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Post by shrewforever on Apr 7, 2004 9:36:31 GMT 1
Anybody notice how well we have been doing since he has been left out of the side? You can have as many headless chicken ,hard tackling run all day all over the place aimlessly players as you like but give me a footballing brain anyday of the week even if he is a big baby and sulks all day........ Exactly the same as Jemmo, love them or hate them I dont care, all I know is you cant do without one of them.
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Post by Young_Shrewster on Apr 7, 2004 10:27:37 GMT 1
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Apr 7, 2004 10:36:55 GMT 1
Were in a hole - last thing we need is cramb back - during half time how many shots did he have on goal whilst training - can you guess - yes 0 - i kid you not!!!!
Darby and Luke no for a bit and hope that this one clicks!!!
Cramb is off end of the season anyway so leave him to rot in the reserves
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Post by dachshund on Apr 7, 2004 11:46:43 GMT 1
Agreed, never want to see him again. How anyone can blame the current predicament on Darby coming in for Cramb is beyond me
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Post by stuttgartershrew on Apr 7, 2004 11:48:05 GMT 1
Would start with Cramb this Saturday me...
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Post by shrewforever on Apr 7, 2004 12:27:00 GMT 1
Not blaming Darby he's been superb lately,just saying we need a creative player who takes risks and can do things the others can only dream about.Personally I'd like that to be Zinadine Zidane but we aint got him and of those that are available to us Cramb is the best we've got.
Same as I said earlier Ryan is the best of what we've got on the right,he's still pretty cr@p but hes the best available(IMO)but the master tactician would rather play our out and out left sided player there,so who am I to argue?
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Post by DRASFounder on Apr 7, 2004 12:30:15 GMT 1
Thing is would u drop Lawrence for Sammy?
We need to be scoring more goals
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Post by shrewforever on Apr 7, 2004 12:46:41 GMT 1
Good point Dras but not a problem Lawerence stays in Sammy on the bench.....
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Post by DRASFounder on Apr 7, 2004 12:47:37 GMT 1
Why thank you kind sir
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Post by telfordSHREWS on Apr 7, 2004 12:52:20 GMT 1
Quinny's ruining players one by one at this club
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Post by pawlo on Apr 7, 2004 12:55:04 GMT 1
Personally, I would sell half the squad to sign lawrence. For all sams qualities, dont think he comes close to lawrence cos for a start lawrence knows how to cross a ball and also knows where the back of the net is. As for Cramb, look at it like this. Visualise our strikers, do you see cramb in a fight or a too too, now repeat for rogers and derby and jodie. For me, jodie and cramb both go for the too too, Darby and Rogers get the fight.
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Post by petetheloon on Apr 7, 2004 13:14:37 GMT 1
The way I see the Cramb situation is that he has said everything we are saying about Quinn to his face a long time ago. and that is why he is dropped. The following reasons have contributed to his attitude in my opinion: 1) He was and is our top scorer this season, and top scorers do not get put on the bench and treated this badly at any other club by any other manager. 2) When he does come on the pitch his performances fall foul to Quinns crap style of football. He is a creative player who plays with his feet. He is not a target man so why hoof the ball at his head time after time? 3) and is anyone really suprised with his attitude after Quinn has effectively ruined his season due to his own arrogance, and has completely demoralised what was a very good footballer at the start of the season? I wouldn't be happy if I was treated like this by my boss. 4) Also how would you feel coming from a first division club in Holland to a conference side in england and not being able to get a look in as well as being treated like crap by the manager? In my opinion Cramb to stay in the summer and produce the goods under a new manager that can see the worth in the players he has got and can treat them with the respect that deserve. and before DDAS get on my back this is not a rant against Derby, but even you pricey have to see what I am saying here is right
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2004 14:12:14 GMT 1
I dont think its about one player but finding a decent striking partnership has been a problem all season. No doubt someone will tell me how many goals the players on the bench last night had scored this season in comparison to all the players who started, but I would guess considerably more. BIG mistake
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Ty
Midland League Division Two
Posts: 144
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Post by Ty on Apr 7, 2004 14:19:22 GMT 1
I would start with Cramb this Saturday as well. He has an excellent scoring record and is probably the most creative player we have. Think I would try a Cramb/Darby partnership, hasn't really been tested, just presumed that it wouldn't work, well maybe now is the chance. On current standards Banim and Rodgers are being made to look average, Rodgers is a shadow of his former self, and was in the pocket of the Telford back-line when he came on last night.
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Apr 7, 2004 14:25:27 GMT 1
Im not saying Cramb might go in the summer - im saying he will 100% leave at the end of the season.
Frakley everone has been messabout at the club this season by Quinn and even more so the forwards - problem is Crambs let it get to him, and has been a) Bad in training b) Bsd when on as sub c) bad when playing in the hole behined the front 2 d) his attitude is poor
Luke has take some body blows to his ego this year with JQs team selection but kept his head down and worked on it - no mouthing off to the press - and hes only 21/22 where as crambs been in the game ages and has such a chip on his shoulder its shocking
For me he would be one of the main reasons (with JQ) for the lack of team spirit - he should be geeing the lads up as a senior member of the team when hes dropped but he moaps around and maons all the time undermining JQ and the what ever the rest of the team are trying to achive
The guy is a problem we dont need - and thankfully we will not have to indure him much longer!!!
If we have a battle on our hands now we need fighters not lazy flair players - Darby and Luke will work given time!!!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 7, 2004 14:29:42 GMT 1
Gp, whilst your criticisms against Cramb have been justified in recent weeks, I find it a little unfair that he gets a big slagging off after a disappointing result which he had no say in at all
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Apr 7, 2004 14:31:07 GMT 1
Well it was in respoce to Petetheloon who "called me out"
I could not let it go - but i still maintain that Cramb is no solution to the current problems in fact a intragal part of the off field problems (trust me)
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Ty
Midland League Division Two
Posts: 144
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Post by Ty on Apr 7, 2004 14:36:26 GMT 1
What would people say our best strike partnership this season has been? Gotta be Cramb/Rodgers for me.
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Post by petetheloon on Apr 7, 2004 14:38:01 GMT 1
The difference between Luke and Cramb is that Cramb has come here from a big club. Where as luke has this to come, and can wander in to any other team below mid table in division one.
But as you say its not just Cramb thats been wasted. But look at banim. In my opinion he has gone down hill under Quinn since his arrival which is a shame because he is a very talented player.
But back to Luke, I'm sure Quinns remarks on certain players not working for the team and trying to do too much on the ball were aimed at him. Because he has been dropped from the first team since those comments.
Luke has kept quiet because he know he can leave and have a great future elsewhere, where as Cramb has quite rightly spoken out against his treatment by Quinn. He's not undermining him in my view, just telling him what us the fans have come to realise
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Apr 7, 2004 14:38:35 GMT 1
Darby and Rodgers - It will work eventually in this league
Never really been given ago with out Cramb behind them in the hole or for more than 2 games in a row!!!!
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Apr 7, 2004 14:42:22 GMT 1
"He's not undermining him in my view, just telling him what us the fans have come to realise "
Dont get you you mean he was telling Quinn that we all want him back in the first team!!!!! Pete even you and the hardcore cramb fans seemed to have given up on Cramb lately - faginy lost it with him totally - hes told me a few different times now that he dissapointed. If you think its ok for players to slag there manager off in the paper and get away with it, fair enough but it does not help and the comments we speak off a few weeks ago have a nice long complenx and enlighteng story behind them which next time i see you i will tell you - which i belive is the reason why Cramb will Definatly not be here next year
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Post by petetheloon on Apr 7, 2004 15:21:34 GMT 1
Have we gone all WWF here pricey I am issueing you a challenge for the B&A world title in a steel cage match. Do you accept?
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Post by grinfish on Apr 7, 2004 15:31:40 GMT 1
I think it is time to try Darby and Cramb. What do we have to lose? It's another (albeit rare) head in the box for the setpieces, Darby can bring the ball down, hold it up, lay it off to Cramb (whilst the backline are busy tangling with Dubba-Dee in a fistfight), and perhaps we'll see some end product at close-range. With the choice of Sam, Lee, Ryan and Mossy available to do the running, we won't need a nippy striker as much, and can save their pace to rip apart a knackered defence in the late second half.
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Post by rob on Apr 7, 2004 16:37:42 GMT 1
Pricey the bias in your post is obvious for all to see. I will once again rectify your mistakes.
Cramb hit every shot into the crowd at half time. You honestly think he was aiming for the goal, when him and Lowe are laughing at the shots balloning into the stand???
Its not a clever thing to do, but just because he is pratting about at half time and having some banter with crowd (keeping us amused even) doesnt mean he was trying his hardest to score, and failing miserably!!!
As for Cramb speaking out, well why do you think he has moved around so much? because he is no slow in coming forward either in the press or in person.
The way he has been treated is disgracefull.
It appears that Quinn has signed the wrong players to play hi system. The players in are squad are the sort that KR would have signed, not the sort to play slow, 25 touch hoofing football. He either needs to change his system to meet with the style that the players can play, or change the players again.
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Apr 7, 2004 16:42:13 GMT 1
Yes Rob hes our Saviour - play him and all will be well - Seriously if he plays at Fanborough it will be a disaster and no question about it. He was pratting about but luke came out and spanked every one in the next - you expect that crap from Lowe he just thick by all acounts like Dunbavin but as for Cramb - hes a senior member of the squad acting like a spoilt kid who cant get his way And i have know Bias againt him Rob i think you know as well as i do I hated him well before Darby arived at this club!!!!
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Post by rob on Apr 7, 2004 16:46:44 GMT 1
well what would you be doing if you were in his position? He's being humiliated, short of going on leave (like Van Hoodonk sp?) there isnt much for him to do.
Its obvious that if Lowe isnt starting Cramb is 3rd in line (and thats just out of the forwards) to come in off the bench. So whats the point???
I dont see him as the sviour, however I recognise that he was more than decent a Crewe scored enough goals in the Dutch Premier, and is our top scorer yet is being treated the way KR treated Sam Aiston.
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Apr 7, 2004 16:53:28 GMT 1
But the ways hes being treated now is all his own fault and he has to see that
1) he was poor for atleast 3 months and 12-13 games prior to this drop 2) he was getting more and more stupid on the pitch, diving and shouting at refs, linos, fans, our players - any body about 3)after getting droped he p**sed Quinn of further by going "public"
Quite what he expects from JQ just cos he scored a few when we have more Hungry player waiting in the wings is beyond me
I just wished he had taken it the way most pros in the game do and some back on form with a message to Quinn - dont drop me - but he got a few more chances and wasted them and now - when he gets a sub run to shine - wastes that as well!!!!
this problem is at leat 50/50 between the two of them and if he wanted to play so much he would knukle down and get on with it as he has so much more class than a Banim its untrue - but theres no commitment and thats primarly what annoys me
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Post by rob on Apr 7, 2004 17:10:44 GMT 1
You say you know a lot about whats going on at the club? Well then surely you must see and know that the players have no respect for Dave Cooke. and that Quinn is in all honesty in the process of losing the dressing room. Like Cramb or not, Quinn knew what he was signing and so did we. Thus its is just inexcusable to come up with all this Crambs a stropey buggers, he doesnt run around much, he's moddy, he doesnt like criticism, hes quick to shoot his mouth off (privately and publicaly). Because anyone with half a brain will have realised that this is what he has been like all his career. It is stupid to start blaming him now, we knew what we were getting. No one complained then. Cramb has started 22 games, Darby 16, and while Darbys been fantastic in some he's been just a poor in many as Cramb has. I've never seen the leading goalscorer be treated so disrespectfully at a club before. If Quinn wants respect of the players, he'll first have to show some respect to them. The same goes for Cramb and the fans. There are a minority (very vocal) who boo Cramb before he's come on, or as he's coming on, or will screa abuse at him when he gives the ball away and then carry on screaming abuse at him even after he has won the ball back. If people/the fans treat Cramb like this, why shoud Cramb treat the fans with any respect. Its a two way street (like the pun ?)
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Ty
Midland League Division Two
Posts: 144
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Post by Ty on Apr 7, 2004 17:21:30 GMT 1
How can he show Quinn he is back on form when he isn't given more than 10 minutes at a time to prove himself? Do we expect him to score a hat-trick in those few minutes he is given to prove he is worthy of a start?
So far this season Colin Cramb has shown himself to be the best striker at the club, has scored goals and has created them as well, if had been first choice striker all season I think there is a far case to be made for us having scored more than we have.
As for all this stuff about him acting childishly and going "public", well to be honest I can't blame him, if I had scored for 14 goals in 18 games or whatever it was, then got dropped for a donkey, I would be very p**sed off whether I was a senior figure or not!
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Post by El Huracán!!!! on Apr 7, 2004 17:26:09 GMT 1
BTW its very good to have you back rob - my work days are flying by with this sort of debate - cheers AS i said its 50/50 in the cramb Debate over whos wrong - i have no love for Quinn (cant you tell) and yes he a general fu*k up - he has brought the wrong staff to the club - it reminds me of mike basset england manager where he brings in a "yes" man and a used car sales man I think that there is one very big reason that Cramb should show us respect and the club for that matter .... we pay his wages - if you told clinats you hateed your job and told them how crap it was - would you keep them cliants in real life - no chance I belive the Cramb/Quinn debate is a obvious example of the problems Quinn has with players - Rodgers, Banim to some degree, Glenn Tolley, Fitzy, Drysdale - he gives up on people -which is not good. The leading goal scorer thing is still a mute point as many of the goals counted for nothing and were not exactly game brakers - unlike Darby at Barnet or Lukes Hatrick against Tamworth. After Crimbo his goals have been worthless pretty much. I do honestly say i could not give a toss if he stay or goes - but as of right now he is doing nothing to reward the faith many fans have put in him.
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