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Post by Feedo Gnasher on Jun 19, 2010 13:04:40 GMT 1
I started this thread because we've had similar here over the last year, and I wanted to see how people would react this time, involving a great player, comapared with last time, with an under-pressure manager
Surely those arguing either side of the debate have the right to think their opinion. My opinion is that it was out of order for Rooney to say that, after the level of performance from him personally and from the whole team.
It is also well within peoples rights to think that it was said in the heat of the moment ad to forget about it and move on. The only thing that confuses me is that some of the people with this view clearly attacked Simpson for doing something very similar
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Post by Pilch on Jun 19, 2010 13:08:21 GMT 1
why dont you put yourself in rooneys boots just given 100% for england and produced nothing 5 seconds after the final whistle 1000s are booing and a camera is thrust into his face he was probably saying the same as the other 11 "nice to see your own fans booing you and they are the loyal supporters" what was everyone expecting ? would they have prefered it had he prostrated himself ? Equally put yourself into the position of an England fan who has spent a small fortune to support his team at the World Cup and has just witnessed the most inept display in living memory. Against Algeria. HOW MUCH DID THEY SPEND ? Both parties were acting in the heat of the moment. If you're a footballer and you do your job well you get the adulation and adoration of thousands MORE WERE APPLAUDING THAN BOOING They should be able to take some boo-ing at the end of the game on the chin. YEAH, THEY SHOULD ALL TROT OFF SMILING And camera thrust into his face? I don't think so, more like he sought one out to make his point. I KNOW IT MAKES YOUR STORY SOUND WORSE BUT I THINK YOU'LL FIND HE DIDN'T
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Post by monkee on Jun 19, 2010 13:11:25 GMT 1
I started this thread because we've had similar here over the last year, and I wanted to see how people would react this time, involving a great player, comapared with last time, with an under-pressure manager Surely those arguing either side of the debate have the right to think their opinion. My opinion is that it was out of order for Rooney to say that, after the level of performance from him personally and from the whole team. It is also well within peoples rights to think that it was said in the heat of the moment ad to forget about it and move on. The only thing that confuses me is that some of the people with this view clearly attacked Simpson for doing something very similar i think he has the right to say what he wants, people have a right to boo, but i think they leave themselves open to get a reply in kind. personally i dont like to see it, but i think when people have paid huge sums of money to go out there and support, they should expect the players to get over their problems and do their best which they plainly didnt.
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Post by shrew4life on Jun 19, 2010 13:14:34 GMT 1
why dont you put yourself in rooneys boots just given 100% for england and produced nothing 5 seconds after the final whistle 1000s are booing and a camera is thrust into his face he was probably saying the same as the other 11 "nice to see your own fans booing you and they are the loyal supporters" what was everyone expecting ? would they have prefered it had he prostrated himself ? Equally put yourself into the position of an England fan who has spent a small fortune to support his team at the World Cup and has just witnessed the most inept display in living memory. Against Algeria. HOW MUCH DID THEY SPEND ? Both parties were acting in the heat of the moment. If you're a footballer and you do your job well you get the adulation and adoration of thousands MORE WERE APPLAUDING THAN BOOING They should be able to take some boo-ing at the end of the game on the chin. YEAH, THEY SHOULD ALL TROT OFF SMILING And camera thrust into his face? I don't think so, more like he sought one out to make his point. I KNOW IT MAKES YOUR STORY SOUND WORSE BUT I THINK YOU'LL FIND HE DIDN'T How could you possibly know that more were applauding than booing? If we were talking about anyone else who wasn't a manure player I have a slight suspicion blingy and pilch would change what they are saying.
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Post by Pilch on Jun 19, 2010 13:20:51 GMT 1
i've got eyes
i cant be bothered to hunt for ever but heres one
someone seems to think rooney went looking for a camera and everyone was booing and they think everyone else has rose tinted specs on does make me laugh
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Post by shrew4life on Jun 19, 2010 13:35:07 GMT 1
Blind loyalty that's slightly embarrassing makes me laugh.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 13:53:02 GMT 1
Long term I think the FA have got to have a major look at how we coach players from a young age. The English Rugby and Cricket set ups had to go through major change to get the roots of the sport right, I'm not sure the FA have the guts to do that level of change though I would be interested if you could expand on what you believe should be the major changes?
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Post by loyalsupporter on Jun 19, 2010 14:09:35 GMT 1
Rooney struts round the pitch, playing absolutely woefully, in the worst England perfrmance I've seen for quite some time from such a talented group of players. He then has the nerve to blame the fans, those people who have saved up for years to pay for their dream holiday to support the guys Disgraceful attitude from him, coulden't agree more
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Post by monkee on Jun 19, 2010 14:16:23 GMT 1
Rooney struts round the pitch, playing absolutely woefully, in the worst England perfrmance I've seen for quite some time from such a talented group of players. He then has the nerve to blame the fans, those people who have saved up for years to pay for their dream holiday to support the guys Disgraceful attitude from him, coulden't agree more he is complaining about the booing, not blaming the supporters for the loss.
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Post by Pilch on Jun 19, 2010 14:39:32 GMT 1
we drew
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Post by SP on Jun 19, 2010 14:39:52 GMT 1
Don't see why Rooney is disgraceful to be honest.
Fans have the right to boo when a team / player perfroms badly, but then player / team has the right to comment back.
The team is clearly unable to handle the expectation which has been placed on them by the media, fans etc...
On a side note, Gerrard needs to start in centre midfield as he is far more effective there & was clearly England's best player out of an average bunch against the USA
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Post by telfordSHREWS on Jun 19, 2010 15:08:07 GMT 1
Mr Rooney - You wouldnt know what its like to have to save up money to fly half way round the world only to be disappointed, maybe you should shut up and let your feet do the talking !
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Post by constantinople on Jun 19, 2010 15:59:51 GMT 1
Surely if the fans are allowed to express their disappointment with the performance, Rooney is allowed to express his with their reaction.
He may have had two awful games but at least he's shown he cares.
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Post by mattmw on Jun 19, 2010 16:32:57 GMT 1
Long term I think the FA have got to have a major look at how we coach players from a young age. The English Rugby and Cricket set ups had to go through major change to get the roots of the sport right, I'm not sure the FA have the guts to do that level of change though I would be interested if you could expand on what you believe should be the major changes? Two areas really - one is that in both cricket and rugby the focus in younger children from 8-around 14 is on training their skills and all round ability, and less so on competative games, leagues and cup competitions. This helps build up the skills of the youngsters rather than rely on their physical ability. When youngsters get to 14 they are then given more intensive training through acadameys and youth leagues. The governing bodies of these sports have put a lot of money into the development of coaches at youth level, making sure that youth coaches have as good qualifications as senior coaches. In English football, a lot of youth coaches (although not all) focus on winning games which tends to lead to the "kick up to the big lad" mentality which you see in a lot of youth games. Also many youth coaches in England have no formal qualifications, where as in Spain, France and Germany many have UEFA Pro Licences. (There are 14,000 UEFA pro coaches in Spain, and nearly 7000 in Germany, compared to about 1200 in Engalnd) Despite all the money going into the Premier league the basic coaching given to youngsters has not really progressed since the 90s. Until we get that basic level of ability into players at a young age we won't win anything at international level.
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Post by mrbunny on Jun 19, 2010 16:44:21 GMT 1
He has apologised now so hopefully this is the end of it.Personally not really bothered by what he said,more angry with his lack of passion on the pitch.
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Post by gingashrew on Jun 19, 2010 17:45:26 GMT 1
Do you think he wrote the apology himself?
Not that I really care TBH.
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Post by jaytee on Jun 19, 2010 17:55:17 GMT 1
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Post by mrbunny on Jun 19, 2010 18:01:49 GMT 1
Well Taylor would know all about failing as a manager and not getting the best from his players.
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Post by WindsorShrew on Jun 19, 2010 18:19:20 GMT 1
Good job he didn't call the fans diabolical..... Imagine the uproar ..precious....
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Post by Jonah on Jun 19, 2010 19:30:04 GMT 1
Good job he didn't call the fans diabolical..... Imagine the uproar ..precious.... I bet there are numerous fans out there who will swear he did
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2010 19:30:20 GMT 1
I would be interested if you could expand on what you believe should be the major changes? Two areas really - one is that in both cricket and rugby the focus in younger children from 8-around 14 is on training their skills and all round ability, and less so on competative games, leagues and cup competitions. This helps build up the skills of the youngsters rather than rely on their physical ability. When youngsters get to 14 they are then given more intensive training through acadameys and youth leagues. The governing bodies of these sports have put a lot of money into the development of coaches at youth level, making sure that youth coaches have as good qualifications as senior coaches. In English football, a lot of youth coaches (although not all) focus on winning games which tends to lead to the "kick up to the big lad" mentality which you see in a lot of youth games. Also many youth coaches in England have no formal qualifications, where as in Spain, France and Germany many have UEFA Pro Licences. (There are 14,000 UEFA pro coaches in Spain, and nearly 7000 in Germany, compared to about 1200 in Engalnd) Despite all the money going into the Premier league the basic coaching given to youngsters has not really progressed since the 90s. Until we get that basic level of ability into players at a young age we won't win anything at international level. You make some good points. Interesting stats re the number of UEFA pro coaches in Europe, I must admit I was surprised we have so few as 1200 if the source of the information is correct. I think the UK has been playing catch up with Europe with developing grass roots structure ever since it became apparent over 30 years ago but progress is being made although it is slow. With regards to the 8 to 10 year olds the idea of mini soccer is that it is non competitive, no leagues, and no results to be published, however some leagues such as Telford ignore the FA guidelines. This year will see the introduction of 9 a side for the 11 and 12 year age groups, so at least they will now be playing on more appropriate sized pitches, rather than hoofing on a normal 11 a side pitch. The introduction of the futsall I believe is also a positive step forward, which I know has been succesful in Shropshire. Ofcourse coaching especially at the entry age levels comes mainly from willing parents who start with the entry level coaching course, and whilst we often read the negative side of enthusiastic Dad managers, there are also many who are excellant coaches and progress through the levels as well. One big concern I have is that schools do not have a sports teacher who is a well qualified coach - infact the football coaching I have witnessed by schools is shocking. This is the one area where the impact can and has to be made. Reading your stats I wonder how many of the UEAFA pro licensed coaches operate in the schools in Europe? Many proffesional clubs as you will be aware have academys starting at the U8 age groups, and of course funding comes the clubs way. Unfortunately it is my belief many clubs, pump the majority of grants received to concentrate on the older age groups, U17 onwards at their particular clubs, when concentration on development needs to happen for the younger age groups. I think Trevor Brooking and the FA have a difficult task, with the main obstacle being able to get sufficient money distributed to reach grass roots and finance a more robust set up and training new coaches to the Uefa levels .
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Post by shrewsace on Jun 19, 2010 21:50:58 GMT 1
PILCH, he didn't have a camera thrust in his face, the pictures Rooney saying his piece to camera can be seen in some of today's newspapers.
They should all trot off smiling?He could have kept his head down and ****ed off down the tunnel without saying a word. His team mates managed it.No 'smiling' required. Nice straw-man argument you've got going there.
More were applauding than booing? Were they? I'll take your word for it, but don't see how this addresses any of the points I was making.
Rooney was frustrated with himself and the result, and reacted badly in the heat of the moment. The same could be said of the fans.
Ultimately they all want a decent England performance with Rooney playing somewhere near his best.
End of.
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Post by venceremos on Jun 19, 2010 22:19:58 GMT 1
Rubbish performance, everyone frustrated, things get said. Forget it, be a grown up and move on.
I sympathise with the fans over there but not that much. They know what football's like and there are never any guarantees. French fans have had even worse to put up with. Spanish and German fans have had bad times.
Most fans should be having a great experience. If they're not, they shouldn't have gone. The guy going into the dressing room is an idiot - asking Beckham what he was going to do about it! Ludicrous.
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Post by Pilch on Jun 19, 2010 23:08:51 GMT 1
when I said he had a camera thrust in his face I meant the cameraman got really close to him sorry if you thought I meant the camera was pushed against his nose
dear o dear
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Post by jaytee on Jun 19, 2010 23:16:26 GMT 1
I meant the camera was pushed against his nose If that had happened to me, he'd have been about 6 feet away.
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Post by shrew4life on Jun 20, 2010 0:23:20 GMT 1
when I said he had a camera thrust in his face I meant the cameraman got really close to him sorry if you thought I meant the camera was pushed against his nose dear o dear That's what camera men do, he has it happen to him every week. And I don't think anyone actually took you literally about the camera being pushed against his nose.
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oranjemob
Midland League Division One
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Post by oranjemob on Jun 20, 2010 9:25:23 GMT 1
I think he's just on a wind up. There is nowt to defend. Rooney did nowt wrong. Hhe has every right to make comment just as those fans have every right to boo...he wasn't offensive, didn't (suprise) swear...just had a pop at the supporters having a pop at the side...both sides are totally in the right to do so... Some England fans are the type who will look for anything, even the smallest of things, in an attempt to have a go at the side. Not sure why but thats how it is...big fuss over nothing, no suprise really... So nice one Rooney!! Now lets have a goal or two on the Wednesday... Wow - a voice of reason. Thank goodness. Regarding the booing; I was at the Holland v Czech game in Euro 2004. The Dutch were 2 nil up and, afer the Czechs pulled one back, totally capitualted. It was dire! They lost 3-2 but, despite the stadium being 3/4 orange, not one boo was heard. In fact, the team left the field to deafening singing. They had to win their last group game to have any chance of qualifying and the fans got right behind them to show their support. I also had the good fortune to be in New Zealand in 2005 to watch the Lions. Thousands of British & Irish fans had travelled (and, guess what - it cost them a "small fortune"!!). The Lions, despite massive expectations, produced one of the worst performances in history. They were shocking and got white-washed by the All Blacks. Was there any booing? No. Was there any of the vitiolic abuse that our footballers have been subjected to over the last couple of days? No. As Stutty says, everyone has the right to express their opinions. I myself have to wonder what good it does - when a vital game is just a few days away - or why it has to take the form of pure hatred. Rooney not play - Don't make me laugh
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Post by shrewsace on Jun 20, 2010 12:08:18 GMT 1
when I said he had a camera thrust in his face I meant the cameraman got really close to him sorry if you thought I meant the camera was pushed against his nose dear o dear Have a look at page 3 of yesterday's Mirror.
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Post by Pilch on Jun 20, 2010 12:52:03 GMT 1
What for ?
if I could be bothered I'd look at page 3 of the sun instead
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Post by shrewsace on Jun 20, 2010 13:27:27 GMT 1
What for ? if I could be bothered I'd look at page 3 of the sun instead If he had to say something don't you think it's a shame he couldn't have given a measured, considered and diplomatic opinion like Steven Gerrard did?
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