” would we? This is one reason why the mental illness argument gets so difficult. I have no time for him and personally a life behind bars would have been lenient, but if we are suggesting he’s mentally ill, then you could argue he shouldn’t have been sent to prison at all.
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Post by Dale on Oct 22, 2017 10:48:45 GMT 1
This selfish old barsteward, illness or not, took up the option to do something which ended the life of a innocent young girl, she will never have a happy and fulfilling life through absolutely no fault of her own and will haunt her family for the rest of their lives whereas this 'man' has already lived his, he should never be a free man again. I say this as someone who had a alcoholic in my family and passed away at the age of 38 due to liver disease, I acknowledge that alcoholism is a disease but they can still make choices in life, he made a very bad one.
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Post by Pilch on Oct 22, 2017 12:11:02 GMT 1
his option to drive should have been completely removed from him at least and yet he may still drive again which is more worrying/annpying that seeing him being able to walk the streets again But what would have been the point of removing the option? He already had the option not to drink and drive but his “illness” meant he didn’t make the rational decision. If his licence was revoked is there just as much chance he would have made a similarly irrational decision and jumped in his car anyway? Licence or not? If someone with another mental illness, schizophrenia for example, had picked up a knife and stabbed someone to death, we wouldn’t simply say “well let’s keep him away from knives” would we? This is one reason why the mental illness argument gets so difficult. I have no time for him and personally a life behind bars would have been lenient, but if we are suggesting he’s mentally ill, then you could argue he shouldn’t have been sent to prison at all. yes i know anyone can hop in a car an drive, almost impossible to stop this but presumably he had a licence, insurance, tax, mot etc something should be in place to set alarm bells ringing even when someone like him attempts to drive legit what we need is police knocking on the door asking why he's just insured himself on a car after his doctor had informed dvla that he shouldnt be driving etc also if you get caught drink driving it should be compulsory that you pass a medical exam of sorts saying you are fit to drive just seems to easy for these type of people to drive around undetected at the moment
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Post by mattmw on Oct 22, 2017 12:23:53 GMT 1
Signed the petition as I do think the sentence is a joke....... However the reason poor Olivia was killed was that the Guy chose to drive whilst obviously drunk...... The same crime many (Martin O'Neil for example) commit and get away with not through their actions but just luck but why did he get 16'month ban and £1300 fine and even kept his job yet he'd did the same but was lucky!!!, Think you mean Michael O'Neill the Northern Ireland manager, not Martin O’Neil who I don’t think has ever had a drink drive charge against him!
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