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Post by northwestman on Mar 20, 2004 12:58:20 GMT 1
If anybody cares to refer to the Shropshire Star, they will discover an article in which Richard Brunstrom, Chief Constable of North Wales and proven friend to the motorist tries to portray himself as a reasonable guy who is listening to concerns that have been voiced over the use of speed cameras His idea is that if someone is caught for the 1st time on camera doing "a few" miles over the limit they should merely receive a caution and be offered the opportunity to attend a £200 retraining programme. A real bargain and nothing to do with revenue collection eh? Moreover, if you then get caught again by one of the many hundreds of cameras that he would like to instal then all of that counts for nothing and the original points get added to your licence anyway, leaving you with 6 points and £200 down. And this is supposed to be a meaningful response to all the criticism voiced on the subject! Nice try Mr Brunstrom, but I for one see EXACTLY where your priorities lie. If anyone else is fooled by this shabby public relations exercise then more fool them.
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Post by R6ix on Mar 20, 2004 14:18:57 GMT 1
As long as you have private industry like camera partnerships involved, it will always be about making money, do you belive they really want people to slow down? of course not, that would be like Tescos tellin its customers to shop at asda cos its cheaper? they want you to speed to make their profits,so when a fixed camera stops makin money a new one goes up, nowt to do wiyh safety,MONEY MONEY MONEY
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Post by George on Mar 20, 2004 17:30:28 GMT 1
Has anybody heard of anybody who has been caught by any of the new Shrewsbury Cameras?
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rcj1959
Shropshire County League
Posts: 66
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Post by rcj1959 on Mar 21, 2004 2:40:49 GMT 1
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on Mar 21, 2004 2:50:28 GMT 1
Has anybody heard of anybody who has been caught by any of the new Shrewsbury Cameras? They aren't switched on yet they'll put them on on the sly and then rack up the cash
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Post by goindownthewylecop on Mar 21, 2004 3:00:54 GMT 1
If you live in Shrewsbury or even visit/know the town a bit you shouldnt be caught out by those cameras - they're fairly obvious. For the record they are:
2 - in Ditherington (both ways) - near Bus Station/Fire Station
1 - Longden Road - Going away (I think?) from town, past the Crown and the old pengwern.
1 - Mytton Oak Road - going towards the hospital, about 200 yards-ish before the turning for the Hospital
so everyone avoid, or be careful. they could have put them on roads that are actually dangerous (eg- between sundorne island and preston island A49) but no.......
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Post by Stevenelsonfanclub on Mar 21, 2004 11:47:58 GMT 1
There's a camera at the bottom of the Parkway, In Sheffield, just as you apporach the city centre. Its in a section that used to be 50MPH (and is still 50 MPH on the way OUT of Sheffield), but is now 40 MPH. This camera definately works, even at 04:21 and will nab you, even at 48 MPH. I recommend that you take care in this area!
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Post by northwestman on Mar 21, 2004 11:54:18 GMT 1
I was the victim of a mobile patrol on the very same stretch of road (A55) as Brunstrom's daughter was also caught speeding. Can anyone tell me as to what excuse she was able to offer for what is a strict liability offence? I'd be very intereseted to find out.
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Post by northwestman on Mar 21, 2004 12:16:21 GMT 1
Just found out the reason from bbc wales website. Apparently she was caught speeding 20 miles over limit at Colwyn Bay by Sun reporters using exactly the same equipment as the mobile patrols But because the equipment had not been "approved" or the reporters trained in using it the CPS decided to take no further action. So I'm sure that makes everyone who has been clocked by the ex supermarket check out girl in the Telford area feel a whole lot better..she will at least have been trained to raise the revenue!
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Post by Chris J on Mar 21, 2004 12:53:55 GMT 1
I'm always puzzled by threads like this one: if a motorist chooses of their own free will to break a law of which they are clearly aware, why is it someone else's fault? I sometimes exceed the speed limit especially in good conditions on motorways and dual carriageways I know well, but if I don't notice a camera or other check, I can't say I'd have noticed the debris on the road or the kid with the ball. *Puts on tin hat in preparation for replies*
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Post by Stevenelsonfanclub on Mar 21, 2004 13:01:02 GMT 1
I agree 100% Chris, I've no-one to blame but myself.
The issue was, I had even set my cruise control to just under 50MPH to ensure that I wasn't zapped and found the speed limit had changed.
Its hard to believe, but I didn't do it on purpose....
I would do exactly the same thing again, (obviously without the benefit of hindsight) I honestly believed I was within the speed limit!
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Post by mysticmurray on Mar 21, 2004 13:46:19 GMT 1
and the solution to the problem? don't speed
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Post by R6ix on Mar 21, 2004 15:02:15 GMT 1
ok dont speed is the answer, but the annoying thing is that they target the safe drivers doing a few mph over the limit all in the name of safety? do the folk on here who have been nabbed cosider em selves bad dangerous drivers cos the exceeded the limit by a few mph?
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Wrighty
Midland League Division One
Posts: 465
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Post by Wrighty on Mar 21, 2004 16:10:56 GMT 1
It almost comes down to a question of ethics. Is it right that these officers of the law can sit on sneaky bridges/laybys and in my eyes persecute the motorist when i think we all agree there is far more important things for them to do. If north wales was a crime free area then fair enough sit there all day but it is not and has one of the worst crime rates in the uk
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 21, 2004 16:41:56 GMT 1
My gripe is not that people get charged for going over the limit by a sufficient amount but more that the authorities claim the positioning of cameras is nothing to do with revenue and all to do with safety.
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Post by dachshund1 on Mar 21, 2004 16:47:20 GMT 1
I'm always puzzled by threads like this one: if a motorist chooses of their own free will to break a law of which they are clearly aware, why is it someone else's fault? I sometimes exceed the speed limit especially in good conditions on motorways and dual carriageways I know well, but if I don't notice a camera or other check, I can't say I'd have noticed the debris on the road or the kid with the ball. *Puts on tin hat in preparation for replies* TOTALLY agree. I'm astounded by the whole speed camera issue. If you get caught breaking a law, then you pay a fine. Simple as. When people complain about them not being visible, I'm staggered. Do they seriously think that slowing down where you know there's a camera, then speeding back over the limit is an ideal situation. They slow people down, which makes everyone safer. If some are designed to also bring in revenue, so what? Someone has to pay for the treatment of people in car accidents, for damaged lamp-posts and road signs and so on. If you don't want to pay the fine, don't speed. Everyone has that choice.
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Wrighty
Midland League Division One
Posts: 465
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Post by Wrighty on Mar 21, 2004 17:00:39 GMT 1
Like most people i tolerate and accept cameras in built up areas, accident blackspots etc and if caught because of speeding in the aforementioned area, i would hold my hands up in the air and completely accept the fine/points etc. What i cannot accept is that there is no buffer zone or waiver at all. I frequently put in over 40000 miles a year and just feel persecuted. My driving is probably worse now than five years ago simply as you spend so much time watching for anything other than the road. The police will target areas such as the one in Sheffield just because they know it is a sure thing to make money not because of a safety issue. I cannot accept that it is wrong because it is not an issue of mindless speeding but one of trying to catch people out
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Post by dachshund1 on Mar 21, 2004 17:04:41 GMT 1
You could always stick to the limit, mind.
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Wrighty
Midland League Division One
Posts: 465
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Post by Wrighty on Mar 21, 2004 17:34:48 GMT 1
I think if the speed limit was moved to something more in line with todays cars capabilities then most people would stay in line with the law. As it is we are driving around based on the cars performances in the sixties which is completely outmoded. I am not talking about complete derestriction but maybe an 85 mph speed limit on motorways. If i was made king for the day (heaven forbid!) one of the first things i would do would be to actually derestrict motorways (or maybe a 100mph) limit between the hours of 9pm and 6am as when you are driving at four in the morning it is the ultimate of frustration to try and stay around the limit when you are sharing the motorway with no-one at all. And ironically although the motorway is probably at its it safest at around this time you are probably more likely to get caught as driver to police ratio is far higher. All i want is some common sense as I pay enough
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Post by dachshund1 on Mar 21, 2004 18:02:54 GMT 1
Some valid points. 100mph between 9 and 6? That's an invitation for people, especially kids, to go out testing their fiestas and endanger the lives of people who just want to get home. Still, this is never going to go away, I know.
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Wrighty
Midland League Division One
Posts: 465
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Post by Wrighty on Mar 21, 2004 18:06:11 GMT 1
That is true. Novas and Fiestas everywhere. Don't like that idea at all. Again it would be a minority of idiots spoiling it for the masses
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Post by PC Speedy on Mar 21, 2004 20:55:47 GMT 1
Don't speed, the private companies running them will soon go out of business, stick within the law simple as.
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Post by R6ix on Mar 21, 2004 21:17:30 GMT 1
this is why cameras are sprouting up all over the place now, have the roads suddenly become treachorous over nite? course not, cams are goin up cos there on to a winner with them, if these stretches of road were so bad before why wasnt speed humps or other traffic calming measured deployed there before? as soon as the likes of bennets bank cams stop making money they need to introduce new cams to maintain profits,
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Post by dachshund1 on Mar 22, 2004 0:22:43 GMT 1
Like the officer said, if no-one speeds, there isn't an issue.
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Post by stockportershrew on Mar 22, 2004 1:43:04 GMT 1
the logic of the anti speed camera lobby is surely that we need to raise speed limits everywhere. Then what? the limit on motorway is raised to 85 and someone does 90 and then says oh but I was only just over the limit it doesn't matter. Mad.
We're completely car obsessed in this country. People seem to assume that once behind the wheel they have a perfect right to do whatever they like.
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Post by guest on Mar 22, 2004 2:18:17 GMT 1
er no we have a right to go about our buisness with out being snared by private companys making money from us in the name of safety? it makes me sick to hear the likes of heather mead sain in the papers that we want motorists to slow down. no she doesnt, she wants us to keep driving a bit faster so her company can make money, thats what bugs me, they dont want us to slow down at all, if we did they would lose money?
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Post by ThrobsBlackHat on Mar 22, 2004 2:28:26 GMT 1
I have never understood the speed camera debate
if you get caught pay the money
they put cameras in places where everyone speeds, hence they get more money, fair enough, everyone was breaking the law on that stretch of road!
I have two new speed cameras right by my house on spring gardens. I remember the flowers by the tree nearby where a man was killed by a speeding car. If it costs me £60 for that to not happen again then so be it
although in a small town like shrewsbury fixed cameras will never work because most of us know where they are immediately, and you see cars doing 40, braking to 30, then speeding up again
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Post by MartinB on Mar 22, 2004 10:19:24 GMT 1
The only time I have a problem with speed cameras is when they are positioned like one going towards Letchworth.
You are travelling along a road that is 60 mph, you go round a bend it's then 30 mph with one of those cameras that faces towards you 100 yards into the 30 mph zone. There is no warning that the speed limit is about to change so unless you know the road you suddenly have to slam your brakes on.
Generally though the argument against hidden cameras is very floored. To me it's like saying "I wouldn't have stolen that TV if I had known it was a plain clothes Policeman next to me"
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Mar 22, 2004 11:32:09 GMT 1
The issue needs looking at clearly.
My 3 points came when doing exactly 40mph in an out-of-town road I was going down for the first time with no signs informing me what the limit was for a large distance. Turns out it was a 30 limit, there was a white van and I was caught.
£60 and 3 points. Fine. Also, over £200 extra for that year's insurance and increased costs this time around.
So basically a £400 fine for doing 10 miles an hour over the limit in a semi-rural area.
When the majority are flouting a law, then is the law still relevant?
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Mar 22, 2004 12:04:36 GMT 1
I got done bang to rights doing 92 on the M54 on the way to Hartlepool last year for the game!!!
Could not complain and was luckey to keep my licence - but its these new one that are put up in frankely stpid places that get me - Smithfield road - i just dont get it - nobody speeds along there during the day when there are pedestirains about, but its there to make the maximum amount of money out of people useing Smithfield road at night as a cut through.
It would be ok if this money was used to upgrade the really dangerous parts of the road network in Shrewsbury (Baileys Roundabout, The A5 Tee junction in Montford Bridge, Meole Roundabout, The A49 and the Road to Shawbury) all of which are a lot more dangerous to pedestrians and moterists than Smithfield Road!
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