|
Post by bordersalopian on Aug 1, 2015 20:52:17 GMT 1
With both JLAA and JG both still heavily involved in our pre-season fixtures, what are the chances of them both appearing for Town on non-contract terms? A pay-as-you-play type if deal? At least until the final dealings with regards to the first team budget is squared away? Certainly looks as though Vernon & Demetriou are on their way out, one way or another - either on permanent moves of long term loans with the receiving club paying a percentage of their wages.
the Ginnelly saga continues to frustrate - maybe the club have received a more substantial offer from Burnley?
JLAA in particular looks hungry to prove his worth, with some decent displays in pre-season, coupled with the well held belief that he's the most natural finisher at the club...could we be about to see that potential come to fruition?
Personnally, I'd prefer to keep both JLAA and Jermaine and see Ryan Woods depart as we've got more strength in depth in midfield than we have had for years. Could MMs game plan be to keep the nucleus of the squad we've fine well to assemble together with a sprinkling of loanees as the season progresses?
the return to fitness of both Weso & NKP will be like having two new signings in itself, and coupled with the number of ex-captains we've got in the squad, we seem to be much more better prepared than our last tilt at L1 football....
Thoughts?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2015 20:59:03 GMT 1
Thoughts are....... this is starting to bore the tits off me
|
|
|
Post by bordersalopian on Aug 1, 2015 21:06:27 GMT 1
Thanks for your input...
|
|
|
Post by thesensationaljt on Aug 1, 2015 21:24:51 GMT 1
Don't think we need worry, to be honest. I think we'll have 3 players signed up by next week. Two of them old friends. Loads of players lowering their demands now, as they aren't being paid.........allegedly.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2015 21:41:56 GMT 1
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2015 22:03:26 GMT 1
But here is the way i see it. At end of last season, MM offered them contracts, but they decided to try elsewhere first.... so he brought in replacements..... then when the offers that they sought elsewhere did not come, so they asked if they could stay.... now we are trying to force out Vernon and Demitriou or cling to the hope of a massive payout from a untried youngster in the hope we can get funds to keep these 2. In my humble opinion, we would have been better keeping Mangan....
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2015 22:10:44 GMT 1
Thoughts are....... this is starting to bore the tits off me Hmmmm, I know the feeling .
|
|
|
Post by markglasgow on Aug 1, 2015 22:22:27 GMT 1
Today both showed they will be vital cogs in the machine. Especially if the Goldson offer comes in and we move out Vernon.
MM is talking about these guys constantly. Ergo we are.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 1, 2015 22:48:14 GMT 1
But here is the way i see it. At end of last season, MM offered them contracts, but they decided to try elsewhere first.... so he brought in replacements..... then when the offers that they sought elsewhere did not come, so they asked if they could stay.... now we are trying to force out Vernon and Demitriou or cling to the hope of a massive payout from a untried youngster in the hope we can get funds to keep these 2. In my humble opinion, we would have been better keeping Mangan.... Way off the mark IMO
|
|
|
Post by callum on Aug 2, 2015 0:50:37 GMT 1
With both JLAA and JG both still heavily involved in our pre-season fixtures, what are the chances of them both appearing for Town on non-contract terms? A pay-as-you-play type if deal? At least until the final dealings with regards to the first team budget is squared away? Certainly looks as though Vernon & Demetriou are on their way out, one way or another - either on permanent moves of long term loans with the receiving club paying a percentage of their wages. the Ginnelly saga continues to frustrate - maybe the club have received a more substantial offer from Burnley? JLAA in particular looks hungry to prove his worth, with some decent displays in pre-season, coupled with the well held belief that he's the most natural finisher at the club...could we be about to see that potential come to fruition? Personnally, I'd prefer to keep both JLAA and Jermaine and see Ryan Woods depart as we've got more strength in depth in midfield than we have had for years. Could MMs game plan be to keep the nucleus of the squad we've fine well to assemble together with a sprinkling of loanees as the season progresses? the return to fitness of both Weso & NKP will be like having two new signings in itself, and coupled with the number of ex-captains we've got in the squad, we seem to be much more better prepared than our last tilt at L1 football.... Thoughts? JLAA most natural finisher at the club??? Good player but certainly not a natural finisher.
|
|
|
Post by markglasgow on Aug 2, 2015 1:19:32 GMT 1
But here is the way i see it. At end of last season, MM offered them contracts, but they decided to try elsewhere first.... so he brought in replacements..... then when the offers that they sought elsewhere did not come, so they asked if they could stay.... now we are trying to force out Vernon and Demitriou or cling to the hope of a massive payout from a untried youngster in the hope we can get funds to keep these 2. In my humble opinion, we would have been better keeping Mangan.... The question would have to be why have we brought in fringe guys like McKnight, Whalley, Brown etc but not offer contracts to integral players like A-A and JG. Not sure if these players were offered contracts originally. I can't remember MM mentioning anything about these contracts being rejected However. Indeed I think MM said JLAA was just training with us because he stayed local. Paul you suggested these players 'tried elsewhere first'. Again I have no knowledge of these players being anywhere else than with us from day one of pre-season training. You also say he brought in replacements for these players. Not sure who these replacements are. Not aware of any new centre back to replace JG. We did of course bring in McAlinden but this is Mangan's replacement. Not JLAA's. Vernon and Demetriou were identified as weak links MM at the end of the season. To suggest these guys are being made scapegoats simply because JLAA and JG have somehow come back from trawling the FL after failing to find a more lucrative deal. For me both players should be commended for their patience and loyalty. I'm sure we'll make it worth their while when the contracts are finally offered but several weeks later and ON the verge of the New season and still these guys have no security. Would have very much to have seen Mangan stay too. I expect this decision was made from a fitness/financial perspective rather than a talent standpoint.
|
|
|
Post by Scarecrow on Aug 2, 2015 5:58:27 GMT 1
But here is the way i see it. At end of last season, MM offered them contracts, but they decided to try elsewhere first.... so he brought in replacements..... then when the offers that they sought elsewhere did not come, so they asked if they could stay.... now we are trying to force out Vernon and Demitriou or cling to the hope of a massive payout from a untried youngster in the hope we can get funds to keep these 2. In my humble opinion, we would have been better keeping Mangan.... The question would have to be why have we brought in fringe guys like McKnight, Whalley, Brown etc but not offer contracts to integral players like A-A and JG. Not sure if these players were offered contracts originally. I can't remember MM mentioning anything about these contracts being rejected However. Indeed I think MM said JLAA was just training with us because he stayed local. Paul you suggested these players 'tried elsewhere first'. Again I have no knowledge of these players being anywhere else than with us from day one of pre-season training. You also say he brought in replacements for these players. Not sure who these replacements are. Not aware of any new centre back to replace JG. We did of course bring in McAlinden but this is Mangan's replacement. Not JLAA's. Vernon and Demetriou were identified as weak links MM at the end of the season. To suggest these guys are being made scapegoats simply because JLAA and JG have somehow come back from trawling the FL after failing to find a more lucrative deal. For me both players should be commended for their patience and loyalty. I'm sure we'll make it worth their while when the contracts are finally offered but several weeks later and ON the verge of the New season and still these guys have no security. Would have very much to have seen Mangan stay too. I expect this decision was made from a fitness/financial perspective rather than a talent standpoint. Right I think it is pretty obvious the fringe players like Whalley will be on a significantly less wage than a striker like AA. I can only assume but my guess would be that Grandison was on a contract previously heavily dependent on appearances given his injury record. As such new deals would provide a financial burden. While the players may have indeed been at training from day 1 I am sure their agents have been looking around for the best deal at the best club possible. They do need to stay fit so using the facilities would be a smart thing to do. What I think has happened is that MM forsaw this happening and MW expected either Goldson or Woods to be sold by now which would provide the funds for their contacts to be covered. Unfortunately this hasn't materialised and as such the players on board have filled up the budget. I do fear that time is running out and either we are going to have to do a cut price deal on one of our most valuable assets by taking them to market or cut the other two loose. Which one would you guys go for? It's a tough call.
|
|
|
Post by davycrockett on Aug 2, 2015 7:51:31 GMT 1
we'll no doubt offer JLAA a two year contract then say we no longer need him next season, he is 30.....
|
|
|
Post by northwestman on Aug 2, 2015 9:14:55 GMT 1
we'll no doubt offer JLAA a two year contract then say we no longer need him next season, he is 30..... Premier League Clubs fare even worse as they often hand out 5 year contracts in order to avoid being hit by the Bosman ruling. I recall Aston Villa being stuck with some character who wasn't wanted after a few months but had four and a half years left on his contract.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2015 10:31:15 GMT 1
If Grandison stays on Non Contract terms until the finances can be sorted, then he moves up to club legend in my view.
|
|
|
Post by CopthorneShrew on Aug 2, 2015 10:49:31 GMT 1
Interesting one this now with the season nearly here. I wouldn't have thought there would be many cases of League 1 clubs having players signed on non-contract terms but it is the only way for JG & JLAA to be able to play next week in my eyes.
As mentioned above the loyalty so far from the pair has been wonderful & assuming they do both re-sign permanently I hope they get a fantastic reception at the nearest available opportunity.
|
|
|
Post by onthepitch on Aug 2, 2015 11:40:25 GMT 1
The thing is most of what is being said here is pure speculation.
I'm pretty confident they will both sign this week whatever happens with the outbound players.
What about Patterson though?
|
|
|
Post by northwestman on Aug 2, 2015 11:50:53 GMT 1
It would be useful to sign Patterson as we do need some cover at RB.
|
|
|
Post by Optimistic Shrew on Aug 2, 2015 12:03:41 GMT 1
It would be useful to sign Patterson as we do need some cover at RB. Ogogo can play right back if anything happens to Tootle. I'd rather signe JLAA and JG up rather than go for someone else.
|
|
|
Post by onthepitch on Aug 2, 2015 12:10:15 GMT 1
Yea... I think he may miss out this time.
MM has said he's sure he'll go on to play league football at some point so maybe there's a clue in that, but since then he's talked of getting these last three players through the door so who knows?
Ogogo looks a great signing to me.
|
|
|
Post by davycrockett on Aug 2, 2015 13:16:03 GMT 1
Interesting one this now with the season nearly here. I wouldn't have thought there would be many cases of League 1 clubs having players signed on non-contract terms but it is the only way for JG & JLAA to be able to play next week in my eyes. As mentioned above the loyalty so far from the pair has been wonderful & assuming they do both re-sign permanently I hope they get a fantastic reception at the nearest available opportunity. Would have been even loyaler if he'd signed a contract when offered rather than wait to see what other clubs came in for him. No clubs came in so he became 'loyal'....
|
|
|
Post by CopthorneShrew on Aug 2, 2015 13:24:55 GMT 1
Interesting one this now with the season nearly here. I wouldn't have thought there would be many cases of League 1 clubs having players signed on non-contract terms but it is the only way for JG & JLAA to be able to play next week in my eyes. As mentioned above the loyalty so far from the pair has been wonderful & assuming they do both re-sign permanently I hope they get a fantastic reception at the nearest available opportunity. Would have been even loyaler if he'd signed a contract when offered rather than wait to see what other clubs came in for him. No clubs came in so he became 'loyal'.... Embarrassing post.
|
|
|
Post by mattmw on Aug 2, 2015 14:11:47 GMT 1
I do find the situation with these two a bit puzzling
I have to admit I thought both had actually been offered contracts, but had yet to sign them while they waited to see if other clubs come in with offers for them.
However from what a lot of people seem to be saying its not clear we have actually yet offered them deals but are waiting on some " deal" to be done involving other players before their contracts are formally offered to them
Hopefully it all works out but after both players have played such a big role in pre season it would be worrying if they could get snapped up and leave us before the season starts
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2015 14:18:22 GMT 1
This is starting to look like a mess.
MM is on record as stating that both Grando and JLAA were offered contracts at the start of the summer but that and that they were weighing up options elsewhere.
As it stands now, it would appear that the club has spent its budgets on recruiting players and has insufficient monies to sign up these two players (who would appear to have been unable to find another club), with the net result that two other players have to make way for them. Mickey D will be a loss and I am surprised that he has been told to leave after playing 42 games last season (Sadler in my view does not bring anything extra to the table). However with Vernon I can understand MMs thinking.
MM has stated that he wants to sort out this week but unless MD and Vernon find clubs or are paid off or we finally get an attractive offer for Woods or Goldson, we are stuck.
Lets not forget that Grando turned down a new contract last time after his injury but came back six monthswith his tail between his legs - therefore not convinced about his loyalty at all
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2015 14:35:01 GMT 1
This is starting to look like a mess. MM is on record as stating that both Grando and JLAA were offered contracts at the start of the summer but that and that they were weighing up options elsewhere. As it stands now, it would appear that the club has spent its budgets on recruiting players and has insufficient monies to sign up these two players (who would appear to have been unable to find another club), with the net result that two other players have to make way for them. Mickey D will be a loss and I am surprised that he has been told to leave after playing 42 games last season (Sadler in my view does not bring anything extra to the table). However with Vernon I can understand MMs thinking. MM has stated that he wants to sort out this week but unless MD and Vernon find clubs or are paid off or we finally get an attractive offer for Woods or Goldson, we are stuck. Lets not forget that Grando turned down a new contract last time after his injury but came back six monthswith his tail between his legs - therefore not convinced about his loyalty at all Totally agree about Micky D and Sadler. No doubt we have the money to sign JG and JLAA it's keeping within the 60% that is the issue and why we need some revenue coming in.
|
|
|
Post by shrewforever on Aug 2, 2015 14:45:21 GMT 1
Personally I think Lord Lucan is living in Monkmoor, or possibly Meole........
Rafa Benitez put an offer in for the Copthorne fish and chip shop but got guzumped....
and Bruce Lee runs baking classes on Wednesday nights for the local WI in Gains Park..........
What I do know for a fact however is that Downie would have kept Mangan and probably brought Dunbavin back which is why he doesnt work in football Management.
|
|
|
Post by gainsparkshrew on Aug 2, 2015 15:06:44 GMT 1
This is starting to look like a mess. MM is on record as stating that both Grando and JLAA were offered contracts at the start of the summer but that and that they were weighing up options elsewhere. As it stands now, it would appear that the club has spent its budgets on recruiting players and has insufficient monies to sign up these two players (who would appear to have been unable to find another club), with the net result that two other players have to make way for them. Mickey D will be a loss and I am surprised that he has been told to leave after playing 42 games last season (Sadler in my view does not bring anything extra to the table). However with Vernon I can understand MMs thinking. MM has stated that he wants to sort out this week but unless MD and Vernon find clubs or are paid off or we finally get an attractive offer for Woods or Goldson, we are stuck. Lets not forget that Grando turned down a new contract last time after his injury but came back six monthswith his tail between his legs - therefore not convinced about his loyalty at all I have always understood it to be that if a new contract is offered then it has to stay on the table until the 30th June.If it isn't signed by then the club can withdraw based on the belief that the player is off somewhere else. Obviously not in the case of Ginelly because he is so young that a fee will be due. I can only assume that both JLAAs and Grandos agents convinced them that there was another contract on offer,and on better terms elsewhere,so they in affect made themselves redundant by not signing the contract that we offered. Certainly JLAA was strongly linked to Plymouth and there was paper talk of Grando going to Birmingham or even back to Coventry. Obviously the club believed that both where off elsewhere and spent the money, that was earmarked for their wages,elsewhere. Things didn't work out for either player with prospective suitors and they have now found themselves without a club or a contract.Obviously it's far from an ideal situation, it's obvious that MM wants both of them,due to the number of pre-season games & minutes that they have played,but cannot do anything unless we can get players out of the door as we have spent our budget.Hence why MW is trying to come to an outside of a tribuneral deal with Burnley for Ginelly in order to get some money in. Squeeky bum time next week, because we need to sign them up, are non-contracted players allowed if you have effectively spent your budget? Plus there is always the worry that either player could leave if a firm contract is on the table elsewhere
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2015 15:16:19 GMT 1
With less than a week now before the season kicks off this is turning into an embarrassment. It is hard to draw any other conclusion given that there is a lack of communication about the situation coming out of the club. I hope to goodness that this is sorted in the next few days.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2015 15:22:33 GMT 1
An embarrassment? Give over.
|
|
|
Post by shrewswolf on Aug 2, 2015 17:12:40 GMT 1
As was the case with Mangan and Grant, I believe these two never had an offer on the table from ourselves due to tight finances and instead 'terms' were just discussed until the situation changed. They've both trained with us all of pre season and Micky seems confident (as is the case every week) that the deals will be tied up in the coming days. I'm sure they've had other offers but maybe none that are significantly better than ours will be and so they want to stay. However, imagine we kept all the free money aside for these two and they then spent all summer considering options and eventually moving on - causing us to miss out on all other targets and leaving us with a small squad. That would be embarrassing. Now it seems they'll both sign (as if they and their agents would still be hanging around here without a pretty serious guarentee). All I want to know is where are they suddenly getting the funds from. All this 'stuff behind the scenes' nonsense sounds very dodgy to me.
|
|