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Post by Catalyst Cartel on Sept 1, 2014 22:28:13 GMT 1
Is singing show us your passports worse than Luton singing you're Welsh and you know you are with Welsh sheepsh##ging barstewards you know what you are etc. No I think not. So if people get banned for that then are they gonna start arresting away fans also? Where do you draw the line? It all gets started in 18 at the back somewhere and the rest join in. The Luton lad in the striped top was probably the worst behaved person in the ground.
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Post by QuorndonShrew on Sept 1, 2014 22:29:49 GMT 1
Is singing show us your passports worse than Luton singing you're Welsh and you know you are with Welsh sheepsh##ging barstewards you know what you are etc. No I think not. So if people get banned for that then are they gonna start arresting away fans also? Where do you draw the line? It all gets started in 18 at the back somewhere and the rest join in. The Luton lad in the striped top was probably the worst behaved person in the ground. Expect to be told that you 'don't get it'. And then not get told what 'it' is.
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Post by markglasgow on Sept 1, 2014 22:33:04 GMT 1
What question? It's simple my friend. Perhaps a chat with Alan Roberts over what is 'acceptable' may help. I would suggest using some common sense but looking at the contents of your posts, I'm not sure that is an option.
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Post by champagneprince on Sept 1, 2014 22:36:35 GMT 1
It just means that they got it wrong inside a football ground. Getting it 'wrong' inside of a football ground has severe implications. Claiming you got carried away or just followed the crowd won't be defence that holds much credence. Doesn't matter what age you are or what block you stand in there is no hiding place from the current ground regulations that cover all of us as soon as we set foot inside any football stadium. We have a core of idiots at our club whose choice of songs at times are simply unacceptable. Would be delighted to see the systematic rooting out of these individuals. Perhaps a few 'high-profile casualties' would go some way to help focus those who mistakenly think that some of the songs belted out on Saturday are simply harmless 'banter'.
But let's be careful here. It's the line of what is and what isn't acceptable that's unclear.
If some of the crowd had used the n-word in a chant, then the whole stadium would be in uproar about it with probably many people deeply offended by it. With this one, it's unclear because it doesn't appear to be that much different to sheepsh*ggers' and the fans are hardly in uproar about it like they would be with the n-word
So there is a line, and that does hold credence, because it's about consistency on what is acceptable by the club.
I've no problem with the club having a big push on this with increased education instead of a few players holding up a sign in a team photo. Once that's done then go for it, kick everyone out that goes beyond the line that is set. But you can't have one rule for one and one for another if you're starting to talk about legal issues.
Make the line clear and address it from that point.
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Post by mattmw on Sept 1, 2014 22:36:46 GMT 1
I find the "let him die " chants far worse . Would the club deal with these people if it was reported ? Looking at the act it covers "racist and indecent" chanting so if reported the authorities would have investigate if the chant was "indecent" and thought to be so by the "victim" or those treating them Guess in that case it would be down to context - should a player clearly be ok and milking the injury with a wink to the crowd probably not. If the player is clearly badly injured or unconscious and receiving serious medical attention and the crowd sang "let him die" that could be perceived as "indecent" Best bet would be to report anything you find racist or indecent and let the authorities decide if it warrants investigation.
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Post by markglasgow on Sept 1, 2014 22:36:52 GMT 1
The word is used so regularly it's almost lost it's credibility. Yeah it's all b*llocks huh??? Thankfully the ill-educated and ill-informed don't get to decide what is 'credible' and what isn't.
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Post by markglasgow on Sept 1, 2014 22:45:40 GMT 1
Getting it 'wrong' inside of a football ground has severe implications. Claiming you got carried away or just followed the crowd won't be defence that holds much credence. Doesn't matter what age you are or what block you stand in there is no hiding place from the current ground regulations that cover all of us as soon as we set foot inside any football stadium. We have a core of idiots at our club whose choice of songs at times are simply unacceptable. Would be delighted to see the systematic rooting out of these individuals. Perhaps a few 'high-profile casualties' would go some way to help focus those who mistakenly think that some of the songs belted out on Saturday are simply harmless 'banter'.
But let's be careful here. It's the line of what is and what isn't acceptable that's unclear.
If some of the crowd had used the n-word in a chant, then the whole stadium would be in uproar about it with probably many people deeply offended by it. With this one, it's unclear because it doesn't appear to be that much different to sheepsh*ggers' and the fans are hardly in uproar about it like they would be with the n-word
So there is a line, and that does hold credence, because it's about consistency on what is acceptable by the club.
I've no problem with the club having a big push on this with increased education instead of a few players holding up a sign in a team photo. Once that's done then go for it, kick everyone out that goes beyond the line that is set. But you can't have one rule for one and one for another if you're starting to talk about legal issues.
Make the line clear and address it from that point. Hmmm. The debate here shows that some folks struggle with coming to terms with what is offensive so perhaps some guidance may be required for those who cannot figure it out themselves. We have similar guidelines here in Scotland which 'helped' fans negotiate the maze of religious bigotry which is deemed to be just as offensive as it's racial counterpart. www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/bigotry-bill-fans-told-the-songs-1089573
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Post by bictonblue46 on Sept 1, 2014 22:49:15 GMT 1
There are some very good posts about his subject,am I right in thinking that Grandison was racially abused at Hartlepool a couple of seasons ago? Did anything actually happen with this?
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Post by theshrews81 on Sept 1, 2014 22:49:54 GMT 1
I once provided written, corroborated evidence, including a photograph, of a Town supporter who made several racist remarks/chants at Wembley in 2009. It was sent to a former General Manager who did nothing with it, and was followed up by a letter to the Chairman. The chairman then chose to take the p**s out of me about it in a meeting a year or so later and to my knowledge, nothing was ever done. Great to see a little bit of progress at GM - the overhaul of the club is almost complete. That is shocking to hear from the club. Major disapproval for all involved in not investigating.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2014 22:51:45 GMT 1
The word is used so regularly it's almost lost it's credibility. Yeah it's all b*llocks huh??? Thankfully the ill-educated and ill-informed don't get to decide what is 'credible' and what isn't. Expect a really long winded reply that contains a few predictable insults and labels such as lick spittle lefty, self loathing, loony left, blah blah blah that actually contains nothing factual or thread related and is indeed a heady mix of lies, ignorance and blind bigotry, dressed up very cleverly to make the poster look like he has the faintest idea what he's talking about!
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Post by QuorndonShrew on Sept 1, 2014 22:53:32 GMT 1
But let's be careful here. It's the line of what is and what isn't acceptable that's unclear.
If some of the crowd had used the n-word in a chant, then the whole stadium would be in uproar about it with probably many people deeply offended by it. With this one, it's unclear because it doesn't appear to be that much different to sheepsh*ggers' and the fans are hardly in uproar about it like they would be with the n-word
So there is a line, and that does hold credence, because it's about consistency on what is acceptable by the club.
I've no problem with the club having a big push on this with increased education instead of a few players holding up a sign in a team photo. Once that's done then go for it, kick everyone out that goes beyond the line that is set. But you can't have one rule for one and one for another if you're starting to talk about legal issues.
Make the line clear and address it from that point. Hmmm. The debate here shows that some folks struggle with coming to terms with what is offensive so perhaps some guidance may be required for those who cannot figure it out themselves. We have similar guidelines here in Scotland which 'helped' fans negotiate the maze of religious bigotry which is deemed to be just as offensive as it's racial counterpart. www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/bigotry-bill-fans-told-the-songs-1089573What you can and can't say/sing as defined by local government and more than likely local faith leaders. Can't fathom anything worse.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2014 22:53:37 GMT 1
There are some very good posts about his subject,am I right in thinking that Grandison was racially abused at Hartlepool a couple of seasons ago? Did anything actually happen with this? I actually recall someone, wouldn't be fair to name the tit, who claimed that Grandison only reached cult status cos he was black!
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on Sept 1, 2014 22:56:00 GMT 1
Wow, you can't even mock someone's ethnicity these days without being accused of racism.
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Post by QuorndonShrew on Sept 1, 2014 22:56:40 GMT 1
Yeah it's all b*llocks huh??? Thankfully the ill-educated and ill-informed don't get to decide what is 'credible' and what isn't. Expect a really long winded reply that contains a few predictable insults and labels such as lick spittle lefty, self loathing, loony left, blah blah blah that actually contains nothing factual or thread related and is indeed a heady mix of lies, ignorance and blind bigotry, dressed up very cleverly to make the poster look like he has the faintest idea what he's talking about! Oh diddums. And there was me about to write a poem in your honour.
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Post by salopsbluearmy on Sept 1, 2014 22:57:27 GMT 1
The lad in the striped in the Luton end was on the end of many chants and the one that made many cringe was "Stripey Stripey Your Mums A wh**e"
I know 1 very well known supporter being told to pipe down with his comments and the usual "Show us your passports" "back to your curry house" chants were out in force but I know the majority ignored these to sing Pro Shrewsbury songs which unfortunately has been overshadowed down to the positioning of the "pro" singers & "banter" singers
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Post by champagneprince on Sept 1, 2014 22:59:00 GMT 1
So is sheepsh*ggers offensive ?
Or is it so close to the line that we don't bother about that one ?
And I am sure the authorities have better things to do than investigate every sheepsh*gger complaint that might come their way next game.
You can't have two rules and you have to start by making it clear and then enforcing it rigorously with no exceptions. There's nothing wrong with that at all but there is something wrong with calling people 'bigots', 'unintelligent' 'racists' just because they happen to sit in a certain part of the ground and if they sometimes overstep an inconsistent line within the alcohol influenced, hotbed of emotion that is a football stadium.
As for the sheepish*ggers word, do we actually agree with the opposition fans in that the Welsh are sheepish*gging bstards when we start singing Engerland in return and in unison ?
The lines keep getting unclearer the more you look at it.
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Post by SY3 on Sept 1, 2014 22:59:06 GMT 1
The word is used so regularly it's almost lost it's credibility. Yeah it's all b*llocks huh??? Thankfully the ill-educated and ill-informed don't get to decide what is 'credible' and what isn't. Like you? Oh i see, you're implying that i have no education. Muppet.
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Post by pughywasfree on Sept 1, 2014 23:03:06 GMT 1
But let's be careful here. It's the line of what is and what isn't acceptable that's unclear.
If some of the crowd had used the n-word in a chant, then the whole stadium would be in uproar about it with probably many people deeply offended by it. With this one, it's unclear because it doesn't appear to be that much different to sheepsh*ggers' and the fans are hardly in uproar about it like they would be with the n-word
So there is a line, and that does hold credence, because it's about consistency on what is acceptable by the club.
I've no problem with the club having a big push on this with increased education instead of a few players holding up a sign in a team photo. Once that's done then go for it, kick everyone out that goes beyond the line that is set. But you can't have one rule for one and one for another if you're starting to talk about legal issues.
Make the line clear and address it from that point. Hmmm. The debate here shows that some folks struggle with coming to terms with what is offensive so perhaps some guidance may be required for those who cannot figure it out themselves. We have similar guidelines here in Scotland which 'helped' fans negotiate the maze of religious bigotry which is deemed to be just as offensive as it's racial counterpart. www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/bigotry-bill-fans-told-the-songs-1089573I found this one in the banned section interesting... Super Killie Some versions of this Kilmarnock fans’ song refer to “black b******s”. It is a jibe that Ayr United fans are unclean, and the fact Ayr play in black and white, rather than any racist motivations. However, the phrase on its own is offensive.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2014 23:18:56 GMT 1
Expect a really long winded reply that contains a few predictable insults and labels such as lick spittle lefty, self loathing, loony left, blah blah blah that actually contains nothing factual or thread related and is indeed a heady mix of lies, ignorance and blind bigotry, dressed up very cleverly to make the poster look like he has the faintest idea what he's talking about! Oh diddums. And there was me about to write a poem in your honour. Don't waste yourself Leicester, stick to what you're good at
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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2014 23:29:57 GMT 1
Forget the subject of this for one second and what's been said ... What would match days bee without block 18 and 19
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Post by ssshrew on Sept 1, 2014 23:36:53 GMT 1
There are some very good posts about his subject,am I right in thinking that Grandison was racially abused at Hartlepool a couple of seasons ago? Did anything actually happen with this? No I think it was Marvin Morgan. Never heard any outcome though.
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Post by venceremos on Sept 1, 2014 23:53:39 GMT 1
Makes us look like a bunch of inbred rednecks. Morons. And what was that you said about some perspective being needed...` ... in the context of global security threats as opposed to a moronic chant from a few idiots in a football crowd. Perspective indeed.
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Post by bobbytheblock19er on Sept 2, 2014 6:53:19 GMT 1
I find the "let him die " chants far worse . Would the club deal with these people if it was reported ? You really don't get it do you? we're you even there ?
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Post by bobbytheblock19er on Sept 2, 2014 7:01:30 GMT 1
If Shrewsbury town had never sung the passport song before , I could understand this , but I think people are taking it out of proportion. The things Luton were singing were reportable , but if you go to a steward they would laugh at you and tell you to **** off! I heard a bloke down the front shouting **** off Abdul to the lad , and another bloke giving it the turban sign on the head.
What really makes me laugh is people just presuming , lecturing people who have valid opinions , and slaughtering people who say one thing they don't agree with . Don't know how people can comment that weren't even there . Luton fans singing your an embarrassment at town Saturday , should have joined in.
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Post by jonbond on Sept 2, 2014 7:44:58 GMT 1
But let's be careful here. It's the line of what is and what isn't acceptable that's unclear.
If some of the crowd had used the n-word in a chant, then the whole stadium would be in uproar about it with probably many people deeply offended by it. With this one, it's unclear because it doesn't appear to be that much different to sheepsh*ggers' and the fans are hardly in uproar about it like they would be with the n-word
So there is a line, and that does hold credence, because it's about consistency on what is acceptable by the club.
I've no problem with the club having a big push on this with increased education instead of a few players holding up a sign in a team photo. Once that's done then go for it, kick everyone out that goes beyond the line that is set. But you can't have one rule for one and one for another if you're starting to talk about legal issues.
Make the line clear and address it from that point. Hmmm. The debate here shows that some folks struggle with coming to terms with what is offensive so perhaps some guidance may be required for those who cannot figure it out themselves. We have similar guidelines here in Scotland which 'helped' fans negotiate the maze of religious bigotry which is deemed to be just as offensive as it's racial counterpart. www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/bigotry-bill-fans-told-the-songs-1089573So you now accept it isn't that simple and obvious what is allowed or not and in the absence of guidelines from the club you have this to offer . What I get my friend is that you are a condescending prat of the highest order
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Post by davycrockett on Sept 2, 2014 8:24:01 GMT 1
With so many on here knowing who was involved in this racist chanting Alan Roberts should be kept busy today.. Anyone worried cos CCTV will show those chanting, so a few can expect a knock on the door hopefully..........
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2014 8:44:11 GMT 1
Leaving the insults for a moment, the fact is that society is always evolving, norms and values change. In that sense, those who say the boundaries can be blurred are correct, it is an evolution of values. In this case, clearly for the better. In modern 21st century Britain this kind of nonsense is no longer deemed acceptable. Which begs the question what exactly are those who defend this unacceptable behaviour seeking to defend? It's like someone saying 10 years ago that the internet will never catch on; hold that opinion if you will but the times will change without you. And in the case of racism you'll look a rather lonely and bigoted individual. You may even be breaking the laws enacted to reflect societies changing views.
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Sept 2, 2014 8:51:57 GMT 1
Do most fans take their passports to away games? I think not. Therefore it was a blantantly rediculous chant destined for dosappointment. In seriousness, and as a lick spittle lefty of the first order, one bunch of Neanderthals being offensive to another bunch of Neanderthals? **** em and leave them to it. They would be too thick to understand anyway! This is how I kinda see it. One bunch of lads will say something (anything) to look to take the p**s. The other lads will respond in kind. That's about it. That's football. I mean I have heard Brighton fans bemoaning the amount of homophobic abuse thrown their way over the years yet I've stood amongst Brighton fans at Rotherham who have no issues shouting 'northern this and northern that'. Go Figure. I guess the unfortunate thing is that everyone else has to sit there and endure it. Was this one lad singled out for a reason? Was he just minding his own business or was he giving the Town fans grief?
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Post by Catalyst Cartel on Sept 2, 2014 9:15:01 GMT 1
Do most fans take their passports to away games? I think not. Therefore it was a blantantly rediculous chant destined for dosappointment. In seriousness, and as a lick spittle lefty of the first order, one bunch of Neanderthals being offensive to another bunch of Neanderthals? **** em and leave them to it. They would be too thick to understand anyway! This is how I kinda see it. One bunch of lads will say something (anything) to look to take the p**s. The other lads will respond in kind. That's about it. That's football. I mean I have heard Brighton fans bemoaning the amount of homophobic abuse thrown their way over the years yet I've stood amongst Brighton fans at Rotherham who have no issues shouting 'northern this and northern that'. Go Figure. I guess the unfortunate thing is that everyone else has to sit there and endure it. Was this one lad singled out for a reason? Was he just minding his own business or was he giving the Town fans grief? The lad was giving it the big un all gamea, even his top off and seemed to be enjoying it. I dont think it was him who made the complaint. Another set of Asian gentlemen around 4 or 5 made the complaint at half time and seemed to point at top end of block 18.
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Sept 2, 2014 9:31:07 GMT 1
This is how I kinda see it. One bunch of lads will say something (anything) to look to take the p**s. The other lads will respond in kind. That's about it. That's football. I mean I have heard Brighton fans bemoaning the amount of homophobic abuse thrown their way over the years yet I've stood amongst Brighton fans at Rotherham who have no issues shouting 'northern this and northern that'. Go Figure. I guess the unfortunate thing is that everyone else has to sit there and endure it. Was this one lad singled out for a reason? Was he just minding his own business or was he giving the Town fans grief? The lad was giving it the big un all gamea, even his top off and seemed to be enjoying it. I dont think it was him who made the complaint. Another set of Asian gentlemen around 4 or 5 made the complaint at half time and seemed to point at top end of block 18. Sent from my C5303 using proboards Thanks for the info. Then that's what happens isn't it. If some lad is going to behave like that then it's inevitable that he is going to get some abuse back (and some). Not right like. Not nice for the rest of us. But that's what happens. Once the abuse starts it will escalate and then it's gloves off and anything goes. Plenty of people not involved have to sit through it all of course but for the most part the chants will be aimed at people who are more than happy to give as much as they receive. And I honestly don't think you will stop it either. I'm not entirely sure you can get yourself into trouble from making reference to a passport or a curry house. Well as much as you can about referencing sheep, someone's sexual preference, hair length or size of gut. And that seems to go unpunished most weeks.
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