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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2015 7:41:16 GMT 1
20/2, Cook and Trott go cheaply again. Our top order is a real concern, Lyth has to get the nod in the second test for me. I would move Trott to number 3. Play him in the position he is comfortable in and I agree let's test out Adam Lyth in the 2nd test. We need to know our best eleven before the Kiwis and Aussies arrive.
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Post by vanner on Apr 16, 2015 7:48:26 GMT 1
Stick with cook and Trott. They'll come good. Lyth and Hales are sexier options of course. Ali tredders and Woakes for Jordan and we've got ourselves a very strong 11.
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Post by vanner on Apr 16, 2015 10:05:04 GMT 1
Dan_brigham: Only three century opening partnerships since Strauss retired. All between Cook and ... Compton. Interesting stat
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Post by shrewinjapan on Apr 16, 2015 10:41:15 GMT 1
So how long does Cook get as his woeful run of scores continues? No hundreds in 61 consecutive test and odi innings I think it is now.
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Post by lenny on Apr 16, 2015 11:24:30 GMT 1
I think Cook finding form against India in last summer's test series will have bought him some time. I don't care if he doesn't score hundreds if he does what he did then and rack up half centuries, but if he reverts to being dismissed habitually for less than 20, it's laughable to think he can stay in (but he will).
I definitely wouldn't drop Ballance, either. It seems people have forgotten his red ball exploits because of his being crap at ODIs. His first class average is better than Trott's, his test average (although I'm aware it's based off too few innings to be particularly statistically valid) is better than Trott's and he's playing better than Trott in this test. Why oh why would we drop the only one of our top three who has actually proven himself in test cricket over the last 18 months? It's all well and good looking at what Trott has done in the past, but there's no indication he's the same player now. I'm not against giving him a chance - his pedigree and runs last summer have earned him that opportunity - but Lyth also deserves a chance and it's one of our two openers, not Ballance, who should make way imo.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2015 12:28:05 GMT 1
So how long does Cook get as his woeful run of scores continues? No hundreds in 61 consecutive test and odi innings I think it is now. Difficult one. Drop him and we would need a new opening batsman and captain. Just hope therefore that he can come good in the next 2 test matches....
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Post by vanner on Apr 16, 2015 16:40:18 GMT 1
It was about 3 tests ago he scored 95 against the Indians. He gets the summer for me, if we lose both series then he goes as captain and as a player if his form continues.
Ballance is our number 3 nailed on for a long time. He is a run machine with incredible stats in all forms. Our 3,4,5 is as good as any in world cricket on current form.
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Post by lenny on Apr 16, 2015 18:16:23 GMT 1
It was about 3 tests ago he scored 95 against the Indians. He gets the summer for me, if we lose both series then he goes as captain and as a player if his form continues. Ballance is our number 3 nailed on for a long time. He is a run machine with incredible stats in all forms. Our 3,4,5 is as good as any in world cricket on current form. Not sure about him in limited overs stuff. Yet to perform for England and he doesn't strike me as having the requisite strike rate to succeed, but he definitely has the talent to do so. Definitely agree with his role in our test side though, glad I didn't jinx him by bigging him up. If he carries on like this he'll overtake Tendulkar before next month! Root is also so consistent, the Ashes walloping down under seems to have made him as a player. Looks nailed on to become our leading test run scorer and probably before Cook manages it at this rate! Big test for the two of them over the summer though against two good attacks, albeit in home conditions.
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Post by vanner on Apr 16, 2015 19:10:37 GMT 1
It was about 3 tests ago he scored 95 against the Indians. He gets the summer for me, if we lose both series then he goes as captain and as a player if his form continues. Ballance is our number 3 nailed on for a long time. He is a run machine with incredible stats in all forms. Our 3,4,5 is as good as any in world cricket on current form. Not sure about him in limited overs stuff. Yet to perform for England and he doesn't strike me as having the requisite strike rate to succeed, but he definitely has the talent to do so. Definitely agree with his role in our test side though, glad I didn't jinx him by bigging him up. If he carries on like this he'll overtake Tendulkar before next month! Root is also so consistent, the Ashes walloping down under seems to have made him as a player. Looks nailed on to become our leading test run scorer and probably before Cook manages it at this rate! Big test for the two of them over the summer though against two good attacks, albeit in home conditions. I wouldn't play him in the one day internationals right now, however his record in county one day cricket is the best in the country BAR NONE. He averages almost 49 at a strike rate of 88. The summer is going to be a real test, then those winter tests too... Can't remember a tougher run. The Kiwi's are a terrific outfit (albeit better at the ODI stuff) and it's a shame we're not playing them in a 3 match series. Then of course the ashes...
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Post by Worceshrew on Apr 16, 2015 23:59:50 GMT 1
Agree re Ballance, even before today's knock his performances last summer merit sticking with him, I think he'll become a big big player for us, the replacement for Trott. With Bell and Root looking really solid at 4 & 5 and the promise of Stokes and Buttler below them we have a really strong batting line up if we can sort our problems at the top of the order, especially when you consider that Broad and Jordan can both bat and we've got Moeen to come back presuming Tredwell doesn't do enough to displace him. With Woakes and Finn also to come back I think our fully fit first XI looks a pretty exciting one for the future. I don't like chopping and changing the side and regularly criticise the selectors for it but because I wanted Lyth instead of Trott before this test I maintain Lyth should be given the chance in the second, needless to say it won't happen. Getting our openers scoring runs again, Cooky in particular could be the difference between a successful summer and a dire one.
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Post by lenny on Apr 17, 2015 0:07:07 GMT 1
Assuming Woakes comes back in, who makes way? Personally would go Stokes without much hesitation but I know he has his fans and is a more explosive option than Woakes with both bat and ball.
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Post by Worceshrew on Apr 17, 2015 0:18:08 GMT 1
Assuming Woakes comes back in, who makes way? Personally would go Stokes without much hesitation but I know he has his fans and is a more explosive option than Woakes with both bat and ball. For me it's a simple decision, Woakes and Moeen would come in for Jordan and Tredwell, not sure what the situation is with Woakes and when he'll be back but Mo is flying out so will be in contention for the second test. My opinion on Jordan is slowing improving but he certainly doesn't offer anything like as much as Woakes with the ball and to me he's overrated with the bat, one for the future and deserves to be in the squad but we have better players at the moment, on recent form Woakes has arguably been our most consistent bowler.
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Post by mrbunny on Apr 17, 2015 7:25:06 GMT 1
No problem with Trott being in the squad but he shouldn't be in the side. Lyth should be opening and seeing as our 3,4 and 5 are settled then there is no place for Trott in the side as the number 6 has to be a guy who can bowl as well like Stokes or Moeen can. The same goes for any idiots who think that Pietersen should return, no space in the side for him anyway so forget him.
I am not a fan of Jordan but boy has he done well this match, bowled ok and taken two of the best slip catches we have seen in years from an English player. I'd have played Plunkett who did very well when he played last summer and with so much batting in the side we don't need Jordan or Woakes in the side and the 90mph tall bowler is different to them anyway.
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Post by shrewinjapan on Apr 17, 2015 7:25:41 GMT 1
...especially when you consider that Broad can bat Not seen much evidence in support of that statement in the last few years.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2015 20:53:26 GMT 1
Well done Jimmy!
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Post by vanner on Apr 17, 2015 20:59:51 GMT 1
Well done Jimmy!! Amazing how close his record is to Botham's. Broad is going to beat Botham too in the next couple of years but I don't think he'll beat Jimmy's 100 tests.
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Post by shrewinjapan on Apr 17, 2015 22:19:04 GMT 1
Draw. Fine match-saving century from Holder - his first in first class cricket, let alone tests.
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Post by lenny on Apr 17, 2015 23:23:36 GMT 1
Frustrating, but there wasn't a great deal more we could do thanks to some good middle order/tail batting from the windies and a pitch that held together. Personally expect we'll keep the team the same for the next test. I think it'd be harsh on Tredwell to drop him after bowling so well, and adding in Ali in place of one of the seamers is a little spin-heavy.
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Post by lenny on Apr 20, 2015 15:58:39 GMT 1
Ali expected to replace Tredwell, who got injured in the first test, and bat at number 8 for tomorrow.
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Post by Exkeeper on Apr 20, 2015 16:09:10 GMT 1
So we will have a batsman born in South Africa (Trott), a Pakistani spinner and a West Ondian seamer (Jordan). At least England won't lose, but the United Nations might.
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Post by vanner on Apr 20, 2015 16:33:09 GMT 1
So we will have a batsman born in South Africa (Trott), a Pakistani spinner and a West Ondian seamer (Jordan). At least England won't lose, but the United Nations might. Erm an English spinner actually. Born 18 June 1987 (age 27) Birmingham, West Midlands, England And Jordan's got English roots: Jordan is the son of Barbadian-born parents, but his maternal grandparents are British citizens. After initially being educated at Combermere School, where he studied alongside future singer Rihanna,[1] he gained a sporting scholarship to complete his formal education at Dulwich College, Engl But this argument got old when people would pick up on Andrew Strauss and Matt Prior not being English
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2015 17:08:31 GMT 1
Ali expected to replace Tredwell, who got injured in the first test, and bat at number 8 for tomorrow. That will be some batting line up! Sounds like Cook & Trott will be opening again. I would like to see either Liam Plunkett or Mark Wood come into contention for selection. Our seam attack could do with some more pace.
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Post by lenny on Apr 20, 2015 19:00:12 GMT 1
Personally would like to see Lyth in but there's no point bringing in Trott then dropping him after getting out to two corkers. Can happen to anyone when the ball's new and moving.
I'm not convinced Stokes is a test standard quick yet, and don't really know enough about Wood. Jack Brooks seems the standout bowler in the County Championship but seems another like Chris Rushworth who doesn't come into contention for an England spot - maybe lacking the x factor to unlock a batting line up. Still, for me, our seam line up is fine for home conditions if Woakes returns and bowls as well as he was in the last few tests against India. I also quite like the balance we have in the side (with the exception of the clones in the top 3) and find it hard to justify dropping any of our seamers - Jordan's slip catching is outstanding, he's a handy tailender and bowled really well in the first test and if we take out Stokes we lose a quick-scoring number 6, with Ali not having fully convinced me in that role yet.
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Post by vanner on Apr 20, 2015 19:19:00 GMT 1
Cook Trott Ballance Root Bell Stokes Ali Buttler Jordan Anderson Broad (can't bat to save his life atm!)
Not a bad batting lineup! I saw someone suggesting this team, thought it was quite exciting:
Cook Ali Ballance Root Bell Stokes Buttler Rashid Jordan Broad Anderson
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Post by lenny on Apr 20, 2015 20:09:59 GMT 1
Definitely wouldn't want Ali opening unless it's sure that he's over his short ball struggles; don't look forward to him being bounced out as reliably as Cook and his outside edge.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2015 11:29:16 GMT 1
Given the heavy test match schedule England face over the next 12 months I think it's time to use the next 2 test matches to give the likes of Lyth, Rashid & Plunkett a run out.
My eleven would be:
Cook Lyth Ballance Bell Root Stokes Buttler Ali Rashid Plunkett Anderson
Plenty of batting & a good variation in our bowling options...
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Post by lenny on Apr 23, 2015 15:57:05 GMT 1
50 for Cook and England's first 100 opening partnership in over 2 years. Tempting though it may be to call for Lyth's inclusion, looks like we're set for the, ahem, fireworks of a Cook/Trott partnership for the summer. Lyth's time will surely come, plenty of time ahead for him (and Lees).
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Post by lenny on Apr 23, 2015 16:21:48 GMT 1
Since the start of the India series, Cook's batting average (including today's so far) is 47.1. Not too bad.
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Post by vanner on Apr 23, 2015 17:09:46 GMT 1
Needs a hundred today to silence the doubters for a while. Just hoping he can hit form at the right time ready for the Ashes! This reminds me England 2010/11 - Build slow with Cook Trott and Ballance (instead of Strauss) before the stroke makers come in and decimate tired bowlers...
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Post by lenny on Apr 23, 2015 17:59:26 GMT 1
Whoops.
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